Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by allezfred, Aug 18, 2013.
It's honestly just between Kovtun and Plushenko for the sole Sochi spot, no?
The Team Event spot is honestly Plushenko's as long as he can stand on two legs, no?
Drop the word "honestly"
I do feel sorry for all three - Voronov for being denied the chance in 2010 (I mean, where did Borodulin go after Vancouver!); Gachinski for losing much love from the authorities so quickly after bad performances in Nice; and Menshov, well, for never making the world team (and for being left out of the European team last year of course ... we've heard so much about that).
But I certainly respect them all - Voronov for his perseverance and being able to "sort his head out" and being a solid competitor most of the time; Gachinski for improving his artistry and style; and Menshov for not giving up in spite of being an old man.
I have to add though that Kovtun is (as far as this season is concerned anyway) living up to the hype. In a way, it's no fault of his own that he gained all the love from the Federation as a result of being Tatiana's star pupil (and pet). And while I think Kovtun does need a LOT of improvements in different areas, it does make sense, at this point in time, to send him to Sochi (if Plushy doesn't make it).
But then again, Plushy may decide to go anyway so this Kovtun, Gachinski, Menshov and Voronov can all sit in front of their TVs next February.
This is one of the most interesting aspects of this team event going into the Olympics - the competition itself is a joke - if I understand the rules properly the Russians have one spot for the men's event at the Olympics and so they have to have the same skater skate both segments of the team event and then skate the individual event. But they can name alternates - so if Plushenko is named to the Russian team could he really skate four times in competition in less than two weeks? does Plushenko skate the team event as a favour to him by the Russian Federation and then pull out of the individual event because of injury? - which would be easy to back up, or does Kovtun skate the Team Event and then withdraw to allow Plushenko to skate the individual event? - and will the ISU/IOC allow these switches to happen?
It would be great if someone could ask this to someone invovled in writing the rules! Plushenko needs major rest time after he competes every time! Maybe a little surgery after each time!
The rules are clear: if a country enters the TE, and has one skater for a discipline, that skater is expected to do bith the TE and the individual event. Each team can enter substitutes by the 27 Jan 14 date, who don't get Olympic housing unless they are called to sub. (I don't remember if the same is true of credentials.)
There can be substitutes, just as Emily Hughes substituted for Michelle Kwan in Torino. Substitutes aren't limited to disciplines where there are only one entry. Any athlete can get hurt in official practice, come down with a sudden flu or food poisoning, or trip off a curb walking down the street. It could happen before, during, or after the TE or before or during the individual event.
What isn't published is by what date/triggering event substitutions can be made. Russia will enter substitutes for their athletes. If Plushenko is in no shape to skate after the TE, he can withdraw from the individual event. If the withdrawal is by the deadline, a substitute will take his place in the individual event.
What he couldn't do as the single skater in his discipline is be entered in the Men's spot, and refuse to skate the TE, with Russia entering the TE with Dance, Pairs, and Ladies. Then he'd be barred from participating in the individual event, which does not apply to his situation: if he had only wanted to skate the individual event, then Russia could stage a Gutsu and have the TE man be injured and Plushenko would step in as alternate.
I assume the Russian Fed learned from its mistake of having submitted his name as a participant in 2010 Worlds, instead of listing him as a substitute, and letting him decide right before the deadline if he wanted to skate and swapping out a participant, which would have avoided the whole suspension thing.
This Team Event is so much horseshit. I bet over half involved don't really feel up for it anyway, but of course they can't say anything about it.
Julia Lipnitskaya SP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMvU0sOYJKI
Finally a promising new Partnership for Nodari Maisuradze
they finished 5th in CoR
Antipova / Maisuradze FS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hAD7SV6NFA
with a quadruple twist
That's three teams doing it now then! Peng-Zhang, Sui-Han and Antipova-Maisuradze. How exciting!
I wish Antipova-Maisuradze got rid of the sbs doubles though. She used to be a singles skater, not particularly gifted the way the current juniors are (she didn't qualify for Russian nationals) but I did see somewhere on youtube a video of her doing a program with 3T-3T. So I am not sure why they do now double-double combination.
I have to say that I didn't like Antipova's skating last year because she kept regularly looking down on the ice and didn't project at all, but this year it has been fixed and she improved a lot. She is only 15 or 16 so she may not have finished with puberty but if she doesn't grow and doesn't start struggling with her jumps, I can imagine that they could seriously fight with Bazarova-Larionov and Stolbova-Klimov for their spots.
And I think next season Tarasova-Morozov, Gainedt.-Bitch and Davankova-Deputat have to move to seniors. It will be quite overcrowded in Russian pairs on the senior level. I think we will see now Martiusheva-Rogonov and Gerboldt-Enbert less and less.
