Pechalat/Bourzat move to Shpilband

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by morqet, May 20, 2013.

  1. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah but even after that Krylova said that most of that was because of Zhulin. She said that they had just begun to listen to her and that she looked forward to changing them more the next season.
    Granted they were still great in 2013 but I do feel that their world medal in 2012 was more Zhulin than her.
     
  2. geoskate

    geoskate Well-Known Member

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    Like many, I want to know the reaction of C/L.

    Also, I wonder how this will affect Weaver/Poje. They have probably benefited from having Pechalat/Bourzat as training mates, but perhaps this will mean greater focus on them from their coaches for this season.

    The coaching dramas in ice dance over the past two seasons almost match the dramas from the period of the three great Russian divas.
     
  3. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

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    I think that WP being the leaders in their team will be good for their confidence going into the olympics.
     
  4. LilJen

    LilJen Well-Known Member

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    When Del/Schoen won their only world title in 2008, it was with (in my opinion) one of their most boring FDs. Yeah, they had all the sign language stuff, but it was a very typical, well-worn romantic theme. :bleah: I would MUCH rather they'd have won a world title with their Untouchables FD :) (Although at least they had the Gavotte for their OD that season; that was cool and unlike any of the other folk ODs out there that season.)
     
  5. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    I am most disappointed to hear about this. I hope for the sake of the relationship that apparently meant a lot to Pechelat things can be resolved. I can understand Pasquale being upset. He might have turned away other work because of the French or perhaps put a lot of stock in being the one to coach them to an Olympic medal. Still, I believe that Being cruel or mean was not necessary.

    P/B- It sounds like they are open to Igor's leadership. They are experienced dancers so they probably absorb quickly. I do wish them the best. Igor sounds like he is committed to success. Sending music to judges etc. what a professional. I have met him before and he has a kindness that is opposite the arrogance you would expect. Pasquale would slam a door in your face...
     
  6. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    Your point does sober me while removing my optimism lol. For the record, I have seen them skate live many times and what you see on television is Fabian being "revved up". I'm still excited about this coaching change and especially happy that they seem to be willing to absorb Igors knowledge. If they play their cards right they could be great. They definitely (well Nathalie at least) has a charm that is infectious.

    I'm hoping that Igor has experience working with teams with this type of injury. He will probably be able to make more intelligent training decisions. He strikes me as the kind of guy who is well connected so he might know a medical/sports professional that can assist. How is Fabian's injury anyway?
     
  7. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    Relevant P/B excerpt from the April 19th French skaters article posted here: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/sho...-Fran%E7aise&p=3905627&viewfull=1#post3905627
    Their upcoming shows are "Art on Ice" (June 1-2 in Japan) and "Artistry on Ice" (4 shows, June 8-16 in Taiwan and China).

    ETA this P/B interview (May 8) from when they were in Geneva, Switzerland for "Music on Ice" in late April: http://www.absoluteskating.com/index.php?cat=interviews&id=2013pechalatbourzat
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
  8. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Why are you assuming that?
     
  9. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    I actually love their Piano FD. I'm usually a fan of their more creative work, but I think I'd rank The Piano up there. Maybe not as high as their Frida FD or their Masquerade 2006 FD but higher than their Untouchables FD actually which didn't really do anything for me. I think for me, my fandom of the DelSchoes was less about creativity (though it played a big factor) but more to do with their skating skills and execution. I just loved their soft knees and deep edges. They were incredibly smooth on the ice.

    Anyway, I guess it's worth noting that they too lost the FD in 2008 to Virtue/Moir, but based on TES.

    Creativity and doing out-of-the-box routines are great, but if you're a top team and want to medal, you better make sure their technique and difficulty are high.
     
  10. sk8ingcoach

    sk8ingcoach Active Member

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    A brave and smart decision. It really is going to be a great battle for the bronze. Between the french, russian and italian teams.
     
  11. Cloudy_Gumdrops

    Cloudy_Gumdrops New Member

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    Well if we're lucky, the judges will finally fall out of love with the overrated V&M and D&W, bring their scores back to earth where they should be and we'll get a nice battle for the whole podium. I know it won't happen, but I can still dream can't I? :D
     
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  12. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    If things change to the point where D&W and V&M are battling for anything other than the top two spots and their and other teams' level of skating stay more-or-less the same, then D&W and V&M will go from overrated to underrated.
     
