Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by oh2tango, Sep 16, 2010.
query5 is a troll. Try to ignore it.
I can't WAIT to see Rise! Really looking forward to it.
Our skating club is having a pizza party beforehand. Not sure how I'm gonna handle being the only one with a tie to RISE as I am the oldy moldy whose coach was coached by Bill Swallender. Let me tell you; so many lives were affected by this tragedy - that Detroit Skating Club reemerged is testimony that life does go on....and that the Memorial Fund does reach skaters in need.
I just bought tickets for mom and I to see Rise this week. I know I'll probably bawl throughout the entire movie but I'm really looking forward to seeing it.
I have to agree with her to a great extent. Why did it take USFS 50 years to induct them into the HOF? I know the Memorial Fund was created shortly after the crash, and there have been plaques, memorials, etc. But the HOF does seem like it should have been done a looooong time ago.
Though in USFS' and the airlines' defense, Im guessing their wasn't much of a procedure in place for events such as this.
I believe such a coldhearted manner of family learning of tragedy-through reporters, or tv, etc. rather than next of kin being notified in a decent manner by authorities was common back in the day. I'm a huge fan of Buddy Holly although he was way before my time-and I was sickened when I first learned that his family (as well as Ritchie Valens and Jay Richardson's families) learned the news of the horrible plane crash that took their loved one's lives in the same way as that of the families of the '61 plane crash victims-through tv, radio, reporters telephoning, etc. I wonder who finally realized how inhumane it all was? It seems from watching the news that for the most part there is some kind of decent protocol in place to notify next of kin before blaring the decease's name all over the news-although I am sure it still happens on occasion. And of course if a plane goes down with someone famous on it-it is likely to get out in the news irregardless of the protocol in place.
But at the same time, I remember reading a story about how Tenely's father and two other members of the USFSA went to Maribel's mother's and Little Marible and Laurance's grandmother's house to tell her the news personally, even providing a seditive to ease the pain.
So with that in mind, why weren't the other families extended the same courtesy?
Deleted because I found the information I was looking for.
I assume because the Vinson Owen family members were the most prominent/well-known/"elite" of the people who died in the crash?
Another excerpt from the Hersh article (Vivian and Ron Joseph won the U.S. pairs bronze in 1964):
For knowing the team, you inspire me. I would like to know more about Doug Ramsey and Greg Kelly, somebody said that they were a pre-cursor to Great American jumpers like Tim Goebel but the artisty of Paul Wylie.
I would be grateful for anything that you feel appropriate to share with us, about those you knew.
Found the article (Boston Globe, 12/20/2000): http://www.boston.com/sports/packages/usfigureskating/stories/122900_shattered_dreams.htm
This was the 2nd of a series of 4 Boston Globe articles on the plane crash (definitely worth reading or re-reading) -- links can be found at the bottom of this page: http://www.frogsonice.com/skateweb/history.shtml
Thanks for the links to all of the articles, Sylvia. Very heart-rending.
For those in the Chicago area who get the Chicago Tribune, you should still read the story at the Tribune link Sylvia provided. The paper edition edited out portions of the article, including most of what Sylvia quoted.
Gertrude Vinson was in her 80s at the time. Dr. Albright and others visited her as a friend, not an official delegation. It would have been impossible for them to personally convey news to families across the country. Other members of local clubs tried to break news gently to family members, but in some cases, the timing just didnt work. For example, the Broadmoor Club president made arrangements to visit Myra Westerfield with a doctor, but unfortunately a reporter called her home first. A lot of information is contained in Patricia Bushman's incredibly researched and detailed book, Indelible Tracings.
Speaking to those involved and reading about the crash, it is apparent a great many people did the very best they could under extremely difficult circumstances. One USFSA member, Ken Kelley, visited the crash site, identified the bodies, and negotiated with Sabena to transport remains home. It is a sad fact that when a commercial plane crashes, families (especially 50 years ago) often hear of the accident via radio, reporters, etc.
