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changing back to 7 ft rockers

Discussion in 'Moves In The Field' started by treesprite, Dec 8, 2013.

  1. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    I think I need to switch back to my 7-ft rocker blades. Since getting the skates with 8 ft rocker blades, I still can't do everything I could do on the 7 ft ones, and seem to have gone backwards instead of progressing.

    Tonight I took off my skates and put the old ones on (boots are the same type and size)., went back on the ice, tried to do some 3-turns and mohawks. It was so much easier.

    So I will talk to the skate guy Monday about switching the blades (the "old" ones have only been sharpened like 6 times). I think my skating will improve as soon as I adjust back to the blades.

    Has anyone else had to switch back to an old blade when the new ones turned out to be more of a problem than a help?
     
  2. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    I switched back to Coronation Aces after being in Pattern 99's for a few years. I got the Pattern 99's from a younger skater who outgrew her boots really quickly so they were a very good deal. I just didn't want to pay $500 for a new pair once they started getting flat, so I went back to Coronation Aces, which is an 8' to 7' rocker switch. Spins took some adjusting (laybacks are still not fully back), but I also thought turns were easier once I went back to a shorter radius. Although, to be fair, my old blades were so flat, that might have something to do with ease of turning, as well. Sometimes new blades/boots don't work out as planned, so going back to the old ones could be a good idea.
     
  3. overedge

    overedge not your emotional support turkey

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    I did the same thing as ioana, with the same blades. Not only were the Pattern 99s more difficult to skate in, I wasn't impressed with the quality. It turned out that one blade was not 100% straight, which I guess you could adjust to if you'd never known anything different, but which was really a problem for me. And that kind of manufacturing defect isn't something that even the best skate technician can compensate for. Since I've seen kids do everything up to and including triples on Coronation Aces, I'm quite happy to stay with them.
     
    ioana and (deleted member) like this.
  4. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    Mine are also Coronation Ace blades. They must be decent blades if so many people are switching back to them.
     
  5. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    Is the general consensus that once your 7' blades have been sharpened flatter, that you should just go back to Coronation Ace because your 7' flat is basically a Coronation Ace?
     
  6. LilJen

    LilJen Reaching out with my hand sensitively

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    How long have you been on the new blades? I'd give it *at least* a couple weeks--several hours of ice time--before throwing the towel in.
     
  7. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    Where do you see any consensus like that? We are talking about changing from an 8 ft rocker blade to a 7 ft rocker blade, due to not being able to adjust to the 8 ft rocker. The 8 ft rocker blades are flatter than the 7 ft rocker blades, so the change is to a less flat blade, not a flatter blade.

    I've been using them since April. I think that's enough time to figure it out.
     
  8. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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  9. LilJen

    LilJen Reaching out with my hand sensitively

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    oh yeah, for sure. Good luck with the new old blades! :)
     
  10. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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  11. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    Excuse me for misunderstanding. It is difficult to switch rockers whether it is 7 to 8 or 8 to 7. You have to re-learn to skate, essentially.
     
  12. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    That is certainly how it seems.
     
  13. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    Well, the deed is done. I have the Coronation Ace blades on the newer skates now. I was skating in my old skates because I didn't want to skate on the Matrix blades knowing I was going to switch them. If anyone wants a pair of pink Matrix Legacy blades, let me know (they were only sharpened 3 times).
     
  14. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    How many times can you sharpen a blade before it's no good? Someone said if a blade has been sharpened so many times, it is no longer that blade anymore.
     
  15. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    I think they get a hair flatter each time sharpened, but theoretically as long as there is metal that isn't so narrow it will break, a person could skate on the same blades for many years. Some of the rental skates where I work can't even be sharpened because there is not enough blade to fit on the holder (we're about to get a lot of replacements, thank goodness).

