If you like both D/W & V/M but love other couples..........

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by PashaFan, Nov 2, 2013.

  1. Dolore

    Dolore New Member

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    My heart breaks for Nathalie and Fabian. I hoped they would get silver at their last TEB. I am not really feeling their programs yet though. I much preferred I/K overall performance but I am not sure their skating skills are strong enough to deserve such high marks. I hope W/P can spice up their tango a little bit. They have lovely music but the choreography is a bit too tame for my taste :)
     
  2. stupsi

    stupsi New Member

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    D/W & V/M are exactly top. I love W/P (Canada) and Zhiganshina & Gazsi(Germany) as well !
     
  3. Dolore

    Dolore New Member

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    I wish they had kept last year's FD. I can't remember the last time I have seen such an original dance program :D
     
  4. stupsi

    stupsi New Member

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    Hi Dolore.

    Thank your for your reply.

    Yes, I hope it, too.
    Just as my opinion, it's not sure if they can stand on the podium in Sotchi.
    But their Dance are "One and Only!".;)

    I wish super performances of Nathalie and Fabian (perhaps last season for them ? not sure...) in Sotchi, too.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  5. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

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    Cup of Russia should be really interesting this weekend. B/S have to step up from the COC just like C/B. W/P were fantastic at home in Canada.
    I did not get B/S choice of programs in China but maybe that was because I'm so pro-P/B. Up against W/P (Who I really admire like the Shibs but don't excite me like some others) it will be close between them.
    I feel that B/S have taken one step back this season with their choreography. Last season both their SD & FD was something new & fresh from them. This season the programs (More the FD) are quite old fashioned.
     
  6. Golightly

    Golightly Well-Known Member

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    It's not so much the choreo, although, that too could try to translate more tango into the ice. To me, it's their lack of technique what's the problem. The back should be more rigid, their necks should be more tensed (to get the "cabeceo" right and there's a clear problem at the end of the leg extension, it's not aggressive enough. It's not kicking for the sake of kicking, it has to be violent, yet controlled. I do not see control. To be honest, it looked improvised. W-P have improved a lot, but to do a tango, you have to practice A LOT on the floor to get it right. I'm not seeing good elbow lines either. The have great chemistry, but there's more to tango than that. Anjelika was a master at tango, we know this.
     
  7. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    Can I just pop into this thread for a second to scream?

    Just because you have a favorite doesn't mean that every other team out there is terrible and "not even ice dancing". Just because your favorite isn't winning by a massive landslide doesn't mean the scoring system is udder crap. Especially when you aren't even comparing scores from the same competition!

    And there is more to ice dancing than D/W and V/M!

    I wish I could just not read all the crap, but I go through FSU using "what's new" and I haven't found a way to block entire threads.
     
  8. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

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    That's why I started this thread.
    If you are even slightly critical of V/M or D/W you get jumped on. W/P threads are also like that now.
    I like all three couples but sometimes enjoy others more.
     
  9. DORISPULASKI

    DORISPULASKI Watching submarine races

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    You can! Subscribe to this thread, and any other threads you like to see. Then instead, of clicking on New Posts, click on Settings-only your Subscribed threads with new posts show up. Warning-if you posted in a thread you don't want to see, you may have to Unsubscribe.

    I find this very handy for looking at just the stuff I am interested in.

    But I am so thrilled that Z&G's TEB showing was so much better :encore: than their Skate Canada showing. I love G&P's Hitchcock & can't wait to see it again this weekend, and I can't wait to see W&P's 42nd Street SD.

    I do wonder exactly what music and program Bobrova & Soloviev are going to be skating to this weekend.

    COR is going to be very interesting.
    thanks for a general ice dance thread.
     
  10. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

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    I love Z/G. It's great they are getting the credit for their skating this year.
     
  11. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    V&M aren't even planning to go to Worlds. Olympics is their last competition.

    I cant imagine D&W after this season continuing if they win in Sochi as they probably will. Even if they don't it would be 50/50 at most I think to continue.
     
  12. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    I&K lost to the Shibutanis a week ago. It is way too early to even think of them beating V&M. I do think V&M will win the Olympic Silver this year, whether they deserve to or not, just by their name value. I do agree they are on decline now though, and others are catching up and bypassing them. Weaver & Poje were robbed of winning Skate Canada this year. Even the commentators said so.
     
