Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, Feb 18, 2013.
That is great news! I hope that she gets it.
I hope she is able to get citizenship too.
I'm impressed she learned the language. And I agree with her- it probably would be better to train in Lithuania as far as citizenship is concerned, but I doubt they would be at the level they were at if they did.
Since they have the spot now, hopefully the country reconsiders. Not allowing her citizenship would deny one of their citizens the opportunity. I have always been baffled by countries that choose to not use their spots.
For the team event, the pairs free programme will be skated on the same evening as the short dance and ladies short (immediately following, in fact). Since only 5 pairs get to skate the free programme, and since those five pairs are chosen based upon the cumulative scores of all of the short programmes, then the five pairs who will *not* skate their free programme will only find out at the last minute, right? I know that some pairs can bank on skating their free programme, but I'd imagine that a couple or a few would be on the bubble, waiting to hear the dance and ladies results, no? Or am I completely misinterpreting things here?
Copying over this relevant post from the WTT thread:
From the 2014 Olympics Qualifying System document: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=4263
Sylvia, I wasn't clear: I meant the deadlines for substitutions for the individual events after the team event. We've been tossing out two scenarios:
A) What if a country has one an established skater who would like to comeback for the team event only? Could that nation declare the skater as one of the participants, only to have the skater withdraw from the individual event after the team event is over, with the substitute participating in the individual event? Since Rochette expressed interest in the team event only in an interview, this was why Rochette was mentioned (although with the assumption Canada had one spot).
B) What if the country has a single spot in a discipline and a skater who doesn't want to be in the team event? Could that skater be the alternate who skates the individual event after substituting for the skater who skated te team event?
ISU Communication No. 1791 - ENTRIES/PARTICIPATION 2014 OLYMPIC WINTER GAMES (OWG) for SINGLE & PAIR SKATING/ICE DANCE was published today: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=4459
The Announcement for Nebelhorn Trophy (Sept. 25-28, 2013 in Oberstdorf, Germany) is online - it's the "ISU designated Senior International Figure Skating Qualifying Competition to fill the remaining open entries for the XXII Olympic Winter Games in Sochi, Russia for Men, Ladies, Pairs and Ice Dance": http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=4453
I've started a separate thread in GSD for the 2013 Nebelhorn Trophy Announcement: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/sho...nline-(Olympic-qualifying-amp-Senior-B-comp-)
Countries which have qualified in all disciplines:
USA: 3 Ladies, 2 Men, 2 Pairs, 3 Dance
CAN: 2 Ladies, 3 Men, 3 Pairs, 3 Dance
RUS: 2 Ladies, 1 Men, 3 Pairs, 3 Dance
FRA: 1 Ladies, 2 Men, 2 Pairs, 2 Dance
GER: 1 Ladies, 1 Men, 2 Pairs, 2 Dance
Countries which have qualified in three disciplines:
ITA: 2 Ladies, 2 Pairs, 2 Dance
CHN: 2 Ladies, 1 Men, 2 Pairs
Countries which have qualified in two disciplines:
JPN: 3 Ladies, 3 Men
SWE: 1 Ladies, 1 Men
UKR: 1 Ladies, 1 Dance
EST: 1 Ladies, 1 Men
GBR: 1 Ladies, 1 Dance
Countries which have qualified in one discipline:
KOR: 3 Ladies
SVK: 1 Ladies
KAZ: 2 Men
ESP: 2 Men
CZE: 2 Men
UZB: 1 Men
BEL: 1 Men
AUT: 1 Men
LTU: 1 Dance
AZE: 1 Dance
This will make the team event interesting. It might be a good year to be an age-eligible junior dance or pairs team that's recruited for the team event.
I have few questions hopefully someone can answer:
When is the actual absolute deadline for competitors to be named?
When will we know the final list of competitors?
Are alternates allowed to be entered?
According to the ISU there are at least two deadlines:
January 11, 2014: Entry by Name forms (see attached) must be sent by all NOCs/Members which have been allocated an entry to the OWG, including those with remaining stand-by entries, and be received by the ISU Secretariat only, no later than January 11, 2014. In the case that not all NOCs/Members use their full quota of entries and the available entries are reallocated to NOCs/Members with remaining stand-by entries, the NOCs/Members receiving these reallocated entries will be informed by the ISU Secretariat by January 20, 2014.
January 27, 2014: SOCHI Entry by Name forms must be submitted by all NOCs/Members which have been allocated an entry to the OWG. These forms must be sent by NOCs and received by SOCHI no later than January 27, 2014 according to their instructions and a copy also sent to the ISU Secretariat. After this date, in principle no entries can be transferred from one NOC/Member to another NOC/Member.
Based on this, the nominations are being reported twice. Can a NOC (national Olympic committee) change entry with the second reporting or the first one is binding? In other words, can a federation (or NOC) change its initial nomination based on EC? I read that there are some countries basing their final decision based on the EC. I am not sure if this is possible.
Direct link to ISU Communication No. 1839 - OLYMPIC WINTER GAMES 2014 ENTRIES/PARTICIPATION FIGURE SKATING TEAM EVENT: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=5038 (PDF)
There is a sentence that refers to the "final entry deadline (January 27, 2014)."
