Grand Prix Assignments - 2013/14 Olympic Season

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, Jun 3, 2013.

  1. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    Jason's last two lps did lack a little excitement. Not sure what is meant by sugary and cartoonish. Riverdance has good transitions and Brown is more in tune with the music than many skaters who are going from jump to jump. I have no doubt the skaters with quads will end up with more points though.
    So I think he is good (or very good depending on how you rate his non-jump elements) and he will add variety to men's skating--unless we want all male skaters to be alike.

    I also think some US fans like the obskure skaters such as Jonathan Cassar because of their style, regardless of whether they will medal. While I am not a big fan of Cassar, I appreciate how the non-world medalists skaters get some fan following.
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2013
  2. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    For me what really sets him apart from everybody else is the quality of his programs. The complexity of the choreography, the amount of transitions, his timing. He has the whole package if there ever was one. Most male skaters don't come anywhere near him in those aspects.

    As Marco said:
    Brown is not the most skilled, "natural" jumper and he'll most likely never become a World or Olympic champion. But 20 years from now - if I am still alive ;) - I will definitely remember his programs.
  3. spikydurian

    spikydurian Well-Known Member

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    Why not? His peers include Hanyu, Han Yan, Farris, Gachinski, Ten etc. And of all the current 'teenagers', Hanyu currently stood out. Jason is only 18yo. By 2018, he may have his quads all ready to conquer.:)
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  4. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

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    Without wanting to sound like the demented uber, I am very curious to know why you said the bolded. What do you think is the "right" direction of men's figure skating and why isn't Jason a part of it?

    I'm also at somewhat of a loss to understand the "sugary and cartoonish" comment. Was Abbott's "Spy" "cartoonish"?

    At this point, I'm happy enough to enjoy his skating. He's got the triple Axel fairly well secure, he's matured a lot in his style and he's enjoyable to me. What will come will come for him. Maybe he won't ever make a Worlds team, or an Olympics; but he'd hardly be the first wonderful skater to do that.
  5. The Accordion

    The Accordion Well-Known Member

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    Congratulations on your official "arrival" Jason Brown! You are starting to get dismissed / defended / celebrated/ mehed on an FSU thread that isn't yours!
    :cheer:
  6. spikydurian

    spikydurian Well-Known Member

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    Yay, welcome to the REAL world of seniors!;)
  7. Lis

    Lis Member

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    My guess is... you have this opinion to make people argue about it here. ;)
    I saw Jason live for the first time at NT afew weeks ago andi can tell you he got a very possitive reception and reaction from the audience. He does have the whole package or will soon with a quad. Actually people around me where saying hey that could be the OGM 2018 we are watching now :) I personally say a big yes to his skating style,cjoreo with great transitions and that he is living the programs.
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  8. VarBar

    VarBar Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps the right direction in figure skating is contained in the Olympic motto 'Faster, Higher, Stronger.' Whether Jason is a part of this direction or not only time will tell. For now, his PC marks are not that impressive. Not for a skater whose "programs and non jump elements are all so difficult and he does them with such ease and quality, all the whilst in keeping with the music." I quoted Marco.

    I remember right after Jason had debuted his Riverdance program at a summer competition, someone stated he was soon to become the greatest figure skater of all time. Now someone else sounds pretty sure Brown will never even make the US team for Worlds and Olympics, much less win medals. Different crystal balls, different predictions. lol
  9. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    I think his PC marks are too low for what he does; likely because he is not a 'name'.

    I mean- he does a Y spiral into a triple lutz. For goodness sakes, I can't think of a more difficult transition.
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  10. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

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    I can. For a while there he used to pull it right above his head and grab his foot with the other hand. :p A regular Y-spiral is obviously muuuuuuuuuuuuuuch less difficult. :p
  11. Emdee

    Emdee Well-Known Member

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    He is a pleasure to watch indeed. However he lacks consistency and the jumps. Agree that he is not the saviour of men's figure skating......there is only one Patrick IMO.
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  12. Rob

    Rob Beach Bum

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    I far prefer the style of Brown/Cassar w/o the jumps to the men who do all the jumps with their shoulders glued to their ears.
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  13. Mrs. P

    Mrs. P New Member

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    I think the lack of consistency was mainly in the 3A. That's one jump and it was the jump he had struggled with the last few seasons. But to say he lacks the other jumps is not correct. His other main issue early last season was edge calls on the lutz, but he didn't get those calls by Jr. Worlds. In fact in his Jr. Worlds FS, he got +GOE for every jump, including his two 3As.

    For the record, I don't care to declare anyone the savior of figure skating. I just like the guy's skating and I do think he has a future.

