Fumie Suguri failed to qualify for Japanese Nationals again

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by tkaug, Nov 7, 2012.

  1. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    She did, and she wisely recognized it was then or never, that was her last chance, and instantly turned pro after the 1997-1998 season after a long and respectable amateur career, to cash in on her pro opportunities before it was too late. This is Tonia who for skating standards had stretched out her amateur skating career to the max as it was. Fumie who has had a far more successful career than Tonia has not had the same wisdom Tonia had about when to let go. Like Tonia in 1998, 2006 was Fumie's last chance to reach her major goals in the sport, and as it was she might have just missed (4th at the 06 Olympics, just off the podium, just missing the long awaited World gold). To stay for 1 more year to attempt to skate at Worlds at home in Japan was reasonable, but after that it has just gotten plain silly, and now post Vancouver it is now getting to the point it is borderline scary and one could even worry about her sanity at this point. If she were competing in adult competitions like Midori Ito that would be totally fine, but instead she not only competes at elite level competitions in Japan, a decade older than anyone else, but talks about wanting to go back to the Olympics when she cant even make it out of regional competition, do triples anymore, and is now getting 4s in components in regional competition, after reportedly already bankrupting her retired parents to keep doing this. Yikes! Sadly she has also missed the opportunity to have a nice professional career, something much lesser skaters like Jennifer Robinson have enjoyed, and help the financial burdens of her family.
  2. nylynnr

    nylynnr Active Member

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    I agree that Fumie's desire to compete is quixotic, but this statement is heavy on the hyperbole. Fumie is a frequent participant in shows -- she is doing one in Italy tomorrow -- and I don't know that she is turning down offers to train for Japanese regionals. Judging from her schedule I think she is doing all the shows she can and entering the regional competitions on the side, regardless of what she may tell the press in her infrequent interviews. Just my two cents.
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  3. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    There's often a big difference between another language spoken and another language written.
  4. Alex Forrest

    Alex Forrest Banned Member

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    Last edited: Dec 30, 2012
  5. Nomad

    Nomad Well-Known Member

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    Admins, could we please change the title of this thread to: "Fumie Suguri, the Norma Desmond of Figure Skating"? Thanks.
  6. all_empty

    all_empty Well-Known Member

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    I have spoken to Fumie several times and her English is better than your Japanese will ever be.

    In addition to her years in Alaska, she is extremely well cultured and traveled thanks to 15+ years competing. She's worked with Russian, Japanese and North American coaches and choreographers.

    She was tweeting, likely on a mobile device. She doesn't need to have perfect grammar.

    While I think her best competitive days are behind her, she's not hurting anyone by still competing.
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  7. tkaug

    tkaug New Member

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    You say she is not hurting anyone by still competing?
    How many times has she withdrawn competitions just a few days before so no other Japanese substitutes can compete? She also makes excuses for not winning, saying she had some injuries or an issue with her boots. That is not what senior skaters like her should do.

    By the way, I am a native Japanese speaker and I hear and see her news at the first place.

    She has also cancelled many ice shows in Japan so she totally deserves it that she is not invited to Ice shows in Japan anymore.
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  8. DimaToe

    DimaToe Well-Known Member

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    :confused: MANY elite level skaters give those reasons (injury/boot issues) when a competition doesn't go the way they want it to, whether it be true or not, I don't see why Fumie shouldn't be allowed to do the same :shuffle:
  9. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    tkaug, we get it. You hate Fumie Suguri or at least dislike so much that you want to spread bad gossip about her to damage her reputation.
  10. rayhaneh

    rayhaneh New Member

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    You forgot to mention she wrote the same thing word for word in Japanese, namely without the particles, which is strictly speaking grammatically incorrect as well

    Maybe her Japanese isn't that good either :lol:

    Or maybe we shouldn't judge her language ability based on tweets. Just saying.....And even if her English wasn't perfect, what's the problem?

    Then again, I am sure you'll have more reasons why we should hate Fumie that you can generously share with us
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  11. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. :shuffle:
  12. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

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    But, she is not ready for her close up yet.
  13. PeterG

    PeterG Argle-Bargle-ist

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    Oh no...I am in much, much pain. As is Alex Forrest and judgejudy27 and some of my other close and personal friends in this thread. The burden we carry is so powerful, our shoulders are being crushed down through to our ankles. You unfeeling people have no idea how deep our pain is.
  14. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    At least you have your friends with whom you can condole. :)
  15. Kasey

    Kasey Loving on babies!

