Patrick Chan - 300 points total - discuss

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Looper, Jan 23, 2012.

  1. Looper

    Looper New Member

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    Hey there,

    Just finished watching Patricks free skate in Moncton. Just enough performance and room to peak at Worlds. Interested to see people's posts.....:rollin:
  2. vmfan

    vmfan New Member

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    patrick was pretty clean...but can be just slightly better such as the 4t-3t...rather than the 4t-2t he did in the lp....his footwork was pretty sublime tho he might be able to do it slightly better...who knows...if he skates that way at worlds dont think anyone could beat him but you never know...his 3 axel looks more solid, of course probably jinxing him in saying that.
  3. Spazactaz

    Spazactaz New Member

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    No.. what he did was better, actually... adding the 3T onto the flip.. cuz then he also got the bonus for it being in the 2nd half. If he had done it at the beginning he would only have been able to do a double there.
  4. vmfan

    vmfan New Member

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    i stand corrected....
  5. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

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    Patrick is an amazing skater, no doubt.

    The one area I think could use some improvement would be his spins. They're acceptable but just kind of okay, nothing special. His camel positions are not ideal.

    His jumps are gorgeous and he's about the only skater out there that makes those step sequences really work. Beautiful.
  6. Debrah

    Debrah Well-Known Member

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    Totally disagree, his spins have improved a lot, they are very good now, so NO, I don't think he needs to be Ruh, or Lambie,l in terms of spins to make his mark on skating as he is a much more total complete and sublime package.
  7. Rafter

    Rafter Well-Known Member

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    His spins are great. Fast, well centered, good positions. Orser was talking on Ctv about his good spins.
  8. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

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    Level 4 footwork in the free? Though it's worth noting that when he started doing two quads in the LP, he was unable to do that
  9. ltnskater

    ltnskater Active Member

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    If he does what he did here at nationals at worlds, he will not be beat by anyone, no matter what they do (unless they show up with all 5 different quads). This season. He is also riding a wave of momentum right now, and I think that will carry right to the world championships, but i do think there is still room for improvement.

    Quad double toe could be better, he was a little on the heel for the quad, triple triple he did later in the program, the toe could have been a bit smoother coming out, slow freeleg. Tiny things he can iron out. Footwork and linking choreography is gorgeous as usual, but I don't think he has "peaked" with the perfect skate yet, albeit VERY close to it.
  10. screech

    screech Well-Known Member

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    He usually does the combo on the 2nd quad instead of the 1st, IIRC. I think he tacked it onto the first because without it he would have stepped out. He saved his jump by adding another one - quick thinking.

    Yes, his points are ridonculously high, but this is Canadians and for a national competition, he deserved it. We have to remember, he got 93 points for the SP at worlds last year, and almost 188 in the FP (with a step out), totaling almost 281. It's really not that unreasonable when you consider he's constantly improving.

    And... last year at Canadians he had a lights out clean free and won Worlds handily skating almost perfectly. This year at Canadians he had a lights out clean free... will it be the same?
  11. bek

    bek Guest

    It was a beautiful skate.
  12. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

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    any vids yet?
  13. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

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  14. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

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    Not true. He only did one triple toe. He could have done another one.
  15. orbitz

    orbitz Well-Known Member

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    His competitors at World are probably hoping right now that Patrick peaked at Nationals :)
  16. TwizzlerS

    TwizzlerS Well-Known Member

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    At the end of the SP video, they showed Yuka Sato and Brian Orser backstage. I can understand why Brian was there but why was Yuka? Does she train a Canadian men's skater?
  17. screech

    screech Well-Known Member

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    Yuka coaches Eladj Balde (4th place). He switched to her just a couple of months ago.

