Judge throws out 3 of 51 counts against Sandusky

Discussion in 'Off The Beaten Track' started by Fan123, Jun 21, 2012.

  1. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

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    He knew what was going on and instead of stopping it, arrange for a huge payoff for himself. The Paternos should give that money to the victims to pay for their counseling and legal costs. Read an article that said no one at Penn State went against Joe Paterno's wishes, he literally had carte blanche to do what he wanted. He could had easily had Sandusky permanently removed from the Penn State campus as soon as he found out about the abuse. Instead he used his power to protect Sandusky, shameful Once removed from the campus, all that was needed was a confidential phone call to the police to start an investigation against Sandusky.
    flutzilla1 and (deleted member) like this.
  2. Rafter

    Rafter Well-Known Member

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    I agree. In the case of the Catholic church, I wonder if it's denial. I doubt they believe it's really happening at all.
  3. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

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    In their minds they aren't protecting the attacker. They are protecting the organization. In this case, Penn State football. If you don't live near a major football school, you probably cannot comprehend the level through which everything can be seen through the lens of how it will affect the program.

    A small example happened here recently. A player who had just finished his eligibility was arrested this spring for assaulting a police officer. Two headlines followed and the fan conversation was focused on their topics. Basically they were "how would it affect his NFL draft status?" and "would it negatively impact spring recruiting?" That's it. No concern for the crime that took place or for the officer, no questions about the bad behavior. The questions in the local papers and around the web had to do with football.

    When that is how the whole atmosphere is and fans and alums are pouring millions of dollars into it as well, the people living off of it will do all they can to protect it. Talking to a friend who went to college near Penn State, I understand that it is actually WORSE there.
  4. Anita18

    Anita18 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly.

    The adamance at which people will protect the status quo (and their place in it) has brought down many a society.
  5. Twizzler

    Twizzler Well-Known Member

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  6. KHenry14

    KHenry14 Well-Known Member

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  7. Anita18

    Anita18 Well-Known Member

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    Just...stop. An investigation by one of the accused is seriously not going to help, either in helping to solve anything or in the public eye.

    But I suppose they don't care as long as they get to keep their money....
  8. berthesghost

    berthesghost New Member

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  9. KHenry14

    KHenry14 Well-Known Member

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  10. Theatregirl1122

    Theatregirl1122 Well-Known Member

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  11. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

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    Would a police report be confidential, though? A call to CPS might be, but that's different from a police investigation. The names and police reports from sexual assault survivors themselves are publicly accessible, but the media generally chooses not to publish names.
  12. Desperado

    Desperado Active Member

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    Sorry I forgot to come back to this discussion regarding the reasons why people in large organisations deny abuse facts. You've all brought forth excellent points.

    I keep thinking that some of the world's greatest evils have been committed by people because they don't want to lose their jobs (status quo).
  13. taf2002

    taf2002 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I think it's very probable that Mrs Sandusky had the same motive. Unfortunately they can't prove what she knew. Or what some of the others knew. What's worse - the pedaphile or his enablers?
  14. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    You're kidding right? The pedophile is worse because he's the one who violated someone. Good grief.
  15. taf2002

    taf2002 Well-Known Member

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    So did the people who knew & did nothing. I agree the pedophile is worse but the enablers are also despicable. The pedophile is sick in the head and/or has urges he is not able or not willing to overcome. The enablers covered it up for monetary or social reasons. They all make me sick, as well as the fans who are now outraged for Paterno & the football program & care nothing for the victims.
  16. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

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    Survivors of child abuse are sometimes angrier at the enablers than the actual abuser. It usually wasn't too difficult for the victim to determine that the abuser couldn't be trusted. The enablers were sneakier-- they portrayed themselves as the "good guys", yet continually betrayed the victim.
  17. berthesghost

    berthesghost New Member

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  18. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

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  19. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    So some dude on the internet who posts that it's wrong to remove Paterno's statue from Penn State is as bad as Sandusky? I'm not buying it.
  20. berthesghost

    berthesghost New Member

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    :lol: Not buying it from whom, the imaginary voice in your head? :p
  21. Theatregirl1122

    Theatregirl1122 Well-Known Member

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    Taf said those people make her sick. Not that they are as bad as Sandusky.
  22. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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  23. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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  24. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    The NCAA had said that it would not be equivalent to SMU's death penalty but in some ways it is more severe - specifically the fine, vacating the wins and the longer post-season ban. They didn't shut down the program or take away all the scholarships, but I can't imagine too many people will stick around - and they shouldn't; the players are absolutely not at fault here, and they deserve a chance to start again elsewhere.

    It took SMU more than 20 years to get an invite a bowl game, and they never fully recovered from their penalties. And those were NCAA violations, not the ugliness of this case. I think it's safe to say that Penn State football is done.

    The moral failings of the men responsible for covering up Sandusky's crimes were already obvious. Although this is nowhere near the same level, they have also done irreversible damage to the program they were supposedly protecting.
  25. skatingfan5

    skatingfan5 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think it's safe to say that Penn State football is "done" -- unless you mean Penn State football being anywhere near the competitive level it has been in the past. It will surely be "down" for quite a few years, but I expect that it will recover somewhat. Which is only fair, assuming that all those associated and involved with the Sandusky coverup no longer have ties with the university. It doesn't make sense to punish those who had no part in this -- and going forward, I would hope that is the case. Punish those (including the institution) who were responsible for creating/sustaining the environment that allowed such awful crimes to be covered up and continue for so long, but allow for a new beginning in the future.
  26. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    Done in the sense that SMU was done - Penn State might eventually get close to the level it was competitively, but it will take a long, long time for that to happen. What will Penn State have to offer potential recruits, even after the ban ends? They'll be a losing program for a while, and one with a tarnished reputation as well.

