If you could have a rule created, what would it be.

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by essence_of_soy, Jul 14, 2011.

  1. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2003
    Messages:
    2,513
    We have the Zayak rule (for repeating jumps), the Boitano rule (for professionals wasnting re-instatement), and the Witt rule (for costume violations).

    What rule would you like created, and what would the penalty be.

    I know I'm stealing Manleywoman's thunder here, so she may have naming rights.

    But for overuse of Carmen, there should be a 25 point deduction in PCS, as well as being forced to watch dvds of every juvenile lady who has ever skated to "The Lonely Goatherd".
  2. Kelvster

    Kelvster Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,623
    a rule to reward skaters for

    attempting the 5 different triples (for ladies) and 6 different triples (for men)

    i miss the good ol' days of the 6.0 system where you see ladies doing a classic, conservative ladies programme consisting of e.g.

    3lutz-2toe,
    3flip,
    double axel.
    Pause
    ====
    Slow music begins
    spiral sequence
    Wind up to a 3loop
    3sal
    ====
    Fast music begins again
    3toe-2toe
    step sequence
    2axel
    ====
    ;)
  3. blue_idealist

    blue_idealist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2007
    Messages:
    2,108
    YES to the 5 and 6 different triples thing!!
  4. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Messages:
    20,745
    One spin with no change of position, that would focus on speed, centering and how well you get into the position you chose.

    I agree with awarding points for skaters who complete 5 different triples (women) or 6 different triples (men).

    Multiplying combinations by a factor, with more for the loop on the end than the toe.

    Allowing judges to decide downgrades. If a majority think a jump is downgraded then downgrade it, I hate super slow mo close up video being used and one or two people so often controlling outcomes.
  5. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2003
    Messages:
    2,513
    *cough* Bauil *cough*
  6. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2008
    Messages:
    4,763
    This is mine! :cheer2:
  7. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Messages:
    20,745
    Sorry, if I read that from you before then it buried somehow in my subconscious because it just came to me. :lol:
  8. just tuned in

    just tuned in Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2005
    Messages:
    666
    My rule would be that the skater's music cannot have applause or cheering sounds built into the soundtrack. (When Sasha Cohen's "Dark Eyes" did that, I, sitting at home, thought it was the audience cheering... but no.)
  9. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2011
    Messages:
    5,562
    Yes yes yes! I like this one! But I'd like add an extra bonus for ladies who do all 6 triples.

    I like this one, too. I miss the old days where you had to hold one spin position for eight revolutions. I loved watching Plushy's camel when he did that. But now of course he has to change the position after like one revolution to get the points. I think they've put too much emphasis on the change positions.

    *

    Spiral sequence for the men! Some of them have really nice spirals that they never use.
  10. purple skates

    purple skates Shadow dancing

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    My rule is that skaters get a 50 point bonus for actually skating to the music instead of over it.
  11. skfan

    skfan New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2009
    Messages:
    404
    no more blade grabbing, period. blade grabbing is fugly on death spirals and butt ugly on 95% of single skaters who drop their legs rather than extend the leg towards the hand that grabs the blades. most can't do a blade grab spin half as beautiful as rory flack's anyway. and maybe without blade grabs there would be an end to the epidemic of gloves.
  12. purple skates

    purple skates Shadow dancing

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    ^ Can I have this rule too, please?
  13. screech

    screech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,870
    I think that men have had the option of doing a spiral sequence (at least they did until a few years ago). I know Jeff Buttle did one in his LPs in his early years of success. But I wish Shawn Sawyer would have.

    I don't necessarily think they need to do spiral sequences, but at the very least a sequence of field moves should be required (with no more than 1 spiral included). I mean, they could do pivots and hydroblading if they wanted, but some sequence of field moves should be required.
  14. skfan

    skfan New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2009
    Messages:
    404

    please join! the more the merrier. :cool:

    maybe some day we'll reach critical mass and there'll be fewer eyesore blade grabs? or maybe the rule change that cut down the # of dog-at-hydrant ladies spirals have falsely raised my hopes :lol:
  15. jlai

    jlai Title-less

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2002
    Messages:
    8,785
    Have a rule on pair footwork that needs to be unison skating during most of the sequence.
  16. julieann

    julieann Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    3,540
    No more tights over the boots unless you are a synchro team.
  17. Skate Talker

    Skate Talker Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2002
    Messages:
    4,844
    This is a very good idea for a topic. I just hope it isn't overtaken by facetious replies.

