Ladies' champion at Worlds

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by neptune, Mar 11, 2011.

?

Who will win the ladies' event at Worlds?

Poll closed Mar 21, 2011.
  1. Miki Ando

    52 vote(s)
    25.7%
  2. Mao Asada

    44 vote(s)
    21.8%
  3. Yu-Na Kim

    82 vote(s)
    40.6%
  4. Carolina Kostner

    3 vote(s)
    1.5%
  5. Kanako Murakami

    1 vote(s)
    0.5%
  6. Mary Ann Summers

    5 vote(s)
    2.5%
  7. Other

    15 vote(s)
    7.4%
  1. NMURA

    NMURA Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Messages:
    375
    I have all ideas about what I'm talking. Moral is one thing and the competition is another. If you're so caring about the suffered people, you'd better write to the ISU president to postpone worlds. Don't mix it, Mr Saint. Otherwise, all posters of this board have to start with "sincere condolences" talks.

    I must say it's very arrogant to pick on other person's morality.
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
  2. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    829
    And it never stops. :rolleyes:
  3. sonya

    sonya New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2010
    Messages:
    6
    yuna kim will win.......................................................
  4. neptune

    neptune New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,952
    She's this adorable farm girl from Kansas who I hear makes a really mean coconut-cream pie. :)
  5. blue_idealist

    blue_idealist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2007
    Messages:
    2,108
    Lol I looked up who Summers is.

    I voted for Ando. I think this is her year. I wonder how much longer she'll stay for. IIRC she said she was taking next year off, but I don't remember if she said she was going all the way to Sochi or not. I'm sure that's probably her intent but I don't know if she ever made a statement about it.
  6. galaxy

    galaxy Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    Messages:
    440
    Maybe we shouldn't be so serious about what NMURA is saying. Remember before the Japanese Nationals what she was saying about Mao, she said Mao was doing it just for self-satisfaction and she didn't want to go to the Worlds, she was skating just for money and Mao was insulting figure skating and so on. Maybe she is an anti of both ladies, I don't know. Plus even if she is apparently living in Japan and has a lot of knowledge of Japanese figure skating, it just deosn't mean she is a Japanese.
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
  7. lowtherlore

    lowtherlore New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    390
    Yeah, right.
  8. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Messages:
    4,891
    I'm furious that someone would even question skaters' injuries as a convenient excuse. I guess that someone would think every injury of skaters is conspiracy, huh?

    omg why would someone say things like that?
  9. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    Glad to see you in safety.
  10. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,004
    Boy, I'd hate to be in NMURA-san's shoes.
    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  11. AliasJohnDoe

    AliasJohnDoe Spin Alissa Spin!!!

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2004
    Messages:
    3,678
    On my perfect little planet-

    Other: Alissa!!! :swoon:
    Angela-Fan and (deleted member) like this.
  12. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,004
    I want to see Rachel Flatt end up on the podium and make her haters freak out lol.
  13. Jenny81

    Jenny81 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2011
    Messages:
    256



    How dare you say such a thing? :(
    Why are you extremely rude to Yuna even her fans?
    As you know, all kinds of injury can happen suddenly.
    Nobody wants to be injuried on purpose.
    I got a huge shock as a Yuna fan.
    It was very offensive as a figure skating fan as well. :mad:


    I wish that Yuna will win at this Worlds surely.
    It's because of you.
  14. NMURA

    NMURA Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Messages:
    375
    Is it "rude" to doubt sudden "injuries" on very convenient timings? Not as rude as someone waving the flag of moralist crusades. Such things actually happen when the pressure is extremely high and a loss could be very costly. In the case of 2008 4CC, Kim had to face the arch-rival with the strongest ever programs before the home crowd. At least, she doesn't need to be "injured" this time.

    She won't be at worlds, anyway. I'll admire her if she has that guts. ;)
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
  15. lowtherlore

    lowtherlore New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    390
    What has Yu-Na done to you? Steal your boyfriend?
    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  16. NMURA

    NMURA Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Messages:
    375
    I'm just presenting a plausible case of Kim's sudden "withdrawal". I see Kim to be a strategic (intelligent + opportunistic) person. She has little to gain and much to lose. There could be new concerns. The judges might side with Japanese skaters by sympathetic reasons.

