Frank Carroll new student...

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by inthemiddle, Apr 16, 2010.

  1. loulou

    loulou Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2005
    Messages:
    1,735
    The two points are not subsequential, imo.

    Let's see:
    Carroll might have decided to go for corruption only after having repeatedly failed the other way.
    Or he might have developed good corruption skills only after a numer of years (corruption is indeed some kind of talent, some people are better than others, some are naturals, and some are just not capable of doing it).
    Or he might have had the right mixture of corruption-kid talent-performances just after a number of attempts.

    Mind you tho: I'm not saying I think Carroll bought judges. I'm just pointing that the fact he only won OG this late in his coach career is no indication he didn't.
  2. gratefulmkfan

    gratefulmkfan New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2004
    Messages:
    47
    Maligning Frank Carroll is just so not cool. He's an internationally respected coach of the highest level, and he is known for his good character. If Frank ever paid off anybody, I would give up watching figure skating. That's how much trust I have in Frank's integrity.

    I love Dennis Ten, and I think he will do well with Frank if he's willing to put in the hard work. He's very talented, but that alone won't get him anywhere. There's no substitute for practice, practice, practice. See Kostner's results the past few years for proof thereof. Frank believes in full program run-throughs, sometimes several times a day, depending on where the skater's at. That's why Michelle, Evan and Mirai did/are doing so well working with Frank. They are all willing workers, disciplined athletes, who listen to their coach. I hope Dennis is also, and I look forward to seeing the good results.
  3. Hedwig

    Hedwig Rarely here anymore but I try to be better!

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2006
    Messages:
    17,417
    I think you can call Kostner a lot of things but definetly not a slacker. This girl practices her butt off.

    But on topic: I am so happy that Ten got away from Tarasova. He is an incredible talent and I wanted to run away from my screen or from my place in the rink every time he skated his horrendous programs last year. They SO did not fit him. Especially the short program. Shudder.
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2010
  4. zaphyre14

    zaphyre14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2002
    Messages:
    4,637
    There is no way Frank Carroll "bought" judges. Period. The man's intergity has NEVER been questioned. And never will be. To suggest otherwise only reveals the poster's total ignorance of the man and his character.

    Why do people find it so hard to believe that Evan won through hard work and intelligent use of the rules currently in place? Frank succeeds as a coach because he is smart and focussed on bringing out the best in all of his skaters, not just the champions.
    CynicElle and (deleted member) like this.
  5. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2010
    Messages:
    10,242
    Agree about Kostner. The same is true of Tomas Verner, he skates like 6 hours a day. I've actually seen him skate practice sessions and he's amazing. Just because these skaters are nervous and bomb competitions, doesn't mean they slack off in practice.

    Also agree about Ten, his SP this season was still amazing despite the awful music choices because he's so talented, and he just turned 17, he's super young and already so good! Excited to see how Carroll handles him.

    And Carroll def does not bribe the judges or whatever. He's one of the best coaches around and he has always had tons of students. That's nothing new.
  6. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Reposting from the U.S. Senior Men's thread in the Trash Can:
    At last count: Lysacek (for now), Mirai Nagasu, Denis Ten, Jonathan Cassar, Drew Gonzales, Kristiene Gong, Ellie Kawamura, Leah Keiser (novice champ)...
  7. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2003
    Messages:
    10,523
  8. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Edited in now. :)
  9. sk9tingfan

    sk9tingfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,944
    Wasn't Lainey Diggs one of his as well? Did she retire or change coaches?
  10. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Laney Diggs switched from Frank Carroll/Christa Fassi after 2010 Nationals to Ivan Dinev/Angela Nikodinov but, last I heard, is taking time off from competitive skating (haven't seen an official announcement, though).
  11. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2009
    Messages:
    2,021
    ^ What about Danielle Kahle?

    I really liked her style and her jumps when I saw her last at nationals, but I haven't heard about her since.
  12. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Kahle hasn't been coached by Carroll since the 2007-2008 season (when she last made Nationals and placed 12th). Her last international was Finlandia Trophy in October 2008 and Charlene Wong was her coach there, as well as at Sectionals in November 2008 (also Sectionals in November 2009? she was 6th). I haven't heard if she is planning to continue competing.
  13. ChibiChibi

    ChibiChibi Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2007
    Messages:
    444
    Laney was judging at the All Year Competition a few weekends back.
  14. Lanie

    Lanie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2003
    Messages:
    4,647
    Danielle is coaching at Easy Street Arena (well, now it's the Simi Valley Iceoplex) in Simi Valley, CA. She's not competing anymore, as far as I know. She coached one of my group classes a few months ago, heh.
  15. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2009
    Messages:
    2,021
    :(........... I loved her skating. Hopefully, she'll bring some good skaters up into the ranks.
  16. crzesk8dad

    crzesk8dad Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2005
    Messages:
    464
    I spoke with Laney at the All Year Club competition (not GW, Club comp) where she was judging (you can have anyone judge at a Club comp, it's not USFSA sanction and AY uses this as a way to start or try new potential judges). Laney said that she is going to UC Berkeley (Cal) this coming school year and will continue to skate some (a few times per week), but will be concentrating on her studies.