    I will have to think on this a bit to see what I come up with but so far am loving the blade-grab out the window movement, especially if it leads to less gloves being worn. Unfortunately it seems to me that the men are the bigger offenders here but few of them can even use the blade-grab as an excuse for it.

    I also like the idea of the bonus for completing the complete package of triples, and adding extra points to combinations above the individual values of the two jumps performed.

    The only idea that comes quickly to mind is that I would penalize the lifts that some Pairs teams do that are undoubtedly difficult but are just so very very ugly to look at. Imho the penalty can taken off choreography or even performance because for me they really break the mood of the skate, don't go with the music, etc.

    I would also like to ban the stomach-cramp dance lift. That's the one where the lady scrunches up over the man's arm in the rotational lift, hanging there all contorted as if in pain. One year I remember seeing this same lift in 4 or 5 dances in a row
  18. foreverkwanfan

    foreverkwanfan Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    I agree with all of these and will add:

    No tights over boots! Period, No exceptions!!

    and although I enjoy Sasha's skating, this one move always bugged me, I would ban it if I had such powers:
    http://www.skateygirl.com/nat2003/SrLadies/cohen/images/r68n29_jpg.jpg

    But more seriously, I would like to see points given for a sustained spiral as opposed to a spiral sequence where the spiral position is changed 2-3 times.
    A sustained spiral, one position, that is held, without wobbling from one end of the ice to the other should be given more points. IMHO
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2011
  19. Ozzisk8tr

    Ozzisk8tr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    Messages:
    3,929
    I think there should be a rule where if the mans butt looks pleasing to ones eye they must be made to wear illusion fabric pants at some stage (ponsero anyone?). The bonus could be they take me out to dinner that night. Seriously though, I wish they would drop the three jump combo rule and allow them to do more.
  20. Spazactaz

    Spazactaz New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2004
    Messages:
    1,812
    just curious.... for professionals wanting re-instatement, what IS the rule?
  21. shady82

    shady82 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Messages:
    473
    Changing underrotations to a GOE deduction instead of a downgrade. This would change so many results for the better, such as Nakano's 2008 Worlds placing.
  22. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,246
    Revising the step sequence rule (levels), so that they don't have to last forever (and at the speed of a tortoise with a bad foot) and do not have to use every turn ever invented. I preferred the pre-COP step sequences.
  23. Mafke

    Mafke New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,125
    points for jumps recalibrated to reward variety, so that you get X amount of points for the first triple (Whatever it is) and you get X + Y for the next different triple, X + Z (where Z is greater than Y) for the next different triple etc. Repeated jumps get the same amount of points as the first jump of that type.

    This would both reward having as many different triples as possible and also recognize the fact that different triples are of different difficulty for different skaters.

    Oh! And no more than two jumping passes in the SP with no other scoring element between them and no more than three together in the LP. That would help balance programs a little.
  24. Jaana

    Jaana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2002
    Messages:
    3,881
    I would like there to be a rule about judging: If a judge gives high PCS scores (reputation scores e.g. for choreography, transitions and interpretation) for something that does not exist, that judge will be banned for life.
  25. skatefan

    skatefan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    5,094
    And may I add to that the removal of the full body movement requirement to stop the random bobbing up and down, butt in the air (ladies and men), which imo adds nothing to a programme.
  26. Extranjera

    Extranjera New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2010
    Messages:
    151
    making combinations worth more points than single jumps.

    For example first jump in combination should be counted x 1.1 and 2nd jump x 1.3

    I wish there was a rule like this, it would encourage many skaters to take risk and do 3-3
  27. ciocio

    ciocio New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    578
    I agree with this rule but imo it would work only for transitions, choreography and interpretation are very subjective. :confused:
    My rule would be: skaters arenĀ“t allowed to work with the same choreographer for more than 2 seasons.:D
    Oh, and no donut spins for men,except Plushy in his prime:D, ok?
  28. GarrAarghHrumph

    GarrAarghHrumph I can kill you with my brain

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2001
    Messages:
    15,998
  29. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2011
    Messages:
    1,592
    1. I like combos having a multiplier.