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    I want to condole someone!! ;)
  16. PeterG

    PeterG Argle-Bargle-ist

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    Alex or Judy, take your pick. I am simply beyond condolicizing... :drama:
  17. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    Is Condaleza Rice making a come back (figure skating that is)?
  18. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    She's gonna skate pairs with Fumie Suguri, the many lesbian that she is.
  19. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

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    I really can’t understand why so many people criticize Fumie! If she wants to keep on competing – let her do so. I remember many people stating respect for Midori Ito showing up at the Adults competition in Oberstdorf. – Looks like she missed skating and competing very much, so she decided to compete again on a rather recreational level. If Fumie has the desire to keep on competing at elite level and it makes her happy, what’s wrong with it? Even if she pulls out at competitions last time, she is not the only skater to do so. There always have been nice competitors and nicer ones. ;)

    But then competitive behaviour of skaters is a different matter which has nothing to do with Fumie’s desire to keep on skating on elite level. By the way I remember that Sasha Cohen in her biographie told a very nice story about Fumie when competing at SLC OG in 2002 when Sasha forgot her tights and Fumie borrowed her tights to Sasha. :)

    Apparently Fumie loves to skates. As long as she is happy with it and not dissatisfied with her current results – let her do so in piece as long as she doesn’t harm anyone with it. Personally she has my deep respect for still trying her best! :respec:
  20. tkaug

    tkaug New Member

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    I don't mind if she is really trying hard as she used to, but I often see her post notes on Twitter that sound like she's not practicing so much but just playing around. This is exactly why she never gets good results in competitions lately, not because of injuries or boot issue or anything else. She takes a lot of chances that many other young skaters need more than she does by still keeping competing like this. If she is not serious, she should just quit.
  21. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

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    The big difference is that Ito decided to skated at a level that she should have skated at. Fumie isn't competitive anymore and shouldn't be skating on the Senior level anymore. It's becoming embarrassing.
  22. danafan

    danafan Canadian ladies über

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    What about the dozen or so skaters she beat at her regional competition? Should they all quit too? They aren't competitive at the senior level either :rolleyes:
  23. tkaug

    tkaug New Member

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    Most of them are students and have never competed internationally.
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  24. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

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    If Fumie does not feel embarrassed that she does not achieve the shape / results she was used to some couple of years ago, why do you or others? Personally I wish I could skate like she does now and I assume many people would be happy to even reach her current level. I also can’t see how she takes away chances of other skaters – if she takes somebody’s spot in competition, she obviously qualified for such competitions by simply skating better than other skaters who did not qualify. :rolleyes:

    It’s like with ballet dancers who do it for a living – not all are good enough to do it at Bolshoi. Still they might be good and worth watching. Everybody has the right to do what makes him happy. If others feel embarrassed, don’t look at it / try to ignore. ;)
  25. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    People would respect Fumie too alot if she entered adult competitions against people like Midori, that is what she should be doing do, not going the elite skater circuit while admiting to still chasing crazy crazy crazy (and about another 12 crazies are warranted at this point) ideas like going to the Olympics again.

    Exactly. Ito chose to come back for the love of competing and skating which she missed, and skate in appropriate competitions for his current skill level, realizing she is no longer the triple axel girl who would outjump the whole World. If she came back announcing she was going to win the Olympics, she would be laughed at too, and that despite that she is about the most loved skater on this forum and anywhere in the World. Fumie is doing it for more than the love of still skating, otherwise she wouldnt be saying in interviews she wants to make it back to the Olympics and needs to keep going until she does, and crazy things like that.
  26. yukky

    yukky New Member

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  27. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    Let's get this straight. You believe that Fumie Suguri is a washed up, over-the-hill figure skater who can't express herself in English very well and ought to quit the sport. So what do you do? You read everything she posts on Twitter, including all of her messages in English.

