FSU Judging Game

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Jenna, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. Lainerb

    Lainerb New Member

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    I remember Scott(though he may not be the most trusted source ever) mentioning Irina's double+double during the warm-up for the LP and saying that although it was valued less that it still met the required element and that was the reason she was still in contention for a medal.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  2. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Judges:
    1- Lainerb (CHN)
    2- smarts1 (RUS)
    3- beepbeep (BRA)
    4- chipso1 (USA)
    5- doh (FRA)
    6- shady82 (ISL)
    7- Allen (NZL)
    8- Quintuple (CYP)
    9- Tony Wheeler (CZE)

    These are the judges for the game! Feel free to start judging now if you would like. Just PM me your GOEs and PCS for each skater when you are done. There are 12 programs.

    Regarding, the requirements, I am not 100% sure whether or not the double-double was allowed. Therefore, it will be called as 2Lz-2T and it will not be an illegal element, so it is not mandatory to give it a -3 GOE, unless, of course, you feel it is merited. Also, regarding a double jump out of steps. I believe we ran into this problem with the 1988 judging game. It is not necessary to assign -3 GOE. Those were the requirements of the time, and I won't penalize skaters who followed the requirements.

    Here are the programs again:

    Kwan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH6z-gwiSRc

    Lipinski: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBt7TGh3HWM

    Butyrskaya: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7RkX...eature=related

    Chen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxER4UaFxNA

    Slutskaya: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJKs2kaJlyc

    Bonaly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5G8rQl7L0g

    Gusmeroli: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0DxW_qe7Ps

    Kulovana: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IJmcZcGvrk

    Sebestyen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhqrbqJW7lM

    Lautowa: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbR-cl23MTY

    Human: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEueIqCn-zM

    Andrade: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umNBf3kC_RY

    Here are some judging guidelines:

    PCS Explanations: http://www.isu.org/vsite/vfile/page/...-0-file,00.pdf

    GOE Guidelines: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=1427

    Happy Judging! :cool:
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  3. Quintuple

    Quintuple papillon d'amour

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    Wait, so do we list the elements ourselves without the technical specialist?

    i.e.

    3toe: +1
    1st spin: 0
    Step sequence: +1

    SS: 6.5
    TR: 6.0

    etc.?
     
  4. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    You can just send the GOEs to me in the order of the elements, such as :0, -1, +1, -2...etc. You can send the components exactly as you have it there. ;)
     
  5. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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  6. Quintuple

    Quintuple papillon d'amour

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    Actually, that's good. I just remembered that real judges give GOE without knowing necessarily how the technical caller will call elements. I think I was spoiled by the NBC Olympic game listing out the elements ... which of course is interesting, as I wonder if they updated popped/changed elements and their point values. I remember thinking that some of the math was coming out funky.
     
  7. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Yes, gkelly and I are in the process of reviewing elements. We are almost finished. I have only received one judge's marks. Keep on sending them in! ;)
     
  8. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

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    I should have my marks to you by this weekend, Jenna. :)
     
  9. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Great! :D
     
  10. Tony Wheeler

    Tony Wheeler Well-Known Member

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    The starting order you have listed is the final short program results rather than the actual start lists :)
     
  11. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    ^ I've PMed you my scores. :)
     
  12. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I made it that way just to make my life easier when inputting the marks since I listed the videos that way. :D
     
  13. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for all of the judges who have responded so far. There are just a couple of you left to respond, and I have PMed these people. Unfortunately, a few people have had trouble viewing the video of Marta Andrade. Therefore, I will have to withdraw her from the competition. Looks for the results/protocols to be posted within the next few days. :)
     
  14. beepbeep

    beepbeep Taking homeless Fabian home

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    My marks are finally in! :)

    One thing I noticed palying these games is that the more you play, the quicker you judge. But that doesn't help me from getting really angry at the marks that the skater deserves vs. the ones I wanted to give to the skater
     
  15. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah, it is a lot of fun to do these games. You learn a lot. You tend to notice your favorites' weaknesses more clearly and your not-so-favorites' positives more clearly. It is a great exercise for fans all around. ;)
     