They are looking really good so far. He mentioned next season trying a throw quad and both of them doing a triple lutz. They seem very ambitious. I just hope they stay with their coach.
Then how about ACTUALLY. With Kovtun making GPF and pulling in huge scores, he has more than justified his spot at Euros, Olympics and Worlds.
Kovtun pulled in one huge SP score; his highest FS score this year is 40 points off the leader. There are four American men with higher FS scores this season. Plushenko's LP score at Volvo Cup was 15% higher than Kovtun's, and his SP score, without two quads, which more than made up the difference in their SP scores. More importantly, last season, when the pressure was on, he couldn't place Top 12 to retain two Men's spots for Russia.
I think it's too soon to call Kovtun's place justified, especially when, internally, they've told Plushenko what he does and doesn't have to do to own the spot.
Oh sure, sorry I wasn't clear but I meant AFTER Plushenko. If Plushenko decided not to, or simply can not, skate either the whole Olympics or the individual event, one Russian man will have to step in.
And Kovtun has it all over the likes of Menshov, Voronov and Gachinski at this point with his 2 silver medalsand averaging 239 on the GP circuit. Menshov's SB was 223, Voronov 221 and Gachinski was 211.
By 'justified' I mean even if he doesn't win Russian Nationals, he is still going to be Russian's best bet for the highest placement if Plushenko couldn't make it.
I am quite taken with Antipova/ Maisuradze. Here is their EX from Cup of Russia: http://youtu.be/dwkiOketHL8
For a pair who has not been together for very long, and with Julia being so young, that is both expressive and intricate.
They also seem to get along ( knock on wood). I wish them great luck.
Rostelecom Cup was the first time I saw them skate, and I liked them too. I'd say their LP/FS is even more expressive, although it's not everyone's cup of tea for sure. I hope that everything goes well for them and they develop into a great pair.
They are now coached by Artur Dmitriev full time
and have left their previous coach evil Pavlova
now bring in more quad twits and quad throws
She actually reminded me of a 16 year old Elena Berezhnaya (yes, you read me correct; at 16 Elena had quite a personality on the ice- she was skating with Shliakov and at that time they seemed like a very promising pair)
Maxim Staviski assesses ice dance so far this season: http://sochi2014.rsport.ru/sochi2014_analytics/20131126/703635989.html
Russian Figure Skating Federation has announced the roster for Univesiade: http://fsrussia.ru/news/943_shest-r...i-shest-par-vystupyat-na-zimnej-universiade/#
Ladies: Maria Artemieva, Sofia Biryukova, Sofia Mishina, no alternates
Men: Moris Kvitelashvili, Gordei Gorshkov, Zhan Bush
Alternates: Vladislav Sezganov
Pairs: Ksenia Stolbova/Fedor Klimov, Evgenia Trasova/Vladimir Morozov, Natalia Mitina/Yuri Shevchuk
Alternates: Anastasia Martyusheva/Alexei Rogonov
Ice dance: Ksenia Monko/Kirill Khaliavin, Viktoria Sinitsina/Ruslan Zhiganshin, Alexandra Stepanova/Ivan Bukin
Alternates: Valeria Zenkova/Valery Sinitsin
mitina/shevchuk chosen and martiusheva/rogonov alternates? any reasons for that or just ouch?
Anastasia wrote on Twitter that their coaches declined the offer.
thanks for the news about m/r.
so summarizing staviski:
gold is between d/w and v/m; he feels v/m's free dance is lacking somethign special, which may/should be fixed by the time of the olympics.
p/b are more interresting than last season, but not as before; will be a fight for bronze, with the 2 russians and weaver poje. weaver/poje may be sacrificed by the canadian fed in the fight for v/m's gold; hope i understood it here correctly. he liked w/p free dance a lot. cappelini/lanotte are good but not special this year and might not interverne in fight for bronze.
3rd russian spot between r/t and m/k. few words about stupid mistakes of m/k in this years competition , but at rostelecom they were on track; s/z are great skaters but may have no chance this years, they are kinda junior to him, next year, they may bfight for 3rd.
b/s and i/k are almost on the same level; so we will see who will get it, mental strength important too
I was really impressed with this pair too. How long have they been together? Their unison was quite good. Will be interesting to watch them develop- with the age difference its a bit like a "kid skating with an adult" at the moment, which limits them stylistically, but that will sort itself out in time as she grows up.
Have you seen her? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BA3nT5ZM20
Elizaveta Nugumanova. Her DOB is 25.8.2002 so she will be junior age eligible in 2016-2017.
Very cute. But what is her music? It's so familiar, it's killing me!
At least some of it is from the soundtrack of Anastasia.
Very cute and lovely to watch.