    I believe they are only allowed a maximum of 7 triples, which Patrick did (in addition to his 2 quads and double axel): 1 axel, 2 lutzes, a flip, a loop, a toe and a salchow.
  18. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

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    No, he couldn't have. He repeats the lutz and the quad toe. Another triple toe elsewhere and he'd have Oda'd himeslf.
  19. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

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    Jeez, 61 points between Chan and the silver medalist. What a predicament for the other male competitors.
  20. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

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    I am not a Patrick Chan fan by any means but when he skates like that he can get a 5000 for all I care. He deserves to win so his score isn't really important. That was a master piece. I hope he can maintain this through Worlds because it is scary to think he hasn't peaked yet.
  21. barbk

    barbk Well-Known Member

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    Other than the landings on the quad combos -- which looked less than fabulous in both the short and the long -- those performances were stellar, and the marks earned. He's really flying through that one foot step sequence in the SP -- very, very impressive. Incredibly intricate and flowing choreography for both programs.

    I hope he skates like this at 4CCs. I'll look forward to seeing him.
  22. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

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    I wouldn't say those points were never deserved for Patrick. 'Cause he's that gooooooooood. When he's fairly clean, it's almost like he's roaring his absolute superiority over everyone.
  23. DickButtonFan

    DickButtonFan New Member

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    He just always looks like he's flying out there, I've never seen anyone skate like that.
  24. Vash01

    Vash01 Well-Known Member

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    I had predicted in an earlier post- before he took the ice for the LP- that he will score over 300 points.
  25. ciocio

    ciocio New Member

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    Great!!!! I donĀ“t care about the score, 300, 400, 500, :D I hope he has a clean, solid skate at Worlds. :fan:
  26. fsfan22

    fsfan22 New Member

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    Max # of triples is 8 with max # of jump opportunities of 8. Quads aren't included in that, but a skater is only allowed to repeat 2 jumps including quads. So, with Patrick repeating his 4T and his 3Lz, he can only do 7 triples and his 2 quads.

    Kevin Reynolds, when skating a clean performance, is capable of completing 3 different quads and 8 triples in his free skate within 8 jump opportunities (3 quads - 4T, 4S, 4Lo; 8 triples - 3A, 3F+3T+3Lo, 2A+3T, 3Lz, 3S+3Lo).
  27. Aaron W

    Aaron W New Member

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    Sorry, I don't agree with the "good positions" part. :(

    I think the world of Patrick's skating and firmly believe he deserves the lofty scores he typically receives, even when he has a mistake or two on the jumps. And while his spins have improved (the speed & centering is fine), I think the positions are average at best. I think his altered sit position is decent and I quite like the back cross-foot spin. But I think there's room for improved stretch in both the camel & sit spin. When he's performing a basic camel or basic sit spin, he needs to lift the free leg higher & stretch out, point the toe, and straighten his back. The line created just isn't as aesthetically appealing as I suspect he's capable of achieving. In the category of great Canadian spinners of recent times, I would group Buttle, Sawyer, and maybe Sandhu at the top, Stojko & Browning toward the bottom, and Chan in the middle. I'm probably being nitpicky here, but compared to the exceedingly high quality of the rest of his skating, some of his basic spin positions just don't quite measure up for me.
  28. orbitz

    orbitz Well-Known Member

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    My major pet peeve on a standard camel spin is when a skater's free leg is kept lower than his upper body; It should be at least parallel to it. Joubert and Takahasi do this. For some reason this seems to be more of an issue with the men than the women, although I recall Lu Chen had the same problem.
  29. Rafter

    Rafter Well-Known Member

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    The funny think is, I didn't think he looked as fast at Canadians as he did at the GPF. Probably because of the smaller ice surface. He didn't have the larger surface to really push it out. I felt the same about V&M and W&P.
  30. DinDonShamu

    DinDonShamu New Member

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    He deserved it ... That's all I'm going to say. For the first time this season I actually got to appreciate the full effect of his LP to Aranjuez. That was a choreographic magic. Saying I was blown away doesn't even begin to describe the effect of that program on me. If he skates like this at worlds I wouldn't be surprised if he received similar scores as he did at Canadians.
    BigB08822 and (deleted member) like this.
  31. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    If he skated like that all the time nobody would have a problem with his winning every event by comfortable margins.
  32. skatingfanfun

    skatingfanfun New Member

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    No, I don't think he could. He already repeated 4T and 3Lz.
    Great performance and he was like flying.
  33. nlyoung

    nlyoung Active Member

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    His camel spin had a really nice layover?? position in both the short and long which I hadn't made note of in the past. I'm sure he is working to improve his spins as well so who knows what we'll see in future from him.
  34. Skate Talker

