In Russia, Skating Booms Again - NYT Article

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by GarrAarghHrumph, Jan 31, 2014.

  1. GarrAarghHrumph

    GarrAarghHrumph I can kill you with my brain

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  2. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

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    Interesting -- thanks for posting.

    Is the photo of Lipnitskaia with other skaters at the Kristal ice rink in Moscow flipped?

    Most likely she's showing a jump landing, which would be on the other foot. And it looks like the girl in the purple shirt may be practicing the upper body position for the beginning of a jump rotation, which would also most likely be in the other direction.

    Which raises two questions, unrelated to each other:

    Are there ever any clockwise skaters in Russia?

    Can digital photos get flipped by accident, or would an editor do it on purpose for aesthetic reasons without being aware that skating is not a symmetrical sport?
     
  3. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    She does look like a lefty skater in that picture. Interesting...
     
  4. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

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    Good read! Sad about tuktamisheva but that happens!
     
  5. alchemy void

    alchemy void it's time for the perkolator

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    Very nice article. Some nice quotes from all the Russian girls and Lipinski.

    But the most surprising part of the article to me is that Tutberidze is 40. :eek: I think she looks a decade younger. Also interesting to read how she struggled initially as a coach, with Mishin poaching all her previous students. Now she coaches the European gold and silver medalists in singles! :cheer:
     
  6. Aerobicidal

    Aerobicidal Well-Known Member

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    Her coat, from very famous Russian designer Oksana 2000, is her sekret. It has many majical powers.
     
  7. hanca

    hanca Well-Known Member

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    The photo may not be flipped. I think she is just doing left outside edge, perhaps within her choreography. If that was a landing position, why would the right arm (or if the photo is flipped then left arm) be so much behind her? That would not be very helpful for landing any jump!
     
  8. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

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    Yes, having all your students poached would be difficult to deal with. Dishonorable on the part of Mishin imo.
     
  9. hanca

    hanca Well-Known Member

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    Do we know for sure that Mishin poached her students (he approached them and persuaded them to come to him), or did the students decide to move to a more advanced coach? The students have a right to change a coach and if Mishin did not approach them first, it would not be his fault that they wanted to change a coached. If they didn't come to him, they would perhaps come to another coach.

    I think someone like Mishin does not have a need to poach someone else's students. The students would be approaching him and he would still have to refuse quite a few.
     
  10. Holley Calmes

    Holley Calmes Well-Known Member

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    I know a lot about student poaching-at least in this country-from the dance world. Don't know if it applies in Russian skating, but I can emphatically say that dishonorable teachers will absolutely spot someone who looks promising and try to snatch them away as fast as they can. It isn't always a matter of a student who is already obviously a great talent....a good coach can see potential in very young people who are as yet unformed. Some times great talent can be spotted before the child has gone very far and still doesn't look like much. I'm sure advanced students might approach a great teacher -they do - and defect from whence they came. But student-snatching is indeed a big issue! Not accusing Mishin of it.
     
  11. altai_rose

    altai_rose Well-Known Member

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    Instead of saying "snatching them away," you could also say that the life of a figure skater is so short and talent must be nurtured early. For coaches like Mishin (and now, Tutberidze) it's painful to watch talented kids suffer due to bad coaching--or, in this case, a coach who was a question mark because she didnt have a track record--and you might feel an obligation to do something. You can approach a skater, I think, and tell them you're interested, but ultimately it's the choice of the skater or parents to switch coaches. What's dishonorable about that?

    In academia, this happens quite often (it's essentially recruiting) and it's flattering when you're approached by someone famous. But I have no experience in the skating/coaching world.
     
  12. hanca

    hanca Well-Known Member

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    I am not questioning whether poaching exist or not, I am wondering whether someone of Mishin's skills needs to poach a student. What I am saying is that if you are as successful as him, he has more students begging him to take them on than he can manage. Why would he have to make the effort of searching for more and poach them?

    And in regards to poaching - I believe one can't poach a student that is happy. I am currently VERY happy with my coach and I would not change no matter who would approach me. The students that are willing to change are usually unhappy with their coaching situation and one could argue that if they did not change when they were approached, they would eventually change by approaching someone else anyway. Happy skaters don't change their coaches.
     
  13. Holley Calmes

    Holley Calmes Well-Known Member

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    Well.....let's consider that Mishin is very passionate about what he does. He would have to be-it is his life. He sees an unformed blob of potential blazing talent like he has never seen before....of course he wants to coach that student! I don't know any teacher worth his or her salt who would NOT want to have an individual of rare talent under their tutelage. Great talent doesn't come along very often, and when someone on the level of Mishin sees it, of course he would want to coach them. I am NOT saying he poaches, but it is a very common thing in the dance world. And as for a student not wanting to leave-well that's their decision. But I believe someone approached by a legendary coach who believes he/she can take them to places their current coach might not....I have to believe many would leave their comfort zone for the possibility of improvement with a proven, highly successful teacher. I've seen it happen many times.
     
  14. ItalianFan

    ItalianFan Member

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  15. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    Good point. Mishin hatred/dislike is being carried a bit too far here. Should we say Frank Carroll poached Gracie Gold from her previous coach? That would be as ridiculous as Mishin poaching another coach's students. A successful coach naturally attracts more students, and we are likely to see that with Tutberidze, particularly after these Olympics.