    And YMMV regarding his live performances. Just got an email from a friend who was at Nebelhorn who absolutely thought he was delightful.
  14. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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  15. AJ Skatefan

    AJ Skatefan Well-Known Member

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    I'm wondering who these people are who said that Jason is the "savior of men's figure skating?"
  16. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    I found one :) just snipped out a few irrelevant parts.
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  17. Primorskaya

    Primorskaya New Member

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    You have a bright future in journalism. Or politics! ;)
  18. Emdee

    Emdee Well-Known Member

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    I only said he is NOT the saviour!
  19. Primorskaya

    Primorskaya New Member

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    "He is not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy!" - sorry, I can't ever help quoting Monty Python!
  20. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
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  21. toddlj

    toddlj Well-Known Member

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    I think he should remove all doubt, and skate to a medley of "the Feeling Begins" and "Jesus Christ Superstar" in a loincloth with a crown of thorns and red sequined "stigmata" gloves.
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  22. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    You forgot the yellow pants.

    I have no strong opinion about Jason one way or another. He's talented, but there are other talented young skaters. I wasn't as enthralled by his Riverdance program as some fans.
  23. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Of the Top Five on the SB list without two,

    Skate Canada would not be back-to-back for:

    • 22-Denney/Frazier (NHK)
    • 29-Wang/Zhang (none) -- if they're not out due to injury
    • 32-Della Monica/Guarise (TEB)

    If W/Z are out with injury, next on the list are Vartmann/Van Cleave, who are already at SC, and there are already three Canadian Pairs at SC.

    Martiusheva/Rogonov are at CoC the week after, and the fastest way from Saint John to Beijing is a little over 17 hours, with a connection in Toronto. Other flights are from 22-25 hours.

    For NHK, were Zhang/Wang assigned to SC, then no one would move into the Top Five, since all would have one. If anyone else on the list is assigned, then Kemp/King would move into Top Five. The possible choices without back-to-back events are:

    • Zhang/Wang (none) if they're in the Top Five; otherwise Kemp/King (none)
    • Vartmann/Van Cleave (SC)

    Denny/Frazier are already at NHK. Purich/Tran and Della Monica/Guarise are at TEB the week before and would need to travel from Tokyo. (The non-stop from Tokyo to Paris is over 17 hours.) Martushieva/Rogonov are at CoC. It's a 4-8 hour flight from Beijing to Tokyo with only a one-hour time difference, and they'd be replacing another Russian team and competing along with V/T.

    I think M/R should get NHK, if they don't have an issue with back-to-back trips that are no worse than SA to SC a little shorter than TEB to RC. They're the top of the SB list without two. Kemp/King already beat Takahashi/Kihara by 15+ points at Nebelhorn, and PB's of the other teams in the Top Five are at least 141.
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
  24. sandra_persch

    sandra_persch Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I am missing something but shouldn't Prölß / Blommaert be in the top 5 before Wang / Zhang?
  25. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Yes. They were 28 on the SB list last season (147.83 Annabelle PRÖLSS / Ruben BLOMMAERT GER World Junior Championships 2013 28.02.2013). Fortunately for her, the ISU Senior minimum age for the Grand Prix is still 14 this season - ETA link to their ISU bio: http://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00013958.htm
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
  26. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    I thought Prolss was not age-eligible for seniors, but Blommaert had aged out of seniors.

    ETA: If she is age-eligible, then the Top Five right now would be:

    18-Martushieva/Rogonov (CoC)
    22-Denney/Frazier (NHK)
    28-Prolss/Blommaert (none)
    29-Zhang/Wang (none) -- unless injured, in which case Vartmann/Van Cleave (SC) are the 5th
    32-Della Monica/Guarise (TEB)​

    Prolss/Blommaert with none could be assigned to either SC or NHK.
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
  27. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    Actually, I take that very flight when I go to Japan and it's more like 11-12 hours. And if you're flying from Japan to Europe it's not as bad in terms of jet lag as you land in late afternoon.
  28. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Apologies -- the 17 hour flight has a long stop. The non-stop flights listed on Expedia are very expensive: I can imagine the French Fed insisting on one of the 25-hour trips to save $$$.
  29. Hanna

    Hanna Wheeeeeeeeeee

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    She's not age-eligible for the ISU Championships but for the GP the age limit is still one year lower (14 instead of 15). IIRC that'll change for 2014-2015 and the limit for both the GP and the big champs will be 15 (July 1st, yadda yadda). Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
  30. sandra_persch

    sandra_persch Well-Known Member

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    All the best to Smirnov! Hope he recovers fully and quickly!

    I can't see the Skate Canada spot being filled unless the Russian Fed informs the ISU quickly and there is a pair in North America or Canada (training location) that could reach the location at a low cost.

    Still hoping Proelss / Blommaert will get one ;)
  31. Hedwig

    Hedwig Rarely here anymore but I try to be better!