    When Kim announced to compete at worlds after a few days after TEB, she should have thought she could win even with 3-4 errors. The whole picture has changed after that and the pressure is building enormously high.
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  17. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,004
    Just let it pass people.
    Many people are upset with recent turn of events and some are showing their fangs to completely innocent people.
    Hopefully, they will come to their senses.
  18. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,004
  19. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Messages:
    4,891
    when miki and mao both skate clean altogether, who do you think would defeat the other? consistent Miki? or stable Mao(no under-rotations, no wrong edge)?

    at japanese nationals, unstable mao was about 20 points below consistent miki, right?
  20. Jot the Dot Dot

    Jot the Dot Dot Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2007
    Messages:
    2,478
    So do I, but among other things, her injury cuts that out of the picture. It'll be Mao.
  21. neptune

    neptune New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,952
    "Unstable Mao"? Ah, so that's why Mao was throwing udon at Miki after the medals ceremony! ;)

    Rachael Flatt is injured?
  22. sydneyphoenix

    sydneyphoenix New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2009
    Messages:
    23
    What a shame World ranking No. 2 (Suzuki), No. 7 (Rochette) and No. 10 (Lepisto) aren't participating...mind you, the Worlds may not go on, and some people are making strong cases that it SHOULDN'T. :(
  23. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    So, do you think the injury was just excuse to withdraw? I know it's useless to inform you below but it must be useful to some other FSUers.

    When was the injury begun?
    She felt a pain around her hip at the end of the January, about 2 weeks before the competition (The competition was from February 11 to February 17, 2008.)

    What did team Yu-Na do on her symptom?
    Because she desperately wanted to perform her programs in front of her home crowds, they combined training and treatment together. But it was not improved at all that they decided to give up the competition but tried to focus on WC 2008 planned 10 weeks later. They introduced this situation to the public on February 6.

    Team Yu-Na tried to find the reason of injury and visited some hospitals and oriental medical clinics in Canada. But they couldn't find the exact reason and how to treat. They finally decided go back to Korea because they're not accustomed with hospitals and medical system in Canada.

    What happened in Korea?
    She came back to Korea February 11, 2008.
    Nowhere but to a hospital from airport and she spent all the day to check up her whole body and examine everything.

    She was diagnosed with "Sacroiliac joints" injury and told "3 months" to obtain permanent relief.

    After the intensive care for a while, gradually the pain seeped away. So she skated little by little but she stopped training on and off the ice for about a month even skating itself was hard thing to do.

    At Lotte ice rink, well known amusement skating facility, she started training with Brian Orser. But as you may know it's not the place for any medal contender to prepare his/her upcoming World Championship.

    IS THIS SO CALLED "sudden "injuries" on very convenient timings?".
    Stop training for a month during the season is a piece of cake?

    Be your own judge.
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2011
    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  24. NMURA

    NMURA Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Messages:
    375
    Of course, they needed to persuade the ISU and the Korean federation in "plausible" manners. I can imagine that Kim's situation before 2008 4CC was extremely nerve-racking. There are enough reasons for her to avoid confronting her arch-rival with the strongest ever programs in front of the home crowd. We know that she's very fragile under the home pressure from the 2008 GPF case. The loss would definitely hurt their national pride (which is very important in South Korea rooted with strong anti-Japanese nationalism) and her chance at worlds. It's clearly a little to gain, much to lose situation. Kim is not an ordinary citizen. If someone like her got suddenly "injured" at THAT very convenient timing, I don't think it's "rude" to be doubtful.
  25. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    :blah:

    You can imagine everything.

    I'm not sure who and what programs you're talking about but didn't she beat her arch-rival with the strongest ever programs 2007 GPF at Torino just before the injury?

    2008 GPF was 11 months later and it's just a consequence known.
    Plus, she won Korean Championships, held in Korea, 5 times in a row under the pressure.

    Is that your view point on this sport?

    Strong anti-Japanese nationalism? Some clearly have like some Japanese have strong anti-Korean nationalism.

    Then why did she participate 2010 Worlds and planed to do 2011 Worlds?

    As I wrote above it was not a sudden injury. It was felt and intensified.

    For the convenient timing, she injured on foreign soil, visited hospitals instead of skating club, was diagnosed with "Sacroiliac joints" injury, got an intensive care, stopped training for a month...

    Then why didn't she do that 2010? Even Speedy warned and asked her to participate?
  26. sydneyphoenix

    sydneyphoenix New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2009
    Messages:
    23
    Okay, I usually stay away from "controversial", politically charged debates, but some of your assertions are distasteful in my opinion, Mr/Ms NMURA.

