Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Maofan7, Mar 19, 2013.
I'd be very much interested in reading it !
So would I and I think it'd be a help for many people to understand the history of the sport better. Watching skating competitions from the past decades would become better if one could understand why skaters were judged a certain way. The rules keep changing and you can't find every peace of information, so it would be easier to find if there would be one complete source of correct information.
Thanks for the info, floskate.
This is what I'd like to know--before COP, was there ever "detailed" scoring in the technical mark of a non-figures segment, or just a single score from each judge? E.g., Skater A gets a 5.4 for technical merit, don't bother to ask why.
This is an interesting one. There was a book - hate to suggest maybe Brennan? - that showed a judges notes from a US Nationals IIRC. They made notes of all elements completed and scored based on the content. However there was no adding up of elements whereby a 7 triple ladies program complete with centred spins and a quick step sequence = 5.9. I do remember lots of cryptic comments from commentators saying that a skater wouldn't get 'full credit' for an element if it was 2footed or not totally clean, but it was never made clear how this actually came about.
Thanks--that's helpful, floskate.
I personally think there should be someone who officially enumerates all the elements for the judges to see, BUT I don't think there should be any points explicitly added up on paper. I think the judges should each look at the list of elements completed and give out a technical-merit mark that is not an absolute mark but a relative one. Under the current system, the judges can't see the forest for all the trees, it seems. However, it seems that it's fairly straightforward for judges to decide, "OK, Skater C was better in technical merit than Skater E, but not better than Skater B, etc."
Try anyway. Please! I can't think of anywhere where there is a history of judging and how it worked, except for a quick paragraph in one of the 1990s books (Brennan?) that covered the basics of 6.0. I think it went over the Nancy/Oksana outcome, but that was all.
Truer words were never spoken. I have a looooong list of people I want to interview, and wish I had the resources (time/money) to do it weekly instead of monthly. (The PSA Conference is here in May, and I'm getting as many people as I can while they are here). If you have contact information on anyone, I'm glad to take it and do my best to get an interview done.
Bumping this thread to share some rare documentary footage of Zsu Zsu Almassy (HUN) who finished 5th at these Olympics
sbanet has kindly provided a summary of her background and the content of the videos:
Zsuzsa Almassy, stats:
Born: October 8, 1950 in Budapest, Hungary
Coaches: Arnold Gerschwiler, Laslo Nagy
Olympic fifth place (1972)
Olympic Rank 6 (1968)
World Cup 3rd place (1969)
World Championship 4th place (1972)
World Championship fifth place (1970)
Placed second European Championship (1971)
placed third two-time European champion (1967, 1970)
three-time European champion placed fourth (1968, 1969, 1972)
European Championship 6th place (1966)
Universiade winner (1970)
Hungarian champion (1964, 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1972)
The first clip "Zsuzsa Almassy, in 1972 and in our day": (Modern segment is late 1990s or early 2000's?). The skating footage is Zsuzsa's free program from the 1972 Olympics. Aside from minor mistakes it is successful, she places 5th overall. Typical post-program interview, i.e. Zsuzsa loves to compete, especially in a field that includes the best skaters in the world.
Background: After her competitive career, Zsuzsa spent a year in the USA with the Ice Capades, then back to Budapest, Hungary where she earned a degree in Mechanical Engineering via the Technical University. However, Zsuzsa doesn't become an engineer, instead she starts up a coaching career in a small city near Zurich, Switzerland. There she meets her husband Laszlo Pauli, who is also an athlete. They have twin daughters, Judit and Sabine, born in 1982. Zsuzsa acquires dual citizenship, works in Switzerland and Hungary.
The modern segment shows Zsuzsa's pretty, young-adult daughter skating a routine in one of Zsuzsa's vintage "Csardas" costumes. She also helps her mother coach a group of young (Swiss) children.
Zsuzsa is asked about her involvement with synchronized skating - i.e. how and why that came about. She smiles and explains that to be a single's skater it's ruthless - just you alone against everyone else... When her 6 year old twins first started to compete, one wins a silver medal, and the other got nothing. Zsuzsa realizes that the girls could perpetually be at each others' throats for the top spot, or that one could win everything while the other just places in the field - situations she did not want, neither as their mother, nor their coach. At 7-8 years of age she introduced the girls to ice dance, but even better was to participate in synchronized skating as well. In synchro it's "everyone against everyone" - very social with the skaters all working together for the team.
The second video, "Zsuzsa Almassy - portrait" is fairly recent - it's January 2014, and Budapest is hosting the 2014 European Championship. Zsuzsa attends the opening of the Hungarian Figure Skating History exhibit at the Museum of Sport.The outdoor clip is at the the huge outdoor skating ring in the city park. It is where the old competitions used to be held, and it's still a top spot for recreational skating and city events. Zsuzsa also goes back to her former school where in winter the courtyard would be flooded to make an ice ring. She reminisces about her upbringing, her intense "skate mama", her competitive career, (she struggled to keep her weight down and dealt with early osteoporosis), her years of coaching, working with her daughters, mentoring skaters and younger coaches such as Beata Vilagos. There are also impressive achievements as a consultant/coach with Hungarian synchro championship teams in Szekesfehervar and Miskolc. She also talks about retirement, and her internal need to stay physically active...
Thank you, sbanet,
Bumping this thread to share some new finds!
Patrick Pera: (France) 1972 Olympic LP
Ondrej Nepela (Czechoslovakia) 1972 Olympic LP
Bumping this thread, again.
Rare Japanese footage:
Great footage! Thanks
Thank you for posting this! I loved the coverage of Trixi Schuba's figures, especially the close-up of her feet.
Me too!!! Trixie is so steady. You can tell Trixie knows she is cutting a picture into the ice with her blades and the traveling from here to there is secondary, which is very different from freeskating.
1A+2Lo+2S combo at 2:05 -- double half loop!