Olympic gold medalist(Ladies) in the history of the World Figure Skating Championship winning

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by figureExpert, Aug 15, 2014.

  1. Meoima

    Meoima Well-Known Member

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    Yes, her postures have declined after she left Orser. I have images to prove.
    This is Yuna in 2009: Perfect posture, isn't it?
    This is after she left Orser.
    And this is Yuna in 2013, more lean forward in the take-off.

    I am saying Yuna does have technical problems, and there are things she did well but there are things she did not do very well. It is the same with EVERY skater in the world.
    PChan, who is one of my favourites, does have a good 4T and quad combination, but his Axel is, let's say, just slightly better than Lambiel who is the worst when it comes to Axel. PChan does have a bad axel comparing to other top men. It's so obvious even his fans have to admit.
    I am not saying Yuna does not do well at both worlds 2013 and Sochi. But it is clearly visible that she was not as good as she was at Vancouver. Why it's so hard to admit?
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
  2. allezfred

    allezfred Old and Immature Admin Staff Member

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    misskarne has made four posts in this thread and I can't find any reference to her accusing an entire country of anything. Can't pay attention to something that is not there now can I?
     
  3. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    huh? the tiny difference... lol! her speed, height and flow are the best in the world.. her 2013 worlds and sochi olympics proved that..

    there's nothing to admit.. after all you're comparing 2009 to 2014.. lol!
     
  4. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    he did in previous posts in other threads.. which you ignored because you have no sense of fairness on this forum at all..
     
  5. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    That video is VERY interesting. While I disagree with its aggressive tone, the slo-mos reveal the truth: both 3Lz were under as was the flip (to a lesser degree).

    But I suppose that argument will always be refuted, because Precious Queen Yuna can do no wrong.
     
  6. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    oh yes she can do no wrong..
     
  7. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    I have a feeling the sarcasm of my post flew straight over your head.
     
  8. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    not really hypocrite..

    i'm having a great time this off season..
     
  9. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    Really? Doesn't seem like it.
     
  10. Meoima

    Meoima Well-Known Member

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    "tiny" huh? :scream: I give up! seriously nothing can be wrong with the queen.
    Bonus about posture in to the camel spin:
    Yuna Kim (2014)
    and Patrick Chan
    And they say ladies often have better posture than men. :huh:
     
  11. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    this is hilarious.. you posted the not so good position of yuna and copy/paste it here just to make a point.. lol.. oh the desperation.. lol.. and he said that he is not a hater...lol!

    why not? yuna is laughing her way to the bank.. sochi will always be known as scandalous and a joke..

    i have the best sporting events right in front of me.. with my country finally qualifying at this year's world cup of basketball later this month.. i have 2 swimming events the european championship and the pan pacs this week...

    and then the nba is coming soon on october! with the spurs just won over miami last june.. so who am i complaining?? :nopryde:
     
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  12. Meoima

    Meoima Well-Known Member

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    Yuna's posture is often not as good as other top ladies, especially after she left Orser, and some men even have better posture. And her speed as well as ice coverage is not better than Carolina, if you really care to make a comparison.
    But well, at least you admit that you don't know much about the rule, and I assume about FS overall as well. :blah:
    So whoever criticizes Yuna for one or just two "tiny details" are considered hater. Now I get your logic.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
  13. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    Perhaps by Yuna's fans. I just roll my eyes every time someone describes it as scandalous. No. "scandalous" was Sale/Pelletier whining until they got a second gold. "scandalous" was Alexander Abt being undermarked just because they didn't like the prospect of a Russian podium sweep at an American Olympics. "scandalous" was Patrick Chan winning Skate Canada after falling on his backside four times. "scandalous" was Patrick Chan being 2013 World Champion. "scandalous" was Yuna Kim's scoring for the last four years.

    I decline to comment on your country's chances of success at these events.

    But yes, the sporting season is ramping up. Soon it will cricket season again, and the Bathurst 1000, and the grand finals of the winter footballs; and soon the new figure skating season will start, an event I am looking forward to with my whole heart and not a great deal of patience.
     
  14. gotoschool

    gotoschool Active Member

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    I just love how Mao is immediately excluded from consideration in receiving the highest LP score just because she skated early even though you admitted that her FS was better than Kim's and Sotnikova's. I assume this is some kind of "Original Sin Penalty," acronym OSP, carried over from the SP, even though numerous posters have said that the COP system was specifically created in order to give everyone a fair playing ground, since there is no upward limit to the scores that are given. Many posters at forums have said they thought the greatest problem with the results were Mao's freeskate placement, so it isn't just me. This result helped tarnish the ISU's image as well. Ordinary viewers who watch skating think these "peculiarities" of the scoring system are unjust or ridiculous.