    2. A special -GOE for elements with falls (-3 isn't low enough) with multiple falls specifically decreasing program components (one fall doesn't have to, two should, and three/four/five definitely should)

    3. Bring back the second leveled step sequence. It's funny watching what passes for footwork from some of the guys.
  30. barbk

    barbk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2002
    Messages:
    5,954
    Yes. And a straight line sequence should go back to being a straight line.

    Actually, I like pretty much all of the changes proposed in this thread.

    I'd also like to see the value of a double axel reduced, as well as reducing the values for all of the other doubles.

    And Amen to the end of the blade grab, other than in a Biellman spin.
  31. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2011
    Messages:
    5,562
    Oh my god, YES PLEASE.

    It depends on the nature of their "ineligible" status.

    Yes, me too. Steps like Yagudin's "Winter" sequences or Plushenko's circular in his MJ medley SP, which may not have been the most complicated step sequences ever invented but matched the music and theme of the program.


    I would like to see a rule against re-using your program more than once. If you've had an injury hit year the year before, that's okay. If you've become World Champion with the damn thing...
  32. olympic

    olympic Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2004
    Messages:
    6,970
    'Deregulate' PCS scoring - allow big fluctuations from component to component; example - Miki could receive an 8.25 for skating skills, but perhaps 4.0 for transitions, 5.5 for choreography, etc.
  33. Ladida

    Ladida Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2011
    Messages:
    126
    There should be a 30 points deduction in PCS for repeating same choreography for one more season.
  34. attyfan

    attyfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2003
    Messages:
    7,425
    This is a little more than just a new rule, but: I would like to see the points to be earned in the SP earned by perfection, with enough GOEs available so a perfect triple (or perfect basic layback spin) earns more points than a quad or "higher level" spin, whereas points may be earned in the FS on a slightly different system that would encourage a little more difficulty.
  35. DORISPULASKI

    DORISPULASKI Watching submarine races

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2002
    Messages:
    9,884
    A boost in points, either in GOE or base value, to recognize that a combo of a double jump is followed by a triple jump is harder than a triple jump followed by a double jump.

    I'd like this so that we can see more variations in combos-and perhaps a few skater would do a 2/3 who can't do a 3/3 or are perpetually underrotating the second triple.
  36. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,826
    I think the problem isn't the code. It's the fact that skaters aren't trying to do fast step sequences anymore. Remember in 2006 when Sasha and Irina were doing level 3 steps with good speed?
    I think that the slow sequences should result in lower PC's in composition and skating skills (since part of skating skills has to do with speed across ice)
  37. antmanb

    antmanb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2006
    Messages:
    3,270
    Another vote for getting rid of the full body momvement requirement in step sequences. Just because it's harder to do footwork with your head between your legs, it doesn't mean that it's good to watch or enhances the step sequence.

    I'm also in agreement that death spirals should lose the levels. It is the single element that has been ruined the most by COP. Why give greater points to a couple entering a death sprial in a shoot the duck, than a classic proper entrance which is so much more difficult than already beeing down close to the ice in a shoot the duck :mad: :mad:
  38. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,826
    What's a second leveled step sequence?

    Also, i think that falls should be penalizes more. Maybe have the -3 to +3 GOE and then if you fall, you get the equivalent of a -4 or -5?

    Also, bring back spirals. Maybe in the FS, you can say two step/spiral sequences. And I don't mean the 2 point spiral. I mean spirals that go from level 1 to level 4 so there's a reason for innovation.
  39. Erin

    Erin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2001
    Messages:
    4,922
    I like this one and think it should be recognized somehow that combos are more difficult than individual jumps. I'm having some difficulty with how to accomplish it. The best I can come up with would be either to have a multiplier for both the first and second jump of the combo (e.g. 1.1 for first jump, 1.2 for second) or only have a multiplier on the second jump (but might have result of over-encouraging double-triples at the expense of triple-triples). The one issue I have with both of these approaches is that I feel like the triple toe-triple toe is overvalued in the short program compared to a triple lutz-double toe, but maybe that's something I can get over. Having a bonus for a complete set of triples in the free might help compensate for this a little bit on an overall basis.

    I would also eliminate the 0.8 for sequences, which I always thought was rather unfair. It makes sense for a combo to be more than a sequence but not for an individual jump to be worth more than a sequence.
  40. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2003
    Messages:
    10,518
    Is this supposed to be a serious thread or a fun casual thread? Maybe we need one of each?