Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Iceman, Dec 26, 2011.
Oh, can't wait for the comments that will come out of that one... Remember people, all Nationals are inflated.
Really great accomplishment considering many of the titles were won during the era of Yagudin, Urmanov, and Abt. Who else has won as many National titles in a relatively deep field? Kwan has 9 also.
Apparently those biased Canadian judges are very influential everywhere
Why does Plushenko always look like he is groping himself
It's amazing what he has done, it just shows you can still pull off quads and 3A's well into your late 20s and after countless surgeries. Plushy is awesome, it's so nice to have a skater who loves this sport so much.
Take that to the haters
The Russian Federation always preferred Plushenko to Yagudin.
because he can
Like a dog that can lick its own privates?
The absolute confidence that he exudes while skating is incredible. You can just feel that he KNOWS he can pull off incredible skating. I love Evan, so please don't take offense, but the fact that EP literally did NOT skate competitively for four years and still did so well at the last olympics, spoke volumes to me. Wow! I'll be glued to the tv if he's in the competitive mix again. I've missed him.
EP is one of my favorite male skaters. I love the artistry of Weir, but also love the absolute total confidence of EP's skating. Quad, triple, double combos are extremely underrated. He's an unreal athlete and such a charismatic skater on the ice...PS: I liked Dick Button as a commentator. Why isn't he on tv anymore? (It seems like I only hear him at the Olympics or something...??)
Three thoughts: (1) Gee, I really needed to hear this music one more time! (2) Ever try holding a landing edge? (3) If the tech specialist gave Plushy credit for the two jumps he did after landing the 3Lz, doing a LFO 3-turn, then putting the right foot down, I am going to personally go to Russia and strangle him/her.
Come on, like him or not, but to skate like that after so long without competing is awesome.
It hasn't been *that* long.....
He's never been my cup of tea. But...
--I think he's part cat. Which seems an unfair advantage.
--If he skates clean with quads and Chan does his zamboni butt thing at Worlds and beats him...the proverbial stuff will hit the fan from the Russian fed.
I don't particularly care for his skating style or most of his programs, but this is a sport that takes a real toll on people physically and emotionally and I definitely admire his ability to compete at a top level for so long. He's definitely a star, and skating is always better when it has strong stars and personalities.
I agree. Good for him. He is good for the sport, and therefor I am glad for his success today. I'm also glad Voronov is back. I don't know why I like the kid-even with that hideous costume. But he has really pretty eyes and a lovely body. Glad he had a good day.
Tried to watch both Plush and Voronov's FP, and managed most of V's but had to give up after Plushy's great jumps. Got bored...sorry.
Russian Figure Skating Championships
1997 Moscow Ilia Kulik Alexei Urmanov Alexei Yagudin
1998 Moscow Ilia Kulik Alexei Yagudin Evgeni Plushenko
1999 Moscow Evgeni Plushenko Alexei Yagudin Alexei Urmanov
2000 Moscow Evgeni Plushenko Alexei Yagudin Alexander Abt
2001 Moscow Evgeni Plushenko Alexei Yagudin Alexander Abt
1999 Russian Nationals Evgeni Plushenko LP
falled on the first jump
1999 Russian Nationals Alexei Yagudin LP
falled on the second jump and 1-2 other small mistakes.
can't find SP for both
Evgeni Plushenko 2000 Russian Nationals - LP Gypsy Dance
I cann't find Plushenko's SP and Yagudin's program on youtube but I have the videos. Yagudin had a step out in SP and doubled one quad or triple in LP. Plushy is fine with SP and doubled in LP but had a 432 in beginning.
No LP available on youtube but video shows he did 4T and 4T-3T-2Lo
Alexei Yagudin 2001 Russian Nationals Revolution Etude
Alexei Yagudin 2001 Russian Nationals LP
JMHO, according to the video, I don't think plushy win RN since 1998 till...maybe 2005? because of Russian Federation's preference.
BTW, haven't seen this year's RN yet, but according to the score, seems Plu may rob Authur's medal because of Russian Fed's preference if anyone can tell me did he rob it from authur?
Still has quad and 3A ability!