    As far as what kind of score Mao should have recieved, I don't have the protocol in front of me and I honestly didn't see any obvious underrotations. However just to meet half way, I'll split the difference and count 1 ur (one the 2A / 3T) and the flutz, give her the 3F / 3L (which was totally clean to me), higher GOE, and at least 3 more points in PCS, which would give her the same PCS score she had at Saitama. This would give her 8-9 more points and put her somewhere around 151. In every analysis of protocols on forums I have seen, Mao wins the freeskate. In my view Mao's score of around 151 and Kim and Kosnter's scores which seem close to accurate, would only be reasonable if Sotnikova's score is dropped considerably, in my opinion, around 13-15 points. This is considering that Mao's all-time highest score internationally was 136 coming into Sochi, with only Kim scoring higher (before the inflation at Europeans). By the way, I would give Mao more based upon what I think she deserved, but I am trying to be objective given the difficulty of breaking 150 without the spiral sequence and the emphasis placed on speed and height of jumps. These factors don't bother me in Mao's skating, but I know they are important to the judges. Besides, she has become faster and her jumps are not that low compared to Lipnitskaya's.

    As far as Kim's urs are concerned, I watched the video that people have been discussing here and thought the only clear ur was the single 3 lutz, as riveredge mentioned. None of the other ones seemed to be ur to me. I really think it is better to give the skater the benefit of the doubt. I believe tech calls were ignored in the final 3 skaters as "cover" for the inflated GOE given to Sotnikova and what I consider to be bogus level calls on the step sequences, for example, giving Kim level 3 and Sotnikova level 4, which to me is absurd. The fact that Sotnnikova got a higher GOE in the step sequence than Mao (even with level 4) is also absurd, in my opinion. This doesn't even consider the jumps or Sotnikova's higher PCS which is the most absurd of all.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2014
  15. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    Mao's SP was a disaster. There's no LP in the world that can rescue what her SP was. Not under any scoring system. It's a simple maths problem. Unless you're honestly suggesting that Adelina and Yuna should have been held down so that Mao could win, which would be more ludicrous than anything I have seen a Yunabot say...
     
  16. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    not by yuna's fans.. and i'm sure with that..lol! the fact that you're here...in every thread.. is a proof that you cared.. heck you're here spending and defending what happened..

    as for my country we have no chance to advance but the fact that my country qualified for the first time since 1973, is already an accomplishment..
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
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  17. misskarne

    misskarne #408

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    So it is, and I congratulate them. I remember the first time the Socceroos went back to the World Cup in a long time. It's always exciting.

    And for me Sochi holds more important memories. No Australian dance couple had qualified for the Olympics since 1988. No Australian man had qualified for the Olympics since 1998. Their achievements - that's what I'll remember. They did us proud.

    And Brooklee's layback/catchfoot spin was the best of the night. ;)
     
  18. HVS

    HVS Active Member

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    I have a huge doubt about your ability to describe all above as "scandalous", LOL, except 2002 was a true scandal with 2 freaking gold medals.

    How is Yuna's scoring a "scandalous" I will never know, maybe you want to say she is the legend who is also the most underscored in history, based on FSU poll? :rofl:

    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/index.php?threads/most-undermarked-skater-ever.92224/

    Patrick winning in 2013 was not a pretty result, but really, only die hard skating fans care about that. Media around the word were too busy to praise the women competition and Yuna at that time. Someone even opened an online petition (the same as Sochi) but manage to have a few thousands while Sochi petition had almost 2 millions. You call Patrick's winning a scandal but laugh at Sochi? You are really funny.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
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  19. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Just because she was out of contention for a medal (most likely) does not mean she did not have the right to be scored fairly for her outstanding LP. I can understand why not only a fan of Mao's but any general skating fan would be peeved at her skating one of the best long programs in history and being placed 4th in it. What is most hilarious is how daft you are in general; and how you and a couple others keep insisting only a Yunabot (and I guess you will now come up with some foolish new Maobot term for anyone who dares to express dismay at Mao's outrageous LP score and placing) disagrees with Sotnikova's win and even worse crazy scores and winning margin in Sochi. As if every neutral skating fan would obviously completely agree with the Sochi ladies scores and results (freaking hilarious). When in fact there are many Kostner fans, Kim fans, Asada fans, and general skating fans who may not be a fan of any of those, who were outraged at the blatantly out of line judging in Sochi, not just, but most especialy in the ladies event. And not just Sotnikova's win which on its own perhaps could have been forgiveable, but the blatant scores and impossible winning margin for a skater nearly everyone doesn't even believe should have won, many of the exact sticklers of her scores and others (PCS in LP compared to Kostner, Kim, and most of all Asada crazy, no flutz call, no < call on 2nd lutz, the footwork levels in both programs, many of the GOEs in general). While I think some of the reactions to Sotnikova, especialy attacking her on a personal level, are out of line.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
  20. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Scandalous is something the whole skating world (and even many non skating fans who heard about it) has talked about for 6 whole months now. Non scandalous is things that only misskarne believed, such as the 2 bolded ones. Amazing btw to be scandalously overscored when really only skating in 3 events the last 4 years, and two of them controversialy losing- of course the 2014 Olympics, and to a lesser degree the 2011 worlds. And even in the remaining competition receiving a short program score that had the Eurosport commentators shocked and infuriated. Quite a feat.
     