    Skate Talker Well-Known Member

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    Yes he does continue to improve all element imo, and definitely has the potential for more should he remain healthy. That is one of the reasons why I was so unhappy when he initially let it be known that he planned only to skate competitively through 2010, before achieving all he could - and I don't mean results-wise. The best thing that could have happened was his set-back with the Olympics.
  35. Vash01

    Vash01 Well-Known Member

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    ITA. It does look like he struggles initially (early in the season) when the programs are new and he is trying to add different things to it, and he peaks toward the end of the season (GPF,nationals and worlds) when he has figured it out. I have no problem with him winning with big margins when he delivers. When he is struggling though (now it seems that only happens during the GP series), I like to see the marks reflect that.
  36. sequins

    sequins New Member

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    He's amazing, simply amazing. As some one says I don't really care what his score is no one's touching him if he skates like that and I pray he does at Worlds so everyone can see once and for all what he's capable of. There should be no questions or doubts if he skates this kind of performance in France. Like him or not you can't deny the talent he possesses. He is and could be so dominant it's scary.
  37. luna_skater

    luna_skater Well-Known Member

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    I think what a lot of people don't realize is that "struggling" is relative (not speaking about you in particular, just using your point as an example). All mistakes are not equal. When Patrick splats on a jump, his stroking and footwork is still so inhumanly precise and beautiful that he still warrants high marks. He doesn't fall apart. (And Patrick's not the only one for whom that is the case--I don't have access to the Canadians forum, but I'm betting there were some discussions about Jeremy Ten's skate in that regard. I couldn't believe how high his marks were for the free given all his errors, but clearly something wasn't translating through my television. Elladj's basics are weaker, so I don't necessarily dispute that Ten shouldn't have beaten him, but his marks left me a little :confused:.)

    Patrick's stroking and footwork in the SP in particular was the textbook definition of ease and effortlessness. He could have just been sauntering down the street the way his shoulders and upper body were so relaxed. Still has me shaking my head in awe.
  38. Mayra

    Mayra Well-Known Member

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    I'm not a Patrick uber by an stretch of the imagination but I was trying to come up with a correct adjective to describe his skating and nothing seemed to do it justice. His skating is simply transcending anything and anyone on the ice right now. It's unreal. I feel very privileged to be watching it. :summer:

    Here's hoping Chan, Abbott, Takahashi, Plushenko and Fernandez all bring their A game to Worlds. The men's field is truly something special right now. :respec:
  39. wingnut

    wingnut New Member

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    Scores at Nationals have always been a bit inflated. This time though, probably not by that much. He really was perfect pretty much every second of both programs. The SP might score 95-96 at an international and the LP in the 190s. I'll guess we'll only find out for sure if he's able to do it again at Worlds.

    I think most of all what it shows is that this season he's got a lot of room for error before the next guys are going to be able to overtake him. His mastery over every element in his program combined with the most difficult jump content amongst the top guys has just put him on another level. Anyone can lose, and he hasn't always been the most consistent, but I'd say him repeating as World Champion is about the most sure thing in the sport since Plushenko before the 2006 Olympics. Exciting times though with so many young guys who will be gunning for him over the next few years.
  40. Louis

    Louis Tinami 2012

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    Based on what I heard from :sekret: after the GPF, I expect we'll see much more tempered scores at Worlds -- for everyone.

    Similar conversations to what took place on this board were also happening among officials and power brokers within the sport. There is also the general sense that while Patrick Chan has some great qualities, so do many other skaters. Their federations are pushing this line quite hard and consistently, from what I've heard. Unless one skater is clean and the others all have errors, I expect we'll see a close men's competition at Worlds. That said, if Chan has two clean skates with three total quads, I think it will take a herculean effort to beat him. Takahashi may be the only one capable of it right now.
    agalisgv and (deleted member) like this.