  16. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Some of the judges have to make minor corrections that I've PMed them about. I have most of the marks in at this point, and I should have the results up within 1-2 days. You dont't want to miss it. ;)
     
  17. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    Ladies and Gentlmen, the results are in! :D

    I wasnt to thank everyone who participated as a judge in this game, my awesome ATS gkelly, and Aussie Willy for providing invaluable helpful information. I hope you all enjoyed it. Start to think of ideas for the next round! ;)

    FINAL STANDINGS: http://www.4shared.com/document/EOXxIbAt/Ladies_SP_ResultWithClubNames.html

    RESULT DETAILS: http://www.4shared.com/document/s7TbDCec/Ladies_SP_ResultForSegmentDeta.html

    JUDGES SCORES (PROTOCOLS) :EVILLE: :http://www.4shared.com/document/bYM-OUZK/Ladies_SP_Scores.html

    Judges:
    1- Lainerb (CHN)
    2- smarts1 (RUS)
    3- beepbeep (BRA)
    4- chipso1 (USA)
    5- doh (FRA)
    6- shady82 (ISL)
    7- Allen (NZL)
    8- Quintuple (CYP)
    9- Tony Wheeler (CZE)
     
  18. kosjenka

    kosjenka Well-Known Member

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    This is so interesting!
    Hope you do more of these! Maybe 2002 Worlds ladies or 2002 Olympics?
     
  19. beepbeep

    beepbeep Taking homeless Fabian home

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    lol

    One thing that I like on these games is that, although there were a few scores that were far off from the others, the grades were pretty consistent among the judges for each skater.

    Thanks for putting this one together Jenna!! :cheer:
     
  20. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    Wow this was so interesting!

    I would definitely do 2002 Olympics SP for the Ladies. That event was amazing as far as the top 8-10 went... It would also be intersting to see how Michelle ended with her flip as well as everyone being annoyed at Sarah's 4th place SP.
     
  21. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    FYI, I believe Aussie Willy already ran the 2002 OWG Ladies SP. ;)

    2002 Worlds is a good idea!
     
  22. shady82

    shady82 Active Member

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    I think it would be interesting to do a CoP event judged under 6.0. How about an early CoP competition, such as the 2006 Olympic ladies SP/FP?
     
  23. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

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    That is an EXCELLENT idea. '10 had a lot of relatvely clean shorts...might make it interesting.

    '07 Worlds SP was also well skated.
     
  24. Allen

    Allen Glad to be back!

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    I think that sounds really fun as well.
     
  25. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

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    As an exercise judging under 6.0, may I suggest using a competition that people don't already have strong feelings about.

    Either a junior event, or focusing on middle and lower ranked skaters, instead of or in addition to the medal contenders.

    Of course what's available online also affects what we can choose to judge.

    But with 6.0 practice judging I just don't find that it's very useful or fun to go back and look at an event I already know the results of. There's too much temptation to try to justify or to second guess the official results.
     
  26. shady82

    shady82 Active Member

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    How about the 2006 US Nationals or Grand Prix Final? That would be better than events from more recent years, as programs have gone more astray from 6.0-style programs as the judging system continues to change.
     
  27. akkto

    akkto New Member

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    I always thought it would be very interesting to act as if we were judges in events under the CoP so we would have our own protocols to compare with the real ones. The levels would have already been assigned and we could do it with the four disciplines because with ice dance I think it´s very difficult to come up with levels of difficulty for the pre-2005 sequences and lifts.
    I´d love to judge for Spain :)
     
  28. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

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    What about 2002 Olympics SP Ladies!!! That was a very interesting event...

    Or perhaps a head to head battle of when the ladies from the 90-92 era skated clean. For example, we could judge Tonya's 1991 Nationals LP with Midori Ito's 1990 Worlds LP... Now that would be interesting.
     
  29. bartek

    bartek New Member

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    Are you going to do other competitions? What about 2002 Olympics Ladies SP?