    Wouldn't it be better to be less emotionally invested in her personal affairs and stop reading her messages?
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  28. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

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    Well, people may have dream. I would like to land a double jump one time, but with starting skating as an adult, it’s almost certainly not going to happen, still I’ll try to move forward as far as possible. Fumie’s goals might not be very realistic, but then you’ll probably never reach the sky / your own limits with only setting yourself ultra realistic goals easy to reach.

    I guess a lot of people were laughing about Katharina Witt, when she announced her willingness to compete at 1994 OG, people possibly might have laughed about Paul Wylie if he announced that he is aiming to win a Olympic medal in 1992 a couple of years prior to that. ;)

    I too don’t think she has big chances to make the OG, but if she wants to try – let her do so in peace. Cause I think it’s one thing to discuss her low chances to make team and another one to personally insult her for this decision in a way like some people do. :rolleyes:
  29. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    The fact you find those reasonable comparisions is already enough reason to laugh outloud and immediately stop reading the rest of your post. PS- Witt was always atleast 75% likely to make the German Olympic team in 1994.
  30. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

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    Read it or not – I think your argument is pretty questionable, cause the reason of Witt’s higher chances to make the team was not having competed in top shape here and then at local amateur competitions over the years but having less fierce competitions at Nationals in her own country. So a skater, facing strong competition is less entitled to keep on competing? :rolleyes:

    It’s not like Fumie is harming anyone with not quitting, except maybe herself (her body certainly will take its toll). Makes me really wonder why quite a few people seem to have a personal problem with it. :confused:
  31. Alex Forrest

    Alex Forrest Banned Member

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    I was thinking the same thing, too. If Witt roared back into 93/94 stating her goal was to win the Olympics, I'd have thought she was bonkers too. No, she intelligently thought through it, knew that really only needed to beat either Szwewczenko or Kiellmann for a spot. Fumie has too many obstacles.

    So whatever, fine, let Fumie continue to deplete the family funds (clearly the college fund evaporated) if it gives her enjoyment. I'm not personally affected one way or the other. Just was giving my opinion on someone who hasn't given up the ghost it seems.
  32. Kelvster

    Kelvster Well-Known Member

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    Wow, so expensive!! I like to get lucky grab bags during NY (when I'm in Japan) ... but, as much as I like Fumie, I wouldn't want to spend 10,000 yen on a photo session with her. A lesson from her, maybe :p
  33. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    Simone Lang and Evelyn Grossmann both competed at German Nationals in 1994, as well. Evelyn never quite got back to her early 90's European Champ form and Simone didn't handle the pressure very well, but there was no way Katarina could have known that for a fact before she competed at Nationals. Making the 3-people team for Europeans that year to contend for two Olympic spots was not a foregone conclusion. Witt had to show up and perform well -which she'd been doing her whole career. However, I still think you're doing the German ladies at the time a disservice by limiting the contenders to just 3 skaters.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyGH1otirbM
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gF0J5lyqKvM

    ETA: didn't Simone Koch make a come back, as well? Not sure if it was in 1994, or a little later.
  34. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Fumie isnt even a National level skater anymore, she is a Regional level skater who cant do triples and scores in 4s in components in Regional competition. It is one thing to talk about being a real long shot to make a team, it is another when you arent even a skater could enough to compete at a National level event anymore. Suguri is a Masters type skater now, and if she wants to compete that badly, that is what she should be doing, just like the great Midori Ito now is, not bankrupting herself to keep competing as an elite in her 30s and talking about the Olympics when she cant even qualify for Nationals anymore.

    Your point on Witt is incredibly stupid. Witt was far more competitive period in 1994 than Suguri is now. Witt was 7th at the Olympics, if you plunk Fumie in a Worlds right now somehow my guess if she would probably finish about 40th considering she cant even make it out of Regional level events and that 2 years ago she was finishing almost dead last on the grand prixs she did, and presumably has declined alot more since then. The only realistic way she could hope to make a Worlds again is to acquire citizenship in some obscure country with no skaters at all (even ones with a very weak international skater would beat her out for the lone spot) somehow. Witt also did not sacrifice alot of her time and energy to keep competing amateur, she simply came back for 6 months to make a weak German Olympic team, compete at a final Olympics, then go back to pro competition.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2012
  35. Jeschke