    As some columnists have noted, these penalties could harm other athletic programs at Penn State, because football brings in a lot of money. But I don't see how the NCAA could have gone about this much differently - they've punished schools for procedural stuff, and this case goes far beyond that.
  27. attyfan

    attyfan Well-Known Member

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    I do hope that the current players can find another school ... and soon. It really isn't their fault.
  28. purple skates

    purple skates Shadow dancing

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    The next question is what will the Big 10 do with Penn State? Kick them out?
  29. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    No it isn't. Unfortunately, as in any institution, what's done at the top affects the innocent at the bottom. Collateral damage.
  30. missing

    missing Well-Known Member

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    I have mixed feelings about the NCAA's decision, and I think there are a lot of complications no one (that I've heard) is talking about.

    One thing is that Penn State is the biggest and by far the most successful northeastern university football program. People in New York and New Jersey and Pennsylvania are more likely to watch a Penn State bowl game than an Oregon one. There's going to be an effect on TV ratings.

    Another is that Penn State now needs to redefine itself as a near Ivy. Ivy league universities have very limited athletic scholarships and don't go to Bowl games, but they do just fine getting recruits, and a handful of their students go on to professional sports, including football. I'm sure Penn State has a strong academic department. It simply needs to promote itself to recruits as a highly academic environment with a strong football history that will be appealing to NFL scouts.

    I would have allowed Penn State to keep all its football credentials, but forbidden it to have people at its home games for 3 years. I think that would have been a more visiible punishment, more like a "death sentence." I don't know that people will get that a lousy football program is the direct result of covering up a crime.

    And finally, it will be interesting to see what happens the next time a rape scandal affects a major university sports program. An awful lot of univeristy athletes get away with an awful lot of sexual abuse because the university lets the athlete get away with it. If I'm a girl who is vicitimized, I'm heading right over to the police and the NCAA to demand sanctions. And if I'm a girl who is pressured by a coach to have sex with him, I'm making the same trips.
  31. berthesghost

    berthesghost New Member

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    Perhaps you're more idealistic than most. Very few recover from scandal.
  32. jeffisjeff

    jeffisjeff Well-Known Member

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    Just to clarify, the Ivy League has NO athletic scholarships. Financial aid is all need-based. And, they are permitted to play in Bowl games, they just generally aren't good enough and/or don't qualify according to toughness of schedule, etc. IIRC, the last time an Ivy team played a bowl game was in the 1930s, a time when the Ivies were pretty good at sports.
  33. berthesghost

    berthesghost New Member

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    Unless your coach is morozov, then you'll just cry on twitter that you want to kill yourself because he dumped you for a teenager, and all of skating will just look away, just like they did when your pairs parter used to smack you around.
  34. skatingfan5

    skatingfan5 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I am. While it's true that very few recover (completely) from scandal, that doesn't mean that some can't make at least a partial recovery, in time.
  35. Sparks

    Sparks Well-Known Member

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    What happened at SMU?
  36. skatingfan5

    skatingfan5 Well-Known Member

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    A bunch of stuff, their "slush fund" was one of the major violations.

    Of course, I thought that Baylor's basketball scandal deserved harsher penalties than it got, since it involved the murder of a player (by another player) and the coach taking part in an attempt to deflect the murder investigation from the team (among other transgressions by the coach). :yikes:
  37. taf2002

    taf2002 Well-Known Member

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    Where did I say that?

    http://deadspin.com/5926561/i-hope-...state-fan-reactions-to-paternovilles-renaming

    “I Hope Tim Tebow Rapes A Kid”

    "This is ridiculous. Joe did so many great things for Penn State. This is being completely blown out of hand. Your letting one bad thing out weigh the so many positive things. Its appears as though this is being done to please people who probably arent even big supporters of PSU." (emphasis mine)

    "Joe doesn't deserve any of this crap. Shameful, cowardly and knee-jerk."

    These are just a few posts that disgusted me. It is clear to me that these posters are the type of people who would have also protected Penn State football over protecting kids. Sorry if this disgusting me offends anyone.
  38. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

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    A commenter at cnn.com has declared that the fans are now "victims", too, and no one cares about their "suffering".

    We take sports just a bit too seriously if this constitutes "suffering". No perspective whatsoever.
  39. taf2002

    taf2002 Well-Known Member

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    When my future BIL was a junior in HS he was playing an away game & the ref made a bad call at the end that cost us the game. Parents & fans stormed out on the field & I remember one of the mothers (my Sunday school teacher) hitting the ref on the head with her purse. People were screaming & cursing & fighting - it was an absolute disgrace. The division fined our school & barred us from division play for the next year. You would have thought someone died, the grief for some people was so intense.

    It is one of the reasons I seldom watch team sports - people get so caught up in the team & their record that they lose all good sense. Winning is fun but it has become such big business that values & morals are secondary to the win.
    milanessa and (deleted member) like this.
  40. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

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    I watch team sports. I love baseball. And I watch college football. I think that team sports can create a sense of community that is sometimes lacking in our lives. Roger Angell's classic piece called "Game Six" about the 1975 World Series speaks to this very well.

    But I have perspective. I can sleep at night when "my team" loses. I don't consider myself to have "suffered" when that happens.

    I would also say that I don't think avoiding team sports allows us to avoid that lack of or potential loss of perspective. The word "suffering" was thrown around the skating boards in regard to Alissa Czisny's placement at Worlds this past spring and the posters were not referring to Alissa but to themselves. (Although, I am pretty sure that was not here...can't remember for sure).