  13. MissJD

    MissJD Active Member

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    VM have repeatedly said they're not sure when their last competition will be. If they don't know, neither do we. But this isn't their thread so moving on.

    As for WP, I do think they're improving, but they also have plenty of work left to do. I like the SD but that FD leaves something to be desired. I don't even expect them to beat BS this weekend. I think it's a toss up.

    With BS it's the opposite. I'm okay with the FD (appreciate the different concept, definitely still needs work), but wasn't feeling the SD. I agree about not even being certain what they'll do! Each time they've skated this season it was different. And I didn't see Zhulin in Paris last week which makes me think he was busy working on these 2.

    It is kinda exciting to finally have a dance event where I'm not sure of the winner going in! :D :cheer: Of course there's also GPF to be excited about. WP and BS should solidify their spots with PB, VM, DW, and CL at Rostelecom.
     
  14. Corianna

    Corianna Active Member

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    When did you post this? Check the TEB results... I&K second to VM. And which commentators were you referring to? Certainly not the ones I heard.
     
  15. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    You know, I sort of wish there was just one more opportunity for the skaters to directly compete against each other. I sort of think that the top 6 from the GP series qualifying for the GPF is faulty since a skater's or team's placement really all depends on the field you're competing against.

    I think after this GP Series (and other than a limited view from 4CC and Euros), we still won't really know how the judges will score any of the top contenders for the bronze medal (maybe spoilage for a higher medal) when all of them are directly competing against each other with the same Tech. Panel and judges. It will really be a nail-biter come Sochi.

    Not to bring negativity to this thread, but I really do think Zhulin is limited creatively when it comes to choreography. I don't think there's been anything he's choreographed that really wowed me. I think it's one of those cases where a great performer can really execute choreography and perform, but they don't really have the vision that a choreographer needs. I wish Bobrova/Soloviev could work with a different choreographer (and maybe someone to work on her posture because I find it distracting).
     
  16. Bournekraatzfan

    Bournekraatzfan New Member

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    The sad thing is that Bobrova noticeably improved her posture last year but I feel this year she has regressed in that area possibly due to the fact that they had to scrap both programs. I am hoping that once they get more comfortable with their material, her posture will improve because she will have greater familiarity with and control over the movements. I think they are also really going for speed because that is what is rewarded, and she is sacrificing her carriage for it. It is a shame because the posture issues distract from her lovely blade skills.

    I really loved both programs Zhulin did for them last year (that is when I really started to become a fan) and I liked their original FD this season. It is sad that they had this setback, and I really hope they can get things back on track (which would mean again reworking their programs).
     
  17. Bournekraatzfan

    Bournekraatzfan New Member

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    Yes, and this makes me so happy. I am waiting to see these two come out with a masterpiece because they are so brilliant! I mean, look at those blades! Look at those knees! While I prefer them to P&B (whom I also love), I thought I&K were overmarked on the PCS given the lack of difficulty in the transitions and linking movement. I can't wait to see how they improve their FD. I think it has a lot of potential, and I want them to have that special moment in front of their home crowd at the Olympics.

    It broke my heart to see P&B fall to third and to see Nathalie so upset. I have never felt they got the respect they deserved from the judges, and I am hoping this will be their year. I really love their FD, and I hope this will only push them. They have come back from difficult circumstances before and I have faith they can do so again. Come on, Nathalie and Fabian!
     
  18. morqet

    morqet Well-Known Member

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    Zhulin has done 1 program recently that I adore, Zlobina/Sitnikov's FD in 2011-12. It was so unusual, used the music perfectly, and suited them down to the ground. I think he's tried to do something in a similar vein for M/K this season, but I don't think they have the on-ice character to pull it off.
     
  19. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

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    It's not a shock to see B/S lead at COR but it is a shock to see the gap between them & W/P. But that's happens to the home skaters. D/W got inflated marks at Skate America & V/M & W/P got inflated marks at Skate Canada. It's just sad that P/B were dumped at home in Paris last week.
    I thought B/S were slightly better than W/P today. But that's because I liked it better than in China.
    C/B were really good. Much better in the Finn Step than R/T (Who are one of my favourites).
     