Good Denver Post article today (2/13) with a focus on "The Broadmoor Eight" who died in the plane crash: http://www.denverpost.com/olympics/ci_17375048
On the notification of family members -- it wasn't uncommon for family members to be notified by reporters. The NY Times recently ran a set of articles on the 1960 midair jetliner collision over NYC, and you'll see the same kinds of notification there --
http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...dex.html?scp=1&sq=plane crash Brooklyn&st=cse
Maybe worse -- one little boy survived terribly burned for a day or so, and his family was back in Chicago. I can't imagine how that must have felt.
Did anyone else happen to catch Outside the Lines on ESPN this morning? They did a beautiful feature about the 1961 crash and talked about the skaters, coaches, and officials who were lost along with promoting the movie this coming week. I can't remember who all they talked to but I know Dick Button and David Jenkins (I think) were two folks who gave interviews. It was a wonderful story and I was kind of surprised to see ESPN tackle something like this since they usually stick to the more 'popular' sports. If this story is any indication, I'm going to need an entire box of Kleenex during the movie.
Thanks -- I forgot about this. Was it 7 minutes long? Link to the video posted on ESPN's site: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6118093&categoryid=3286128
ESPN "Outside the Lines" home page: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/otl/index
I missed it and I would have loved to have seen it, is there any way to watch it online and watch it elsewhere? Feel free to drop me a line.
I saw it , Heather, and I did cry. You're right about the film.
Yes! Why indeed. No wonder some of the victim's relatives are still bitter. Who could blame them?
I read that story about Mrs. Gertrude Vinson too somewhere-I think someone posted a link here. I could not for the life of me fathom how the elderly Mrs. Vinson went on after losing her child and grandchildren-but it seems she did. I read in one of the links that that courageous lady would continue to go to the rink. She must have been one tough tough lady. Does anyone know if she had any other relatives to help her through her grief? Siblings? Cousins?
Such a horrific task he took on-a selfless and courageous act on Mr. Kelley's part. And in the days before DNA. I read (again in one of the links) that one of the fathers of the victims (Stephanie Westerfield's father I think?) also assisted in identifying the remains of the Americans.
The feature is at fsvids.
re. Mystery of Tim Brown's 1961 Nationals free skate ending:
I've since received and read Indelible Tracings. The author describes this bizarre incident in detail and even refers to interviews with others competitors who witnessed it. Brown was very ill, most likely due to altitude. Although ever-unpredictable, he had NEVER before purposely ended a competitive routine by jumping onto "dry land". The author confirms what I observed and described about the CBS telecast -- that Brown immediately ran off into the locker room and was followed by the nurse. We now know that he was gasping for oxygen and, in fact, passed out in the men's locker room, hence never bowing to the audience and judges. This was at altitude, after all.
A former Worlds medalist, Brown decided to not be a part of the US team to N.Ams and Worlds, and went back to his medical studies. Hence, he didn't die in the Sabena crash.
p.s....since it is not being very well publicized here: With my copy of Indelible Tracings, I received a little slip of paper letting me know of the publication of a companion photo album by the same author, titled Indelible Images. WOW - please note that there are two 'indelibles' to be purchased, Indelible Tracings for the story and Indelible Images for the photos/scrapbook memories. Order your copies of the limited-print photo album (via USFSA or amazon.com) before they run out.
Here's a link to the photo-album (coffee-table format) book:
Costs $35 + postage. Not many copies remian...only being sold in Amazon through one independent seller, that I can see. USFSA may have more copies; did not check there. Got mine via Amazon.
Thank you for the heads up! I was about to order "Indelible Tracings" but I had no idea there was a companion piece!
That's what I thought. Had I not seen the little slip of paper tucked inside my copy of Indelible Tracings, I wouldn't have known about Indelible Images. My first thought was to quickly share with y'all!
You can also order it through the author's own site:
Thanks again! And already ordered!
I've not seen this shared.
Features the Colorado Springs skaters; and the recent event at the World Figure Skating Hall of Fame:
The RISE1961 facebook page has a link to it as the top entry:
Separate names with a comma.