Jumps Off Ice

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by smarts1, Sep 24, 2011.

  1. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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  2. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

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    I used to jump off ice all the time. I learned on the trampoline and moved to the ground. I had videos a long time ago and some people here probably saw them at some point. I could do up to a cheated 4toe on the ground and sometimes, when I put in a lot of practice, I had a solid 3axel. I jumped all the triples but the take offs were just ugly, you can't really toe pick without a toe pick, haha, so I usually took off flat footed and often from two feet. It was fun but the axel was always hard for me as I tended to whip around like Lipinski.
     
  3. gotice

    gotice Member

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    WOW, Ilia 3 axel on the floor amazing! His quad toe was pretty darn nice in his Olympic FS '98 too. Nice find Smarts1 thanks for the share.
     
  4. julieann

    julieann Well-Known Member

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    Aren't all jumps learned off ice first?
     
  5. aemeraldrainc

    aemeraldrainc Active Member

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    Yeah, that's what I thought, too.
    But even Scott Hamilton said he had never seen anyone do a triple axel on the floor before...
     
  6. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Sasha

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    I remember seeing Kulik's off ice triple axel during one of the competitions long ago. I did not know Sandhu did it also. It takes great athleticism to do that.
     
  7. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the coach's teaching philosophy. In my experience, usually not, but I have seen it. I remember a novice girl at my rink in the 1970s jumping double axels off ice.
     
  8. julieann

    julieann Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if he meant live or just the triple axel. I remember reading someone who volunteered at a competitions who was surprised the skaters where doing their entire program in the hallway.
     
  9. triple_toe

    triple_toe Well-Known Member

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    It's fairly common. If you have the ability to do a triple axel on the ice you should have the ability to do one off the ice. It depends on where you're from though, because some coaches never focus on jumping off ice but for some it's seen as a vital part of training. Russian coaches in particular stress off ice jumping.
     
  10. aemeraldrainc

    aemeraldrainc Active Member

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  11. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think that's entirely true. I saw Plushenko "only" do three revolutions on a triple axel attempt off ice. It is much harder to jump off ice, since you are at a standstill.
     
  12. Holley Calmes

    Holley Calmes Well-Known Member

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    Don't see a whole lot of triple tours in ballet by male dancers-mostly doubles, but they do point their feet, hold their bodies/shoulders erect, and have arms in the correct various positions. Seriously, either athlete is fabulous in my book. I know Emanuel was a ballet dancer-you can tell. Wonder how much ballet Kulik had? I always assumed the Russian skaters had tons of ballet, but how true is this? The pairs skaters look like they have more ballet to me, but what do I know?
     
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  13. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

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    Not from my experience. I remember learning to rotate off ice (to use legs, body position, close your arms, control landings...) in both direction. But jumping technique is very different on the ice and use speed and edges.

    Those 3Axels off ice are just unbelievable !
     
  14. Edgeofglory

    Edgeofglory New Member

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  15. triple_toe

    triple_toe Well-Known Member

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    I haven't seen him jump off ice, but I would bet that he does have the ability to do a triple axel off the ice, even if he was having trouble with it when you saw him. Mishin is big on off ice jumps, so I would be surprised if Plushenko can't do it- especially since he's one of the best jumpers ever! And yes, I do understand that jumping off the ice is a little harder since you need more strength to do it, but once you have the ability to jump a triple axel *on* the ice you shouldn't have much trouble figuring out how to do one *off* the ice. Plus you don't have to account for speed going in and out, slipperiness of the ice, edges, etc, all of which make the jump riskier and harder to control.

    I find it kind of amusing that people are so shocked by triple axels off the ice when that same jump on the ice is so common :lol: Hell, I could do a triple axel off ice I was nowhere near one on the ice. Off ice jumping is much more forgiving. And less scary :shuffle:
     
  16. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

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    Also, imagine the weight of the boots. Take those off and off ice jumping should be easy for someone who can do it on the ice. As I said, I did triple axels off ice and was self taught. It is certainly possible. I just think a lot of people don't train off ice jumps.
     
  17. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    ^ Do you guys have any videos? I really want to see them!
     
  18. aliceanne

    aliceanne Well-Known Member

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    Doing jumps off ice can improve your fitness, but it doesn't help your timing. You don't have an entrance edge before the takeoff when you do it on the ground.
     
  19. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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    During the qualifying rounds at the 1996 World Junior Championships in Brisbane, the Russian and German singles skaters prior to skating warmed up by the ice doing doubles and triples in their sneakers. It was amazing to see!
     
  20. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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    I remember when you posted these.

    I'm sorry I never got around to capturing a lot of my own on tape, either.

    On the floor, I got to the point where I could do a 3flip/3toe/3toe/3toe. My triple axel was a bit scary b/c of the forward take off, but I could tack a 3toe onto the end of it. The centrifugal force of trying the 4sal however, forced my eyes shut, so I had to feel for the landing most times.

    Thanks for the memory.
     
  21. walei

    walei Well-Known Member

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    I remember Emanuel Sandhu had triple axels for his audition on SYTYCD Canada. Mary Murphy even had to ask him what the move is called.

    It amazes me how people don't twist their ankles every time when doing off ice jumps.
     
  22. aliceanne

    aliceanne Well-Known Member

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    That's a pretty common way to warm up for axels, doubles, and triples nowadays. Most coaches warm up their advanced students in the lobby before they take to the ice for a lesson.

    It seems unbelieveable now but I remember reading in several skater memoirs that the North American skaters in the 70's never did that, even at competitions like Worlds. Apparently the East Germans started doing it and the other skaters were amazed when they took to the ice for their warm-up and could do triple jumps right away.
     
  23. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any of my old videos any more. I had some on video but threw them all out with my old skating tapes. I meant to save them but I had not labeled them and the idea of sitting through tons of unlabeled skating tapes to find just one was not very fun. I now wish I had kept some but it isn't as if I could show any of my real life friends. You guys would be the only ones to appreciate and/or understand. :lol:
     
  24. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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    I may have a couple of your real player files on my old computer somewhere.

    I remember being impressed with how you could tack double loops onto the end of your triples. I had so much trouble doing loops as the second jump in combination, it was easier for me to do a double or triple loop first.
     
  25. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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  26. ~tapdancer~

    ~tapdancer~ Well-Known Member

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    Ever see the movie "Center Stage"? I think Ilia had plenty of ballet training. :)
     
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  27. misskarne

    misskarne #ForzaJules #KeepFightingMichael

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    Ah, Ilia's gorgeous over-rotated 3A on the floor!

    I read somewhere that he'd landed a 4A on the floor, but never tried it on the ice. Apparently it's a huge technique in Russia to be able to land all your jumps on the floor. I think it takes the place of the harness.

    I see the more advanced girls at my rink doing off-ice jumps all the time. My coach wants me to start doing off-ice jumps too.

    There's video floating around somewhere of Plushenko playing soccer for some celebrity team...he scores a goal and celebrates with an over-rotated 2A (on the grass, in soccer boots! :eek:) and a couple of very pretty butterflies.
     
  28. misskarne

    misskarne #ForzaJules #KeepFightingMichael

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    At least enough to pass for a professional at the barre. Upper body shot only, of course. :D


    ....it always bugged me that Sergei got shunted to San Fransisco. And that he wasn't given a bigger part in the movie, really. I liked Sergei, he was my favourite character. (Disclaimer: I liked Sergei before I started following figure skating!)
     
  29. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    Can you find the video?
     
  30. CantALoop

    CantALoop Well-Known Member

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    This. It may help with timing and getting a feel for rotation, but it does nothing for edges or flow out of the jump.