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    Agree on all points.

    If you are blown away by his performance is a matter of taste. I was blown away at Nebelhorn but I loved him before already so his style suits my preferences.

    What is not a matter of taste is the complexity of his program in between the jumps. The guy did not just do some crossovers here and there but was in constant motion with different steps and ideas. It was breathtaking to watch.

    But if he will ever even get to Worlds? No idea. His jumps may be his downfall. Maybe not. Hard to say now. But if I say that I enjoy watching him I don't say at the same time that I think he will be World Champion in 2 years.
    I also enjoy watching Zoltan Kemelen. ;)
  32. dinakt

    dinakt Well-Known Member

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    Impossible to predict, of course, but re: Jason's jumps. He seems to be the type that takes a while to get a jump, but once it is in, it is more consistent than average. I don't see this year as him having trouble with triple axel; he lands it quite regularly in competition. So I am hopeful about Jason's World's prospects, at some point in the next Olympic cycle ( if not in this one, though who knows). Olympic year is wonderful for up- and- comers because there's a better chance to land 4CC or Worlds. Whether one is a fan of Jason or not ( I am), the quality of his skating deserves a long International season.
  33. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Kavaguti/Smirnov's names are crossed out from Skate Canada and NHK on the ISU site; ditto for Joshi Helgesson's at Cup of China.
  34. jiejie

    jiejie Active Member

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    Having made the journey many times, it's only 3.5 hour flight Beijing to Tokyo, one hour time difference is correct. Nobody in their right mind would do this as anything but a nonstop regardless of cost (hint: Expedia is not always the best source for Asia-based plane fares). It's an easy journey to make and very doable as back-to-back GP's. Tokyo to Paris is of course a much longer flight though westbound isn't that much of a jet lag problem compared to eastbound. I suspect the French Federation would use a nonstop flight cost in their calculations. But as a skater, back-to-back NHK then TEB wouldn't be my preference.
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2013
  35. toddlj

    toddlj Well-Known Member

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    With J. Helgesson out of Cup of China, just reminding us of the options. Since there are already 3 RUS ladies, Gosviani can't get this one. And of course Zhang and Korobeynikova are already there. So it's between Imai and Hicks (who seems unlikely as she is at SC the week before.)
  36. Stephanie

    Stephanie Well-Known Member

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    U.S. Figure Skating ‏@USFigureSkating 3m
    NEWS: Haven Denney and @Brandon_F1992 have accepted an invitation to Skate Canada.

    Happy for them...they seemed like the most logical option
  37. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Great to see that spot getting filled! :)
  38. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    From the GP Announcement:
    I've always been confused by the the bolded phrase above (which scores are meant?), but refer to kwanfan's explanation, now edited in below.

    2012-13 ISU Seasons Best Total Scores list:
    18 162.25 Anastasia MARTIUSHEVA / Alexei ROGONOV RUS ISU GP NHK Trophy 2012
    22 155.83 Haven DENNEY / Brandon FRAZIER USA World Junior Championships 2013 - invited to replace K/S at Skate Canada
    28 147.83 Annabelle PRÖLSS / Ruben BLOMMAERT GER World Junior Championships 2013
    29 145.56 Wenting WANG / Yan ZHANG CHN ISU Four Continents Championships 2013
    32 142.53 Nicole DELLA MONICA / Matteo GUARISE ITA ISU GP Rostelecom Cup 2012 (TEB)
    34 141.79 Mari VARTMANN / Aaron VAN CLEAVE GER European Championships 2013 (Skate Canada)
    35 133.56 Stacey KEMP / David KING GBR World Championships 2013 (0 GP)
    36 133.05 Britney SIMPSON / Matthew BLACKMER USA ISU JGP Austria 2012 (WD from Rostelecom Cup, their only GP)
    37 133.01 Jessica CALALANG / Zack SIDHU USA World Junior Championships 2013 (0 GP)
    38 131.26 Gretchen DONLAN / Andrew SPEROFF USA ISU GP Hilton HHonors Skate America 2012 (0 GP)

    ETA this reply from the U.S. Pairs thread:
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2013
  39. NadineWhite

    NadineWhite Well-Known Member

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    YEAH for an American Pair Team getting another Sr. GP event, Denney & Frazier! :encore:
  40. olympic

    olympic Well-Known Member

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    Mirai was sent to SC and CoC back-to-back two seasons back, I think. She actually had a good skate at CoC.

    But Imai would still be a much more logical choice, especially considering geography. But, both Hicks and Imai have won Senior B events this season. Hicks won w/ a bigger score but is ranked lower than Imai. Might the Chinese Fed. base their decision on who will be a bigger 'threat' to Li Zijun (IDK. Will she be there? Too lazy to look)