  13. Cloudy_Gumdrops

    Cloudy_Gumdrops New Member

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    To each their own. I've never agreed that D&W and V&M are 15 points better than the likes of P&B (just as one example), but that's what the judges have perpetuated over the last quad. I guess I'm just sick of both and want some massive upsets to happen.

    Peoples used to complain about Ice Dance being boring and predictable in the past, but it's been worse over this last quad than at any other time imo.
     
  14. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    You mean more predictable than when Grishuk/Platov went undefeated for four seasons in a row? Or Bestemianova/Bukin? Torvil/Dean? Even Navka/Kostomorov from 2004-2006?

    At least this time, we have two teams on top who are trading titles.
     
  15. Cloudy_Gumdrops

    Cloudy_Gumdrops New Member

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    Yes, when you like neither team that are deemed the co-Patrick Chan's of dance, it's mighty boring. When it's clear whose turn it is to win a certain competition that does make it predictable.

    So yeah, I'm gonna be optimistic (or delusional depending on how you see it) that a team other than V&M or D&W win the Olympics. That's my right. :D

    Anyway, enough derailing of the thread. I think this is a good move for P&B. As has been said, they tend to make really weird technical mistakes and Shpilband can help with that.
     
  16. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

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    Both VM and DW will have gone undefeated for 5 seasons in a row except to each other! 2009-2010, 2010-2011, 2011-2012, 2012-2013 and 2013-2014!! If D/W continue after 2014 who knows how many seasons! 6, 7, 8 more??? It's not even close! Big deal with N/K 4 point victory at the 2006 Olympics! Now all victories are 15-20 points! Everyone stinks but VM and DW to judges.

    Good luck to P/B!! They are so great.
     
  17. marathongirl76

    marathongirl76 Member

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    V&M are in a league of their own; it is D&W that are totally over-rated. Their basic skating technique is non-existent; they pick across the ice and don't have any depth of edge, and they just skip and hop into and and between their elements. They have no extension or refinement in their movements; their lifts are basic and are made to fool the eye that they are difficult, when they are not.

    DW shouldn't even be even in the top 10, much less World Champs.

    P&B, W&P, C&L, B&S, heck, even that other Russian team (names elude me at the moment), those of the Ghost-hot-mess-of-a-program-infamy, have solid technique. They're not hacking it it like D & W.

    I've always liked P & B, but they always see to falter in big competitions and they lack V & M's refinement. But their basic technique is beautiful, and they always come up with good programs; looking forward to their programs this season.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
  18. BittyBug

    BittyBug Kiteless

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    :rofl:

    Please pass whatever you've been drinking. :summer:
     
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  19. overedge

    overedge Well-Known Member

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    Because I have yet to see anything out of Camp Shpilband that is as interesting as most of P/B's past programs. And if they are going to him to get the big politicking push for the Olympic year, I imagine they have been instructed to do what he says.
     
  20. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    That was in 2010, not 2006. D/S weren't in contention, as hard as they tried, in Vancouver, due to her pregnancy. They should have been on the podium in 2006.
     
  21. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

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    :respec: D/W are excellant at hiding their weaknesses
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2013
  22. lauravvv

    lauravvv Well-Known Member

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    You'd probably be more convincing if you're statements wouldn't be so primitive and massively exaggerated. Now they just show that you haven't really been paying attention to Davis/White's skating, and even to some things in Tessa and Scott's skating. And, what's worse - you are inciting hostility even in people who would probably listen if things were explained to them in a more accurate and realistic manner. I am saying that even though I am a Tessa and Scott fan.
     
  23. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    WOW! Talk about personal dislike. May be you are afraid that D&W may dethrone your beloved V&M?
     
  24. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    I don't like them either, but this is completely ridiculous.

    It's not like they were doing cutting edge work while with Anejlika and Pasquale, either. I think P/B did more interesting programs earlier in their career, but they weren't technically strong enough back then. I'd love to see what they could do with their 2007-8 programs now.

    IIRC, Karine Arribert said in an interview that Shpilband was very positive about Blanc/Bouquet's Grand Corps Malade program, which suggests that he's pretty open-minded about choreo and concepts. I don't think he'll try to change too much about P/B at this point in their career. This is about the polish and the politiks.
     