I miss Dick Button commentating too, he used to commentate when abc/espn had figure skating but they no longer have figure skating on those channels for major events.
You can put away your passport. That jumping pass was assessed as a 3L+SEQ and received almost all -2 GOE from the judges.
Protocol (link courtesy of caseyedwards)
Nah, groping and licking are two different things. The dog would have to be much more limber...
Good for him. Like him or not, trying for *another* comeback, complete with quads and what is still a fab 3 axel, is ballsy.
I loved those golden years of Russian men skating - strong, athletic, expressive and artistic. Not to mention Honda, Stojko, Candeloro who had such striking personalities as well.
IMO, Program Component Score of 93.66 (from a low of 9.0 to a high of 9.75) was a 'little' high.
His transition score is too high, haha.
But he's still amaaaazing! Still one of the best 3As! Great performer, great confidence.
Plushy in 2012 reminds of Kwan in 2005. It's just same old same old and judges may get tired of his transition-less skating.
I'm hoping the international judges will give him a rude awakening with fair PCS marks (mostly 7's for SS/PE/CH/IN with 6's in Transition), much like what Kwan got in 2005.
Programs look rough although he might have added a transition (or two) since Vancouver, his marks were not connected to international reality but his levels look decent , he looks happy , I m not thrilled with the music choices but how can someone have a surgery and throw after some months that 3axel in sp is beyond my comprehension.
And of course he keeps skating while platinum.
Have you read the criteria for PCS? The only category in which Plushenko should receive anything less than 8's or 9's is Transitions.
What? Did YOU read the criteria?
It's amazing that Plushy still can do solid quads and 3A. That's at least an 11 years span and he still has those jumps. His programs still have too much posing and lack enough transitions though; He'll lose in that portion against Chan and Evan.
I think he should leave out the catch-foot camel. He just doesn't have the flexibility to make that move look good.
Ok, then please explain to me how, based on the stated criteria, you think that Plushenko deserves 7's or less for SS, PE, and IN.
Regardless of what his score was (it's nationals at any rate) he deserved to win!
I'm very happy for him and his fans!
Based on the criteria:
5 = Average
6= Above Average
8= Very Good
Do you think that this free skate was more polished and better skated than Evengy's 2010 Olympic free skate? Evengy's PCS in his Olympic Free Skate was 82.80 (which is considered Very Good). Do you really think that this unpolished free skate deserved PCS scores that ranged from a low of 9.00 to a high of 9.75 (i.e. Superior)?
Please point me to the PCS in which "polished" is one of the criteria.
This is what you get with IJS. There is really no measure of the overall impression of the program - the total is the sum of the parts. And based on the criteria for each program component, I really don't see how Plushenko should receive marks of anything less than 8's except for transitions.
he doesnt have anymore the flexibility of Hanyu but at least he doesnt drop the leg from the camel to catch his foot like a bunch of ladies and most men do which is worse to watch.
He would lose to Chan and some more I can think of, but at this point Plushenko has the edge over Evan, at least he showed up at his nationals.
A poster in the RN thread said that she/he would have had Plushenko behind both Gachinski and Voronov (silver and bronze). Plush apparently lost to both in TES but won on PCS.
Those were my favourite years for men as well, beginning with Urmanov and what I saw of Petrenko in retrospect.
I fell in love with Plush when he skated his gypsy program at Worlds - and mucked up the jumps very badly as Mishin screamed. I loved his 'Carmen' as well, and he had a few other masterpieces. But the passion and excitement of his skating in the early part of his years waned when he became top man in the world. His 2006 Olympic title was a coronation - there was no competition - and his Godfather was skated in a cold, calculated manner - without passion and excitement.
His performance in 2010 and now, at RN, certainly testify to his talent and competitive spirit. But he's certainly past his peak and no longer has the ability to "bamboozle the audience with his arms" (as said by Dick Button). His skating looked laboured and slow to me in comparison to his better day. And again, lacking in the passion and excitement. IMHO, anyway.
I think you are forgetting this is NOT the Olympics, this is Russian Nationals. The scores are ALWAYS a tad eschew.
Are you debating his scores or the win?
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