    Best of luck to her. I hope that she comes back on to the skating scene, once she feels comfortable with her new academic career.
  17. deedeelocks

    deedeelocks xx

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2002
    Messages:
    5,259
    Nah, the actual skating is more like 3 hours a day. In Oberstdorf Tomas had sessions of 1.5 or 1 hour, and then 2 or 3 a day.

    but of course there is the warm-up, stretching, off ice training, ballet, dance class etc.
  18. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2010
    Messages:
    10,242
    So on Yuna's ISU bio, when it says 48 hours/week, it doesn't mean that she's actually SKATING for 8 hours a day, 6 days a week? That would maybe be too much skating. But what else would she be doing? Would it be like skating for 4 hours, cardio for 1 hour, weights/personal trainer for 1 hour, stretching for 1 hour, and like a dance class for 1 hour? That would be 8 hours. Seems like these skaters do a lot of extra stuff in addition to skating.
  19. deedeelocks

    deedeelocks xx

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2002
    Messages:
    5,259
    I don't know about Yu-na, but Tomas usually has ballet, Modern dance, stretching, powertraining, balance, cardio, warm-up, cooling down...stuff like that... in addition to the skating. But not everything every day, and in summer the off ice activities are a lot more intense than in the season. (atleast, in the past, in Oberstdorf...)

    don't forget that warm up and cooling down also take some time...and if you have 3 sessions a day...
  20. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2010
    Messages:
    10,242
    Oh cool, that sounds like a lot of fun/intense stuff! As for Yuna, I kind of doubt she skates for 8 hours a day, I think I saw a video where the announcer said she's on the ice for about 3 or 4 hours a day. I assume she does all that other stuff as well, there's a youtube video of her doing hip hop dance, she's really good at it :)!
  21. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2002
    Messages:
    20,569
    I would assume she trains for 7-8 hours a day total. So that's skating plus all the off ice stuff.
  22. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Kristine Musademba's USFS/Icenetwork bio has been updated, and it lists her new coaches as Frank Carroll, Ken Congemi and Christa Fassi. Her club is still listed as Washington FSC (South Atlantic region).
  23. sk9tingfan

    sk9tingfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,944
    Doesn't appear that Frank will be retiring any time soon!
  24. orbitz

    orbitz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2004
    Messages:
    9,826
    So Congemi is back coaching? Didn't he walk away from it for a year or two?

    That's a lot of highly priced coaches to be on one's payroll at any one time :eek:.
  25. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

    Joined:
    May 24, 2003
    Messages:
    19,441
    I, too, was surprised to see Congemi's name.
  26. zaphyre14

    zaphyre14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2002
    Messages:
    4,637
    Unless Frank's raised his rates dramatically since Evan's Olympic win, he's not THAT high priced (as in I knowcoaches with way less credentials than Frank has who charge a whole lot more). Frank's not as low as Priscilla Hill, now, but he's still in the reasonable hourly rate range.
  27. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2004
    Messages:
    9,001
  28. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Mirai Nagasu's coaches are listed in her USFS bio as "Frank Carroll, Ken Congemi, Galina Barinova, Sondra Holmes." It's pretty common for skaters to have one or more secondary coaches in Southern California because of the different rinks they often must travel to and train at.

    The summer training camp at the El Segundo rink (Toyota Sports Center) has just ended, and Frank Carroll is moving his coaching base back up the mountain to Ice Castle in Lake Arrowhead.
  29. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    7,139
    Wow. Another girl for Eastern's who moved to Carroll. Well, this will free up the Eastern section even more!
  30. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2003
    Messages:
    10,523
    Not if she still represents the Eastern club.
  31. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    As I posted above, Musademba still lists her club as Washington FSC, so it remains to be seen if she will be competing at South Atlantic or Southwest Pacific Regionals. Her Cup of China GP assignment does give her a bye through her Sectional, though.
  32. skateycat

    skateycat Minecraft Widow

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2001
    Messages:
    1,718
  33. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    7,139
    Oh, I see. However, can't some skaters obtain permission to compete in a different region if their main training base is located there? It seems unlikely that Kristine would fly home just to compete at Eastern Sectionals. Now that I think about it....Pacific Coast Sectionals are also full of talent...Dobbs, Diggs, Gong, Kawamura, Zhang, Zhou, Lam, Davis..etc.
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2010
  34. sammyf

    sammyf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2005
    Messages:
    2,191
    Sylvia just posted 2 above you that Kristine has a bye through sectionals so she won't need to compete there.
  35. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    7,139
    Oh. I thought she meant that she had a bye TO her sectional not through it. ;)
  36. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,977
    No, you have to skate in the region your club is in. But it's easy enough to change clubs if she wanted to skate out of Pac Coast.
  37. Jenna

    Jenna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    7,139
    Not sure about that one. I recall a skater a few years ago skating at North Atlantics and representing the Skating Club of Boston.

    ETA: Ahh....here she is. Rachel Hoang (SCOB) skated in Juvenile Girls CIR B.

    http://web.icenetwork.com/events/detail.jsp?id=34495

    So there must be some rule about this.
  38. 2sk8

    2sk8 Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    Messages:
    761
    There is a different rule for Juvenile & Intermediate skaters in the US (who advance to Junior Nationals) - basically, they can compete in the region of their home address or their primary training location. Sounds like Rachel might have been in that situation. It's home club for Novice, Junior & Senior skaters.
  39. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,221
    Yes, it's Rule 3102 in the USFS rulebook.
  40. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,977
    As was said, Juvenile and Intermediate have a different system. I didn't bring them into it so as not to complicate things. :D

    Basically, they have to skate out of the region they are training in.