    From what I've skimmed over, one of your main point is that with the Worlds now in doubtful schedule, Yu-Na Kim has a convenient "excuse" not to participate. First of all, if anyone that I know has a plan to go to Japan in near future, I will advise them to reconsider in the strongest possible terms. Earthquake and aftershocks are bad enough, especially for someone who's not used to having them frequently, but this nuclear meltdown, with detection of caesium, takes the problem several notches up, with possible complications that we can only speculate over. Also, if you are to assert that Ms. Kim has a convenient excuse to withdraw, one can make a similarly valid point for any of her competitor-it may take a great deal to get over embarrassment of losing to someone who's taken a whole year off. So for all we know, it could be Ms. Kim's competitors who are breathing sighs of relief (if you are going to take it that far).

    To this 2008 4CC debate-I didn't follow details back then, but from what I found out later, Ms. Kim's injuries were significant and that she carried her injuries to the Worlds in Sweden. You are welcome to your belief, but if you truly believe that she did fake it or wormed out of tight corners without due cause, I wonder why you didn't take it up with ISU and have Ms. Kim and/or KSU disciplined.

    You raised the point about the prospect of Koreans taking Ms. Kim's defeat badly, due to "anti-Japanese nationalism". As I understand it, dislike between Korea and Japan is mutual; I suggest you stop pointing fingers as continuing to do so may open the hell-gate with partisan rambles. Just so you know, in this context, I can see Japanese people taking their athletes losing to Ms. Kim just as badly as Koreans would take Ms. Kim losing to Miki Ando, Mao Asada or Kanako Murakami, especially in context of Ms. Kim's prolonged break from the competition this season.

    Finally, what do you mean by anything short of "absolute win" for Ms. Kim will hurt her career? If I may indulge in speculation, I suspect you mean winning with complete dominance like in 2009 Worlds or XXI Olympics Winter Games. If that's what you're getting at, who are you to say that Ms. Kim have to win by gazillion points to enhance her career (which will be more difficult due to rule changes) while others will have to "simply" win, even if by margin of 0.01 point? Please enlighten me if you meant something else by your statement.

    All in all, no need to be so nasty against a particular athlete. If you don't like Ms. Kim (or any other athlete), you can criticise her logically, with evidence to back up your arguments, but I don't see much of that from you. I suggest you take a chill-pill and calm yourself a bit.

    With best regards.
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2011
    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  27. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Messages:
    4,891
    thanks to Runnershigh and sydneypheonix!!

    it's like talking to the wall forgodsakes..:violin:
  28. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2006
    Messages:
    13,349
    Those rankings are hilarious. Suzuki World #2, ROTFL!! Or Rochette at only #7 while Suzuki is at #2.
  29. sydneyphoenix

    sydneyphoenix New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2009
    Messages:
    23
    Well, Ms. Rochette is taking this season off while Ms. Suzuki had a long season including a few Senior B events...

    I always thought ISU should give byes to the Worlds to recent Olympic, Worlds (and maybe GPF) medalists and top 3 or so in ranking tables (though most of these lists will probably cross-match).
  30. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2009
    Messages:
    2,979
    I think the rank is from the World Standings of ISU.

    Anyway, when is the time for me to do some packing or not for the WC. :confused:
  31. giselle23

    giselle23 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    531
    Why would Yu Na withdraw? While no skater can ever claim an absolute lock on a gold medal, Yu Na comes pretty close.
  32. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    3,729
    How the hell is Suzuki #2 in the world rankings?
  33. BaileyCatts

    BaileyCatts Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2002
    Messages:
    5,863
    She skated a packed schedule and several Senior B events, so got major points that way.
  34. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2010
    Messages:
    10,242
    I'm confused by that too. Miki is below Akiko and Miki's won pretty much everything this season...
  35. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,197
  36. mysticchic

    mysticchic Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2005
    Messages:
    5,537
    OMG quit feeding the troll. If you ignore it, they go away!
  37. millipied

    millipied New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2010
    Messages:
    569
    I guess it is time to change the title to "Who would have won, if Worlds were held?":(
  38. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    7,139
    This is so confusing..Ando and Czisny are the clear winners of this international season for me.
  39. Jot the Dot Dot

    Jot the Dot Dot Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2007
    Messages:
    2,478
    Might be old news, but she was battling a foot injury in December.
  40. neptune

    neptune New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,952
    OK, thanks. Did you kick her or something because she didn't get you a Christmas present? ;)
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2011