    Jeschke Well-Known Member

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    weak? szewczenko finished 6th, witt 7th. nothing weak about that (the german fed would be amazed by such results now.)
    witt gained her spot, leaving marina kielmann at home who was the current european bronze medalist (medalled the years before too) and came in fourth at worlds'94. not to mention szewczenkos bronze 94.
    so witt obviously faced competition in germany (despite she surely had profit in her b-note)

    suguri skates today at the silvester-gala in oberstdorf. i'll try to watch (although i'm not a fan of exhbition shows) but i will try to report what she's doing).

    funny btw. I've been watching ski jumping right now. martin schmitt of germany is still alive, he is like suguri, so if he manages to crack in top30, who knows, maybe suguri will bounce back :cool:
  36. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Well I mean weak relative to what they were used to in previous years. The German ladies were definitely not the powerhouse they had been accustomed to in the 80s. They had several good skaters, even an again Witt whom was one of, but no possible medal contenders for Lillehammer (I know Szewcenko medaled at the post Olympic Worlds but that was a much weaker field).
  37. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    I agree their results were on a downward slide compared to the 80's, but they were actually improving compared to their early 90's outings, when Kielmann and Neske were finishing in the bottom top 10 at Worlds -and sometimes not even that. And, having Witt back brought a new level of media attention to the team that wouldn't have been there otherwise. I think Katarzyna's comparison was more about pointing out Witt knew she no longer was a medal contender, but she still came back and competed even when she knew her results wouldn't measure up to her gold medals in the 80's.

    Granted, Suguri isn't even likely to compete internationally for Japan now, but she's no longer training in Russia, seems to have have found some sponsors, and still enjoys competing for the sake of it. Sure, she brings up the Olympics in interviews, but how is that so much different than other skaters bringing up potential comebacks once the Olympics get close? We've been dissecting her career for a good 12-pages here, so if she's going for 'any publicity is good publicity' I'd say this is mission accomplished.
  38. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    The skaters who've been talking about comebacks are/have been at a much higher level in their own countries and have a reasonable shot to make their National teams. Witt might have faced formidable competition in her own country, and people may have doubted her, but, for most, there were few recent results that showed how unlikely the goal of making the Olympic team would have been for her, and, of course, had pros not been allowed back in, it would have been a non-starter for Witt. (There were many comments about how she would tarnish her prior Olympic history, and how unfair it was to come back as a pro, but her stated goal was to allow her parents to see her skate at an Olympics live, which they hadn't been able to do either time she won.) We're not talking about a half-dozen competitors for Suguri, where if the stars aligned, with a couple of injuries and/or meltdowns the podium is within reach, like with Zayak: we're talking about not being close to getting out of regionals. I don't think people would think Miki Ando is delusional for coming back for the Olympic season, especially since the Japanese Fed seems to consider Suzuki expendable.

    Has the Japanese Fed come up with selection criteria for the Olympic team? Suguri has no recent results outside her Nationals attempts.
  39. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    Should they choose to come back in earnest, I completely agree. I just think skaters sometimes say things like 'oh, I'm considering a comeback for the Olympic season' when there's no real intention to do so. Or the intention is there, but once the daily training grind kicks in, the motivation goes away, or old injuries take over. I was just pointing out Fumie might be fully aware she doesn't have a realistic chance of making the Olympics, but by talking about it, she feels this is one way to generate publicity for herself. Not sure why or what the end goal would be.

    ETA: No idea about the Olympic criteria, but for the past few years most spots were determined based on Nationals, and only one (if any) based on things like highest finisher at the GPF, or whatever might be the case. It looks like they learned their lesson from 2006.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2012
  40. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Just curious: Has Suguri repeatedly been quoted on the record about hoping to make another Olympic team? Or is what she said in the brief Japanese article linked in the first post of this thread (what did she say in it exactly?) merely being overblown by some?

    Suguri placed 5th at Toyko Regionals and made it to Eastern Sectionals where she placed 11th (top 10 advanced to Nationals), missing 10th place by 0.5 points. It is clear from the detailed protocols that she is no longer competitive with the elite ladies in Japan, but she almost qualified for Nationals this year! ;)
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2012