FSU Judging Game

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Jenna, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    7,139
    313
    83
    So, I thought I would run an off season judging game just for fun. ;)

    RULES:

    A competition judged under the 6.0 system would be selected. People would volunteer to be judges and evaluate the programs under today's COP Standards. I actually have the ISU Calc. software on my computer as I downloaded it for an accounting school I will be attending. People could PM me their marks, I could enter them into the system and generate results and even protocols to make everyones' marks public! :EVILLE:

    We also need a technical specialist. Although most of the levels etc. would be 1, we would still need someone to point out under-rotations or downgrades or wrong edges. I could actually take on the role of TS if needed.

    Anyway, please post if you interest in participating in the game and if you are willing to become an official. I'm sure it would be a lot of fun. :D
     
  2. Lainerb

    Lainerb New Member

    2,737
    237
    0
    I am interested. We should do the 1998 Olympic Ladies competiton, both short and long programs.
     
  3. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

    2,103
    135
    63
    I want to judge!
     
    LynnW and (deleted member) like this.
  4. Spinner

    Spinner Where's my book?

    3,729
    627
    113
    Especially the short programs! Gonna start politiking now :sekret: :bribe: for Caryn Kadavy into 1st!
     
    LynnW and (deleted member) like this.
  5. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    7,139
    313
    83
    Great. I will start hunting for clips for Nagano SP.

    Judges :

    1- Lainerb (CHN)
    2- smarts1 (RUS)
    3- beepbeep (BRA)
    4- chipso1 (USA)
    5- doh (FRA)
    6- shady82
    7- Allen (NZL)
    8- Quintuple (CYP)
    9- Tony Wheeler (CZE)
    Also, pick a country in the ISU you want to judge for.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  6. Lainerb

    Lainerb New Member

    2,737
    237
    0
    :judge: CHN
     
  7. beepbeep

    beepbeep Taking homeless Fabian home

    3,734
    951
    113
    Great :)

    We've done the boys. Now we'll do the girls.

    Brazilian judge, here!
     
  8. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    9,012
    671
    113
    I'd love to judge, too. Can be the USA one :)judge:) if it's not taken already. :)
     
  9. doh

    doh Member

    254
    8
    18
    I wanna play. France please.
     
    LynnW and (deleted member) like this.
  10. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    18,134
    2,164
    113
    If you need any help with the software let me know. I have some manuals that I have done to teach people data entry here. Please PM me if you want copies.
     
  11. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    7,139
    313
    83
    Thank you! I will be PMing you shortly ;)

    Here are the videos that I could locate:

    Kwan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH6z-gwiSRc

    Lipinski: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBt7TGh3HWM

    Butyrskaya: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7RkXWq3gIc&feature=related

    Chen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxER4UaFxNA

    Slutskaya: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJKs2kaJlyc

    Bonaly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5G8rQl7L0g

    Gusmeroli: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0DxW_qe7Ps

    Kulovana: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IJmcZcGvrk

    Sebestyen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhqrbqJW7lM

    Lautowa: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbR-cl23MTY

    Human: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEueIqCn-zM

    Andrade: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umNBf3kC_RY

    Most of the top skaters and, to my delight, some obscure ones! If anyone else can contribute videos it would be much appreciated.

    TECHNICAL STUFF

    PCS Explanations: http://www.isu.org/vsite/vfile/page/fileurl/0,11040,4844-152086-169302-64121-0-file,00.pdf

    GOE Guidelines: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=1427

    Just to remind, a -3 must be given to an element that does not meet the requirements: a double-double, triple-double or triple-triple combination, a double or triple jump out of steps, a double axel, a layback spin, a flying spin in one position, a step sequence, and a change foot combination spin. Per 2010-11 rules, Spirals will not be called but feel free to include them into the transitions mark.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  12. shady82

    shady82 Active Member

    473
    31
    28
    I'm interested too =)
     
  13. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

    2,103
    135
    63
    Russian Federation!!
     
  14. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    10,801
    2,390
    113
    Count me in. If you need a tech specialist more than another judge, I can try to catch up on the latest rules.

    Spiral sequence was a required element in 1998. I'd have to research if the rules at that time required a change of foot and/or change of direction (both backward and forward).