  20. MissJD

    MissJD Active Member

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    Protocols: http://www.isuresults.com/results/gprus2013/gprus2013_IceDance_SD_Scores.pdf

    :COP: Most of the gap between B/S and W/P is because of levels - B/S got level 3s on both Finnstep patterns and the step sequence, and 4s on the twizzles and lift. W/P got levels 2 and 1 on Finnstep, 2 on the lift, 3 on the step sequences, and 4 on twizzles. The difference in base value for TES just on these levels was 5.50 points (in favor of B/S). The GOE was pretty similar for both with a slight edge to W/P. B/S had 1.42 pts higher in PCS. I wouldn't say there was home inflation here. B/S hit their levels and W/P didn't.

    Same explanation for the difference between R/T and C/B. The base value TES was 4.5 points higher for R/T. C/B out PCS'd R/T by 2.21 points. C/B also got better GOE.
     
  21. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

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    Thanks for the info.
    Free dance should be good !
     
  22. MissJD

    MissJD Active Member

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    You're welcome! (Unfortunately the first thing I do after all of the dance events is read protocols, ugh. Still hoping for system that doesn't have me crunching numbers ;) )

    I'm excited for the free dance too! I'm really looking forward to seeing how B/S's has evolved. I love G/P's Hitchcock! And I'm praying that W/P and C/B took the vocals out of their music :yikes:
     
  23. bunhead

    bunhead Member

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    Why? The vocals in WP's FD is makes it unique as a tango!
     
  24. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. Taking the words out of W/P's Tango will totally change the mood of the dance, IMO. I like it the way it is.
     
  25. bunhead

    bunhead Member

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    BS' twizzles in the SD were not clean. How is this worthy of level 4? (Starts at 6:13)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3QriHFPl7k

    If VM had a similar problem mid-twizzle, their scores would get dinged in both levels and GOE. <sideeye>
     
  26. Golightly

    Golightly Well-Known Member

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    It's so funny because this has been going on for a while and now people seem to notice? Technical panels are so lazy. When in doubt, they go by the evident instead of reviewing the call. Then you watch it at home and see how people land on flats and get level 4 and others can't see why it frustrates you.
     
  27. Jessiebanana

    Jessiebanana Well-Known Member

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    Forget the twizzles, how do you get the highest FS levels of the competition and miss a hand hold SO OBVIOUSLY?

    http://youtu.be/y3QriHFPl7k?t=1m21s

    This Russianflation makes me so angry and sad for the skaters who are working hard and deserve a honest chance at the medals.

    How any senior level team could be lacking in something as basic as posture, and still be considered Olympic medal worthy is beyond me. The Shibs, who aren't and shouldn't be medal contenders yet, wouldn't dream of skating the way these two do.
     
  28. Jessiebanana

    Jessiebanana Well-Known Member

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    NVM you're right. The twizzles were WTF too.

    M/C received a level 3 for these twizzles, deservedly so, they weren't their best twizzles.

    http://youtu.be/qbSM9rWySZw?t=1m49s

    ...but if that's a level 3, how it this a level 4.

    http://youtu.be/y3QriHFPl7k?t=1m52s

    Again, V/M received a level 3 for this comparatively small bobble. I see you Russia and it's not cool.
    http://youtu.be/t46vJL8ABrs?t=2m11s

    I need to stop watching this. I just have to accept that this is what the Olympics is going to look like. W/P don't deserve to be second to this hot mess. B/S seem like nice people off the ice, but it's hard to remember that when they're being scored the way they are. Even in pairs. V/T are in a good place to win gold the way they're skating, there is no need to inflate their scores further. They don't need to pad scores just in case some other team skates well, that's not a competition.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2013
  29. rustyskater

    rustyskater Active Member

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    BS were not great. They were not great at all. I wonder whether the judges are slating them from Oly Bronze? Truth is, however, I think IK will surpass BS for Oly Bronze. You heard it here first!
     
  30. Golightly

    Golightly Well-Known Member

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    What? Politics? Judges over scoring a team purposely? But I thought that only happened under 6.0.