  25. Carmen Ovsiannikov

    Carmen Ovsiannikov Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this Cloudy_Gumdrops. I've felt that pre Fabian's injury P&B have tended to be underrated by the judges and some/most fans. IMO they should have been closer to the top two and do IMHO have superior overall skating skills to D&W although D&W until this season just ended do have more speed (though they give up other things to maintain that speed) and more difficulty.

    Even if someone agrees that the top two teams belong there switching off titles, I also agree that the judges could easily have kept them there with lower scores. ITA that neither team is 15 points better than a healthy P&B.

    Change for the sake of change isn't great either. It too bad the fans think that the same team winning for more than 2 seasons in a row is wrong somehow. It may be boring to some but for me it's more an indication of how strong technically and artistically certain teams are. I love seeing teams that are good enough to come back year after year and continue to improve and stay ahead of the pack. I realize that puts me in the minority. I hate the idea of taking turns and passing titles back and forth simply to keep up the excitement for the audience. How about really inform the audience about all the ins and outs of icedance. Not give informative commentary only to set it off/counter it with double standards and use of passive/aggressive barbs directed at the less popular teams/teams that the American audience might not appreciate as much. Remarks meant to make the audience think that some teams are better than they are and others are worse than they are.

    T&D deserved all four of their titles although with G&P and even B&B one or two or their titles could be disputed. N&K only won two World titles; they didn't compete at Worlds post Torino.

    Speaking of N&K, they remind me that DenStavs are another team who should have won practically every world title during the 02/03 - 05/06 quad. Looking back while I didn't have a huge wuzrobbed fit at the time, Albena and Maxim also should have won the 2004 world title. Not just because and due to protocol judging but because they had the skating skills, programs and performances to support that.

    I think since Vancouver Igor has gone for the generic connect the dots programs that focus more on tecnical merit and point collecting than creativity mixed with skating skill. Even Carmen was done by an outside choreographer.

    That said Igor has shown in the past that he is capable of coming up with some great material. Why he has chosen to go the route he has is beyond me. Well I guess I can answer my own question. The judges don't seem to mind and are rewarding his point collecting OD's/FD's.

    To go back on topic, good for P&B or rather Didier and the French federation. After worlds I was also concerned about what P&B's placement meant for this coming year even though everyone knew that Fabian was injured. Once Fabian is healthy he and Nathalie are or should be strong medal contenders. Sadly the off ice doings still remain just as much a part of icedance as the on ice skating. In a perfect world I would love to see the day when the skating and only the skating spoke for itself but that isn't the way things work. P&B can concentrate on further improving their skating and getting comfortable with their new programs. If they need Igor to help them gain the placements that IMHO they could win fairly on their own minus the political manuvering then so be it. Very smart move.

    I also hope that Pasquale comes around or at least directs his anger only towards the French federation. He must be aware that it was their choice not P&B's to leave him. P&B don't deserve his anger over the situation.
     
  26. VarBar

    VarBar Well-Known Member

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    Wow, interesting move indeed. I'll be curious to see whose politiks will be more effective next season, Shpilband's in favor of P/B or Tarasova's against them.:skandal Tarasova has never tired to point out that P/B's skills are not good enough for ice dancing.

    It's quite understandable that Pasquale would feel angry and hurt, he is losing top-level students after all, instead of gaining new ones.
     
  27. ChelleC

    ChelleC Well-Known Member

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    Thank God the judges strongly disagree with you.
     
  28. marathongirl76

    marathongirl76 Member

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    No, it's more about giving the other teams (P&B, W&P, C&L, B&S et al) fair credit for their actual skating and ice dancing skills.
     
  29. kirkbiggestfan

    kirkbiggestfan Well-Known Member

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    I was wondering why an Italian figure skating paper would post P/B FD theme on their facebook page, before it was announced officially. Hopefully, the leak does not come from Camerlengo or Scalli:lol:
     
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  30. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

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    Eh I think that Navka and Kostomarov's best year was 2004 and that they deserved to win worlds that year. Their OD to Ain't No Sunshine as well as their FD to Pink Panther were both amazingly artistic as well as well executed. 2005 was the year that they had awful programs because of IJS. That Tosca... barf