    One of the reasons I liked the idea of having the Matrix blades is that the metal is harder so they don't have to be sharpened as often.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2013
  16. overedge

    overedge not your emotional support turkey

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    The problem with figure skating blades - not blades on rental skates, which are a whole different story of hard treatment - isn't grinding the metal down to the point where it will break. The problem is grinding the metal down to where there are no edges left on the blade. The structure of the blade will still be solid, but the edges will just be so shallow as to be non-existent.

    The longest I had a pair of Coronation Aces last was four years, and the change in the edges was so gradual that I didn't even notice that the edges were almost gone until the skate shop guys showed me. (That probably says something about the lack of edges in my skating too, but that's another problem :) )
     
  17. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    That's what I was wondering. I have an old pair of blades (about 8 years old but not sharpened often) and just bought a brand new pair. I can barely skate in them at all. It feels like I have never skated a day in my life. It's been a couple of months. Wondering how long that will last?
     
  18. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    overedge,
    do you know roughly how many times they were sharpened, or how many hours or times of week you skated on them? I'm asking because I would like to have some idea of how long I have before having to buy new ones.

    I'm going to ask one of the more experienced sharpening guys about the loss of the edges. I sharpen rental skates but not the skates of customers (and certainly not my own).
     
  19. overedge

    overedge not your emotional support turkey

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    Treesprite - the number of hours per week really varied, because I skated a lot in summer school and then less during the rest of the year. I would guess it averaged out to about four hours a week. But how long the edges on the blades last also depends on how sharp you like them to be and how much of a hollow you get when you have the blades sharpened.
     
  20. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    I heard some pros recommend sharpening after 40 hours of skating time, but I'm with overedge on this, it really depends on your personal preference and what you're working on at the time. I.e., I like sharper blades for MITF, but like them slightly duller for spins and freestyle, so how often I sharpen my blades depends on my schedule and whether I'm testing moves soon or competing freestyle.
     
  21. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    Let me rephrase my question - How many sharpenings does it take to flatten the rocker of a blade? (Where you would need a new blade.)

    I've heard that elite skaters get new blades every year, but I have no idea how often they sharpen.
     
  22. overedge

    overedge not your emotional support turkey

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    That depends on how sharp you like your blades to feel when you skate, and what depth of edges you like. If you like them sharper, more of the edges are going to be shaved away every time you get them sharpened. If you like deeper edges rather than shallower ones, that's also going to take away more of the edge.
     
  23. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

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    Is there any kind of estimate? Such as, deep sharpenings would make a blade last a year - shallow sharpenings would make a blade last 3 years? I have no idea what the person sharpening did each time, either.
     
  24. overedge

    overedge not your emotional support turkey

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    No, there isn't any kind of estimate, because "sharp" and "deep" are subjective. What feels sharp and deep to one skater may feel dull and shallow to another. And the feeling might also depend on e.g. whether the skater is tall or short, heavier or lighter, how strongly or weakly they stroke.
     
  25. treesprite

    treesprite Member

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    Well, I forgot all about this post, then just found it doing a search to compare 7 ft to 8 ft rockers.

    The reason I was searching, is that I am thinking of switching back to those 8 ft rocker Matrix blades. Crazy, right?

    I was afraid of them because I broke my wrist using them, having fallen as a result of the back of the blade catching the ice on a back to forward mohawk. The backs of the blades were catching a lot, and for some stupid reason it didn't occur to me that I should have just tried moving them a little forward before throwing in the towel on them.

    I wanted to see how they would feel without actually changing blades on my regular skates, so I mounted them on a super old pair of boots I had at home sitting around to try them. Those boots were awful, so I couldn't do anymore than go once around the rink. They felt like they glided easier, but I don't know it it was because of the rocker or because of a difference in hollow. (Note: I can do my own skate tech stuff now, and I'm also doing every other sharpening myself, alternating with a guy who is far away).