Communication No. 1839 states:
Thank you Sylvia,
does that mean the the NOC can name competitor "a" by the 11/1/14 and competitor "b" on the final entry?
Or will they simply send a alternate in case they change their minnds?
I looked around and could not find any details on the athlete replacement policy.
If someone gets injured after the short and they are that country's only skater in the discipline is the country then out of luck?they just lose all the points? Like if Plushenko skates SP, then gets injured and cannot skate long, will Russia just forfeit the points for the men? That really stinks bc although unlikely you basically ruin the team's chances if you get injured between SP and LP.
What if the country has 2 entrants but the country did not specify before? Like suppose Ashley was planning on skating both short and long. She gets hurt after SP. can they make a last minute subsitute for Gracie? I don't think they can, bc replacements can only be named up to Feb 5 and they may have already planned to split up two of the other disciplines. If you are the sole skater for your discipline I think you have to skate if you skated sp or you would lose the points.
Does anyone know if the entire figure skating delegation from the country gets a medal if the team medals, or is it just those skaters who actually skate one day or the other in the team event?
They have in every other Olympic year, and the US and Canada have announced their team later than the early deadline.
If they still have skaters for the other three disciplines, then yes. If they only have skaters for one or two disciplines, then they have to withdraw from the TE. The Announcement doesn't say whether the next team in line moves into the Final, but this would be logical.
The only skaters a country has to commit to the SP/SD (and the FS/FD, if the country makes it to the final) are the "appointed" skaters, which for now are the Japanese Pairs team and the UK Man, and the skaters where there is only one qualified for a discipline. The rest are committed 10am on 5 February from their roster of all individual skaters (not alternates). With 10 minutes after the final SP/SD, the countries must commit which skaters/teams from their individual rosters will compete in the TE FS/FD, which, by definition, is the lone skater in any discipline where they've qualified one. The countries can decide up to the last minute into which disciplines (where they've qualified more than one) they will substitute one, two, or none. They can make this decision strategically based on which countries will be in the Final.
Only the people who participate in the TE receive medals. There is no "bench" for the TE. The question raised earlier is whether any SD/SP participants who don't also skate the FD/FS will be awarded their medals on ice after the conclusion of the event.
If Plushenko is injured between SP and FP of team event...Russia takes a '0' in the Men's FP..not hugely damaging because Plushenko would in likelihood have been 3/4/or 5th anyway.
Re substituting for Ashley in the above example...once they name the FP skater ( 10 minutes after the final SP discipline result)...that skater must skate the FP or they take a '0' in the FP
If after 5 February 10am, when the SP/SD athletes are named any athlete named to the SP/SD cannot compete, the team gets "0" points for the discipline.
If after the FS/FD skaters/teams are named, and any can't compete, the team gets "0" points for the discipline.
If there is only one skater/team qualified for a discipline and that skater/team cannot compete the FD/FS (can't even be named), the team gets "0" points for the discipline.
If after 10 February 10am, any of the individual discipline athletes can't start/complete the SD/SP/FD/FS, the spot is gone, and fewer skaters complete the individual events.
A "0" in the Men's event could kill Russia's chance for the gold or silver and possibly drop them off the podium if another country overachieves. A "6" in the Men's event for 5th place does not; a third place in the Men's gets 8. For the medals, it's most likely down to RUS, CAN, and USA, and the only thing that matters is the relative placement between these three countries. Were two of Takahashi, Joubert, and Han to beat the USA, CAN, and RUS Men in the FS, it wouldn't impact the standings at all. It's all about skaters getting in between the teams competing for the medals and becoming spoilers, and that goes for the teams that won't make it into the finals. RUS would want Kostner, for example, to put points between Sotnikova or Lipnitskaia and the USA Ladies skater, even if she only skates the SP, and either Chinese team to put points between V/T or B/L and USA and CAN Pairs. CAN would love for C/L to beat B/S or I/K, putting room between them and RUS, or for the JPN Man to come in second to Chan and put points between CAN and RUS and USA, etc.
Thanks for this info. If that is the case, then I wonder what the other Russian teams feel about Plushenko. He has to skate both a short and a long and if he gets injured, it seems like that would kill Russia's chances to put someone in there with a known risk. Needless to say, it is a little risky to put him in, though Plushenko is such a competitor, he probably would skate as long as he could walk! Seriously, if someone was injured it would be better to go in and just skate around the rink than to withdraw. At least you would get a few points for last place instead of 0.
Of course, this can happen to anyone, but the way it is set up is that a team's hope is destroyed if one member gets injured between the long and short. Countries that have 2 entrants per discipline can deal with it better.
Yes, in terms of completing the TE, but not necessarily in terms of the individual events. For example, if there is one medal contender and one weaker Pair, and the Pairs individual event starts two days later, if a member of the weaker Pair is injured between the SP and FS, the medal contender might be at a disadvantage competing in the TE so closely to the individual Pairs event, especially if the Pair also skated in the SP.