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  21. ToFarAwayTimes

    ToFarAwayTimes Active Member

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    It was a real disgrace that Lipnitskaia finished ahead of Mao. Both of her programs were a disaster, she's nowhere near as good a skater, and she still scored over 200. Although Mao was most likely out of medal contention because of her awful SP, she should have still had a small shot at the bronze (if one of the top 3 fell out), but that was over when Julia finished ahead of her, in order to get her on the podium if Sotnikova bombed.
     
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  22. gotoschool

    gotoschool Active Member

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    I am talking about Mao winning the LP, not the whole competition. I have already said in a couple of posts that I thought Kim should have won overall but that Mao should have won the LP with a world record score and, in my opinion, 3rd place if the whole competition had been scored fairly. I also said that I thought a case could be made for Kostner winning. Watching her program again, I like it better now.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2014
  23. ToFarAwayTimes

    ToFarAwayTimes Active Member

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    There's no way Mao could have finished 3rd. Yuna, Carolina, and Adelina all deserved to be on the podium.
     
  24. eternitygoddess

    eternitygoddess Active Member

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    I find it a stretch to claim that Asada would've placed 3rd after bombing so badly in the short solely on the strength of her LP. Her LP is good, but she has only 1 triple going for her over two of the top 3, and when all 3 of the medalist gave back to back cleans.

    There would've def. been controversy if Asada placed on the podium.
     
  25. railroad38

    railroad38 New Member

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    Controversy perhaps, but probably much less of one than Sotnikova's gold medal was. As long as it was Sotnikova, and not Kim or Kostner, bumped off.
     
  26. railroad38

    railroad38 New Member

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    One thing to be fair to Sotnikova is to remember even though her 2014 win was a political farce, her skates would have won any other Olympics besides 2010 easily. She was just unlucky (or lucky in the end) to do them in the toughest ladies Olympic event, along with 2010, in history.
     
  27. ToFarAwayTimes

    ToFarAwayTimes Active Member

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    Sotnikova would have finished on the podium in any country. She skated well enough to get 3rd, nobody can deny her that. Mao was just too bad in the SP to make the podium. Only if one of the leaders bombed, and none of them did.

    If Mao had gone clean in the SP and LP, she still would have only finished 2nd or 3rd. If Lipnitskaia hadn't messed up, even clean in both programs Mao would have finished 3rd or 4th because of the crooked judging.
     
  28. railroad38

    railroad38 New Member

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    Lipnitskaya is not a stronger skater than Sotnitkova. Even if Sotnikova needed the Russian corruption and deals to win, being in Russia still would not have been enough for Julia given how strong the event was. There is a limit to how much even Russia can do.
     
  29. ToFarAwayTimes

    ToFarAwayTimes Active Member

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    No, there isn't a limit to what they could do. The figure skating world nearly collapsed for several months, and they don't care, they and the IOC and ISU did it anyway. You are very naive if you think Sot/Lip would not have been Gold/Silver no matter what the other skaters did. Asada could have done two 3A's or 8 triples or anything else and gone clean both programs and she wouldn't have sniffed even a mostly clean Russian skater.

    Maybe you are not familiar with Olympics judging in Russia. See 1980 Gymnastics. Maybe the IOC was more the culprit in Sochi than the ISU? Something to think about.
     
  30. eternitygoddess

    eternitygoddess Active Member

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    Uh...Lipniskaia would've won gold if she skated cleanly. Did you see her PCS scores (despite the falls) and her tram event scores . She would've broken the WR.