    This would not have dragged out to 3 years, except that things keep interfering with me being able to do real skating (as opposed to rink guard skating), so I wasn't really doing anything that would have made me realize a problem with my current mounting. I recently started trying to do stuff again, and was really struggling with my bad ankle/foot (past injury, I have to mount my blade differently for that side), so last week I moved the blade at a bit more of an angle. As I was doing it, it occurred to me that these blades might be set back too far also (mounted by the same person who mounted those Matrix blades). Then I realized that the Matrix blades were probably back too far, which would explain the back ends catching the ice.

    I really need to gather more info from other folks' experience before I do anything. My soles have a lot of holes in them at this point, so if I change the blades, they are staying on whether I like it or not. I filled the holes from moving my blade last week, with leather and Shoe Goo, and let them cure for 3 days before re-attaching the blade. However, I discovered that the person who plugged the holes from the last use of the Matrix blades, just used pieces of toothpicks and glue. I'm certain the soles are solid where I filled the holes, but I'm concerned about needing to use those toothpick-filled holes and what I might need to do with them.

    Would appreciate any thoughts you folks might have on switching these rocker sizes.

    Thanks
     
  26. Loops

    Loops Member

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    No thoughts on the rocker, sorry. But I took my old boots to a cobbler and he refilled the holes for me. Did a good job too. Maybe you can find one to fix the toothpick disaster?

    I am thinking of switching to an 8 ft rocker though for the next blades, so I am curious as to your experience once you get this sorted.
     
  27. mtnskater

    mtnskater Well-Known Member

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    Blade setting is always tricky for me because I have significant pronation. I mount them quite far to the inside. I wish this were more of an exact science but I find that I move them and continue to do so after they continue to break in. I don't usually fill the holes :slinkaway Normally though I am just moving within the existing mount.

    I use MK Professional blades. Not sure what the rocker is though. I like them sharpened 7/16. I also liked Coronation Ace quite a bit. I skated on Pattern 99 for several years but decided I prefer the Professional. I don't recall muc trouble switching between the two. Anyone know what the difference between Professional and Coronation Ace is? I'm going to need new blades soon and may also consider new blades that are out there. I really like the lightweight stuff and want to look into that.
     
  28. Doubletoe

    Doubletoe Well-Known Member

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    My blade sharpener estimates that a high end MK or Wilson blade can take about 18 sharpenings before it has to be replaced (assuming you always take them to someone who knows what he's doing and you don't change the radius of hollow you use). I think he's about right because I usually get my blades sharpened 6 times a year and replace them every 3 years. If I feel like I'm hitting my bottom pick too easily or my spins are suffering, I know the rocker has gotten flattened out from sharpenings and I'll replace them a little sooner. I sharpen my blades every 36-40 hours. If I've been skating on hard ice, they will get dull quicker and I may need to sharpen them more often. If your edges start slipping, they probably need to be sharpened.
     
  29. Doubletoe

    Doubletoe Well-Known Member

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    The main difference between a 7' rocker blade and an 8' rocker blade is that the 8' blade is flatter from the middle of the blade to the back of the blade. From the ball of the foot to the toepick, the rocker profile depends on which blade you get (i.e., 7' Gold Star and 8' Gold Seal have similar rocker profiles, and 7' Phantom and 8' Pattern 99 have similar rocker profiles). There were only two differences I noticed when switching from 7' blades to 8' blades with a similar rocker profile: (1) more glide and speed on the 8' blades, and (2) I had to adjust where I put my weight on the back of the 8' blades when skating backwards.

    If having blades that were flatter in back made you catch the heel of the blades, I would suggest sticking to the 7' blades. There are world class skaters who skate in 7' blades (I know Misha Ge does), so there's certainly nothing wrong with them!
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2016
  30. Doubletoe

    Doubletoe Well-Known Member

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    From what I hear, the Coronation Ace and MK Professional are very similar (and both are 7' rocker), but the shape of the rocker is just a little different. I was told that the rocker shape of the Coronation Ace is a little more like the Pattern 99 and I know for sure that the MK Professional rocker shape is very similar to the MK Gold Star (7' rocker) and Wilson Gold Seal (8' rocker).
     
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