ISU Congress

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by drfj, Jun 12, 2012.

  1. drfj

    drfj Member

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    The next ISU election will take place in four years.The Members voted for the Council's proposal.So Speedy is 4 years more ISU president
  2. sezam

    sezam New Member

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    Thanks, drfj, for the info.
    Any other interesting news?
  3. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    Well, when they looked at the alternatives it's not surprising. :slinkaway
  4. drfj

    drfj Member

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    you do not have alternates at the moment the original election should be in 2 years,now it will be in 4 years
  5. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Active Member

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    4 more years? :slinkaway
  6. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    Preliminaries are gone.
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  7. drfj

    drfj Member

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    yes,that is a good new
  8. sezam

    sezam New Member

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    And now all 50+ single skaters will skate short program?
  9. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

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    That's a bit disappointing. Even though it burdened skaters much, I was quite enjoying the thrill of who's gonna go in or out. Well for the skaters' sake, of course, it's a good thing.
  10. elfenblüte

    elfenblüte New Member

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    For me too, I think it was also more enjoyable for the skaters to do a 4 minutes program with much more personality instead of a program which is only 2,50 minutes long.
  11. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    I thought the preliminaries were a good thing, but a lot of the federations weren't happy if their skaters didn't participate in the "main" part of Worlds for various reasons.
  12. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Preliminaries meant that a lot of skaters weren't able to 'really compete' at Worlds, there was often no way of watching them at all (even online) and they were totally unfair because you got some weak skaters directly qualifying because of the result of their better teammates.

    Also, SP/SD is much better at showing skaters' technical prowess. It's much more brutal with mistakes penalised more.

    THANK HEAVENS the preliminary rounds are gone. :cheer:

    Any other news?

    What about Junior skaters not being able to do Junior any more after having done Senior events twice (IIRC)?

    And what about 14 year olds not being able to do GP any more?
  13. Asli

    Asli Well-Known Member

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    The fact that preliminaries are gone is good news for all federations that don't consistently have strong skaters, i.e. for all ISU members except for 6-7.

    Therefore it is not a surprise that the vote has gone the way it has. ;)
    Lanna and (deleted member) like this.
  14. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    Yeah, I wouldn't cheer so much Ziggy. Nobody is going to want to hold Worlds as is because of the expense so the ISU will find another way to cut numbers. We might look back on preliminaries with fondness yet.

    I quite like the preliminaries for the ladies and men because it meant we could have a few extra hours in bed the morning of the short. :p

    Congress goes on for another two days so no doubt the above will be gotten around to at some point.
  15. drfj

    drfj Member

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    The other way is by the ISU to cut the numbers ,is to fix a high minimum score to take part in the Championships.And this is not a very good thing for the small federations.
  16. Asli

    Asli Well-Known Member

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    Was it really cheaper to hold the preliminaries rather than longer short programs? With the preliminaries, the championships are a day longer, so there is extra expense for the judges and other officials, the rink security and for the skaters who pass the preliminaries. I'm not sure either way of course.

    Upto now there have always been candidates to hold the Worlds and Euros. So maybe sacrifices shouldn't be made unless the problem actually arises.
  17. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    The preliminaries at Worlds this year for example eliminated over 70 skaters from the competition. Multiply that number by hotel rooms over a number of nights, etc. and it's not an insignificant amount of money.

    Personally, I don't see why an organising committee should have to pay for a competitor's accommodation and meals. It's their choice to be there innit. :slinkaway

    At the last congress I believe that some of the organising federations for upcoming championships threatened to relinquish hosting if the preliminary round proposal wasn't passed.

    It may be the case that it was more hassle than it was worth even if it did save money. I heard some accommodation expenses from Sheffield and Nice are still outstanding from federations whose skaters didn't advance from the preliminaries (even though they were supposed to have paid cash beforehand).....
  18. Asli

    Asli Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, but the same amount of money would be saved if the preliminaries didn't take place and these skaters were eliminated at the short program - since their expenses wouldn't be payed once they are eliminated.

    If anything, extra accomodation and meals have been payed for the skaters who did make it through the preliminaries, since they had to arrive a couple of days earlier.

    I agree with you, given how expensive a sport figure skating is. Maybe for athletics or some team sports it is necessary to give really poor federations a chance to enter their athletes. However the expence of bringing a skater to championships level is such that I'm sure a few nights' accomodation is negligible in comparison.

    In any case, national federations whose skaters are "invisible" at the Euros and Worlds would lose so much money in terms of state support and sponsors that they should jump on the opportunity of paying for a few nights' hotel fees!
  19. oubik

    oubik Well-Known Member

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    I do think the preliminaries were good, short programmes are more of a lottery and everything depends on if you are drown for last 4 groups or are in the lower half. See how many of early starters went through short programmes in those Worlds, Juniow Worlds and Euros?