    By last year's rules, almost all of the pre-IJS spiral sequences would be level 1 if they counted at all.

    By 2010-11 rules, spiral sequence is no longer an element in the short program. Skaters can do spirals, but they count as transitions.

    In long programs there's now the "choreo spiral sequence" element -- everyone gets the same base mark and judges distinguish the quality with GOE.

    What do you want to do about judging 1998 programs by 2011 rules? Consider the spirals transitions? Use the (long program) choreo spiral sequence rules? Use last year's SP rules for spirals?
     
    LynnW and (deleted member) like this.
  15. Allen

    Allen Glad to be back!

    13,141
    2,380
    113
    I also want to judge, I would like to be the New Zealand judge.
     
  16. Spinner

    Spinner Where's my book?

    3,729
    627
    113
    :lol: I was just wanting Caryn to be placed first, not volunteering to judge. I don't know COP well enough to be that skilled yet. Looking forward to the results though! :)
     
  17. Seerek

    Seerek Well-Known Member

    3,530
    179
    63
    We did the 1988 ladies sp a few months ago.... I believe Ito and Kadavy were top 2. :)
     
  18. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    7,139
    313
    83
    I would love for your assistance as a technical panel member. :)

    As far as spirals go, let's use the rules for the 2010-11 season. I always like to stay up to date. The spirals will not be called, judges, but feel free to include them in the TR mark.

    I also updated the judging panel, sorry for assuming Spinner. :) We need two more judges to begin.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  19. Allen

    Allen Glad to be back!

    13,141
    2,380
    113
    Yeah, I'm pretty sure Ito won with Kadavy second.
     
  20. Spinner

    Spinner Where's my book?

    3,729
    627
    113
    Was that a poll or an actual COP analysis from people who know it well? I loved both programs, but would have to tip it to Kadavy based on stronger spins and transitions and better component scores.
     
  21. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    9,012
    671
    113
    It was a judging game that AussieWilly ran.
     
  22. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    18,134
    2,164
    113
    Yes it was a judging game that I put together. People got to play judge. They submitted their marks and then the data was entered into the program ISUCalc that is used to run the judging system (done manually). Interesting thing was that people learnt how hard it is to be a judge.

    Glad that Jenna is doing the next one. I won't have time to do it but I will certainly be interested to see the results.
     
    LynnW and (deleted member) like this.
  23. Lainerb

    Lainerb New Member

    2,737
    237
    0
    How would issues such as Bonaly being one revolution short on her flying spin come into play under COP? Would it be reflected as having no value or would we apply -GOE?
     
  24. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    7,139
    313
    83
    Well, I believe the minimum under COP is 3 revolutions isn't it? It would be called a FSSp1.
     
  25. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    18,134
    2,164
    113
    Judges would need to consider what GOE they would give for a underrotated spin. If it is less revolutions than required, you could consider giving it -1 for each lack of rotation.

    If the Technical Panel consider that there are not enough revolutions for a level, they would then call it as a spin with no level. But it is not up to the judges to decide that and the judges still have to apply a GOE (which would most likely be -3). The system will recognise that they element has been given no level and will make sure it is a non-valid element.
     
  26. shady82

    shady82 Active Member

    473
    31
    28
    May I represent Iceland? If Iceland isn't in the ISU, then Norway..
     
  27. Quintuple

    Quintuple papillon d'amour

    2,574
    516
    113
    I'd like to judge! I think I've played 2 or 3 of these games here on FSU. I'll be Cyprus! CYP!
     
  28. Tony Wheeler

    Tony Wheeler Well-Known Member

    2,485
    183
    63
    If there is room, I'd love to play as well. I guess I'd represent CZE. :)
     
  29. Lainerb

    Lainerb New Member

    2,737
    237
    0
    I guess I am still uncertain about this sort of situation. Under the 1998 rules a double+double still met the critera for the two jump combination, but it resulted in a much reduced base value. I understand that under the current system a skater can't do double+double, but since this was during 1998 shouldn't we allow the combo without the mandatory -GOE?
     
  30. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    10,801
    2,390
    113
    I do not believe that double-double combination was still permitted in 1998.

    What was still permitted was a double as the solo jump out of steps. So should that be judged as a valid element, not necessarily -3 GOE as it would be by today's rules?