    Also, I have a hear´say info the Canadians (after the passing of no more prelims) went to ISU they would be supposedly giving the Worlds 2013 back as impossible to finance. Anyone other who can confirm?
  20. drfj

    drfj Member

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    I have heard the same about Canadians.
  21. GarrAarghHrumph

    GarrAarghHrumph I can kill you with my brain

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    I'm sorry - are you saying that the Worlds that are supposed to be held in Canada in 2013 may not be held there? That the Canadians are trying to to give them back, to not hold them in Canada, as they could not get financing?
  22. SamuraiK

    SamuraiK Well-Known Member

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    Last time the Swiss federation threatened to not host Euros if prelims weren't aproved, and if the rumours are true that skate Canada wouldn't host 2013 worlds if prelims are gone then who else would volunteer???.. We could be looking at Worlds being host every year at Japan just like WTT :S

    I did like the prelims. It felt more like a real competition where skaters had to qualify for the main event instead of really really weak skaters just being there because their federations are ISU members. And like someone said, I'd rather do a long trip and peform my Long program instead of a short. Anyways, Im not a skater so Im not sure how they genuinely feel about this topic.
  23. drfj

    drfj Member

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    To eliminate the preliminary was a very bad urgent proposal,made by a small federation.
  24. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    But some weak skaters did not have to qualify because of the performance of their teammates in the previous year. The playing field wasn't level at all.

    It wouldn't be that bad if direct entries were tied to particular skaters and not federations.
  25. Hedwig

    Hedwig Rarely here anymore but I try to be better!

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    But that would raise other issues. At Nationals federations might try to let the skater win who qualified a place instead of the more deserving other skater for instance.
    gkelly and (deleted member) like this.
  26. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member

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    The ISU doesn't care how inconvenient any changes might be for those who have already made plans.
    I'm afraid that's the only thing we can be sure about!
  27. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Don't blame 'the ISU' in this instance (if you're referring to Preliminary Rounds).

    It was a national federation submitting the proposal and the national federations voting in favour of it.
  28. sus2850

    sus2850 Member

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    Ah, I really liked the preliminaries, more skating and time to get into competition mood. And for the skaters a real chance to impress judges. Also a treat: seeing previously retired guys like Pluschenko alongside weaker skaters, and of course: a free skate always shows more of a skater's potential than a short on which everything depends.
    But the skaters are happy that prelims are gone, at least Valentina Marchei's twitter says so...
  29. Lanna

    Lanna Well-Known Member

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    THANK YOU JESUS
  30. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Yep, the smaller federations have really threw the baby out with the bathwater.

    Whilst I was initially very happy to see preliminaries gone, most likely this is what is going to happen now as a result.

    And if it does, then smaller federations won't even be able to enter any skaters to ISU Championships... :(

    Really badly played. :slinkaway
  31. Asli

    Asli Well-Known Member

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    You must give the smaller federations some credit for deciding what's best for them.
  32. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    It comes back to the whole argument about what qualifies a skater to go to worlds. Really there are some skaters who by virtue that they a members of the ISU get to go to a Worlds, even if they are not World standard.
  33. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    It looks like "the mob effect" has taken place and they did something without thinking it through at all.

    As much as I hated the Preliminary Rounds, having them is definitely better - both for the small federations and for us - to the situation that we might end up with now, with skaters from smaller federations not being able to compete at ISU Championships at all. :(

    And I wonder what's going to happen about 2013 Worlds. Japan will take them?

    I think that is the idea of having an Olympic, 'amateur' sport.

    Plus, smaller federations have to start somewhere.
  34. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    How is eliminating prelims to their advantage? Do they think the ISU Council won't do something else they control -- like raise the minimum scores/criteria -- to lower the number of participants and costs?
  35. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    I guess they thought that we would now be back to Short Program in two parts, like before.

    But that is definitely not going to happen due to financial constraints, tv contracts, etc.
  36. SLIVER

    SLIVER New Member

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    The only thing I care about is going back to the Tue-Sat schedule and not having the 2 finals on Saturday. I hope that changes now that theyve ditched the qualies. Mind you, I am assuming that wont be the case for the 2013 season, as the tickets and dates for the championships are already sold and set.
  37. GarrAarghHrumph

    GarrAarghHrumph I can kill you with my brain

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    If it's true that Canada is looking to dump them, my hope is that Japan would take them.
  38. SLIVER

    SLIVER New Member

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    I dont understand why would a nation dump hosting an event if the qualies are not there anymore? I am lost...
  39. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    I can't imagine that happening. Narrowing the ISU Championships down to a 4 day format was a cost saving and the tv networks liked it too.

    Everybody who didn't get past the Preliminary Rounds had to pay their own expenses.

    Everybody who got eliminated, got eliminated at the beginning of the week meaning they only used 2 days of ice time for practice.

    Those who didn't need to skate in the Preliminary Rounds didn't start their practices until Monday at earliest.

    So all in all, a bit less ice time was needed.

    Now what I don't understand is why they can't change it so that all the federations have to pay their own expenses and solve the problem this way.

    I guess the answer is: no federations are going to willingly vote to bear more expenses. :p

    But wouldn't doing that be better than not having your skaters at ISU Championships at all...
  40. leapfrogonice

    leapfrogonice Active Member

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    It is a sad statement, if it is true, that a country like Canada - that chose a VERY modest location with limited seating - could not host this event. Very sad statement for the status of the sport in North America.