Black Swan

Discussion in 'Off The Beaten Track' started by El Rey, Aug 21, 2010.

  1. WindSpirit

    WindSpirit OmnipresentAdmeanistrator

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    I was interested until I saw the trailer. Either the movie is bad or the people doing the trailer had no clue. I don't like movies that are too literal or go over the top (unless on purpose :lol: ), so the moment she started sprouting little barbs/feathers didn't go well for me. And in general the scenes in the trailer seem like bad over-acting of an even worse script, hopefully they only look like that because they're taken out of context. But then again the movie may just be an overambitious pseudo-psychodrama, kind of crazy, crap. What exactly is it trying to be anyway?

    As for Aronofsky. The only of his movies I've seen to the end was The Wrestler, and I didn't like it that much. Much ado about nothing. I remember asking after the final scene, "That's it?" So we think we're going to live forever when we're young, we make mistakes, some big ones, we're trying to fix them and it's not always working, second chances might not work out and then we die. That's how it came off to me, like one of those yellow cheat books that will summarize a great book for you without even trying to go to any depth about it, and with none of the brilliance of the original.

    I remember watching Pi but I don't know if I finished it, it was a long time ago. I found it kind of interesting and kind of boring at the same time. Or maybe rather too monotone. Requiem of a Dream was so overindulgent and already proclaimed by many to be the cinematic second coming of Christ, that I didn't have much patience for that.
  2. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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    This reminds me of the time my mum was buying a birthday present for her daughter in law.

    She said to the woman at the counter in Macy's, "Just through 50 bucks worth of anything into a bag for me. Chances are she'll be back on Monday morning to return it."

    You can't please everyone.;)
  3. SkateSkates

    SkateSkates Member

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    This movie looks really good..but I can't believe I have to wait until December to see it!
  4. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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  5. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    It looks like it has gotten some great reviews at Venice, especially for Portman.

    http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2010/09/can_black_swan_win_natalie_por.html

    About Portman:

    I rewatched Rosemary's Baby recently and I am always impressed with Mia Farrow in that film. I can't believe she never received in Oscar nod for any of her films. Of course, I think Ruth Gordon gave the best Oscar speech of all time.
  6. Satellitegirl

    Satellitegirl New Member

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    It's interesting because they mention Polanski and Cronenberg, but it also reminds me a bit of Kubrick...at least from the trailer.
  7. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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    It true it comes out in December? :eek:
  8. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    Don't most Oscar-bait films do? ;)
  9. emason

    emason Well-Known Member

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    Not necessarily December, but certainly from September on. Anything that came out in March, no matter how good, is long forgotten.
  10. StonewshMullet

    StonewshMullet New Member

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    Do we have the same Mother and sister-in-law?
  11. Matryeshka

    Matryeshka Well-Known Member

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    Even though they're not really similar movies, I got a Notes on a Scandal vibe from the trailer, so I don't think I'll be seeing it. While I recognize that Notes was an excellent movie, it's the only one I've ever seen that has really made me feel dirty (and I've seen late-night Cinemax :p ). I felt the same kind of oogey watching that trailer.

    I agree with the sentiment and hope that it does well because there are not that many good roles for females, however, I *hate, hate, hate* that ONCE AGAIN it's about jealousy/age/beauty rather than two strong, talented female camraderie or working together.
  12. mila19

    mila19 New Member

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    Because in RL you get a lot of strong, talented females working together under some comradeship sentiment? I always thought the "2 roosters can't stay under the same hen-house" (that's Italian, so pardon the rough translation:p) to be very true.
  13. WindSpirit

    WindSpirit OmnipresentAdmeanistrator

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    Well, your story is more about a person who can't be pleased no matter what you do, which is not true for me. I knew the moment I criticized the trailer and other Aronofsky's movies, though, someone would be offended. I don't know why but it's just the way it is. I'm just surprised it took so long.

    That reminded me of the time when I criticized the movie Munhunter on a film usenet group years and years ago. Someone went completely bonkers to the point of stalking me. Still, If I don't like a movie/etc, I'll feel free to express my opinion. :p
  14. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    It happens all the time, particularly in ballet companies, even across ranks. That's not to say there isn't jealousy and disappointment when the resources -- roles/performances/attention -- are limited, or cliques, but there are plenty of female dancers who get along just fine, and plenty more that are great friends. The ground glass in the toe shoes stories sell more copy, though.
  15. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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    It was true regarding bitter rivalry when I was a little girl and heard stories come out of the local Opera and Ballet House. The Russian metaphor for the relationships among top dancers was described as "the snake soup is simmering".
  16. Michalle

    Michalle New Member

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    But realistically, how interesting a movie would that make?
  17. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Did Ukraine use the Russian model, where each dancer had a coach/mentor from the previous generation? The Russian model breeds more snaky behavior, because it's not just the dancer's ego/position/rank, but the coach's as well, and the coach's entire pedigree.

    Even without that system, generally, the dancer who's sleeping with the boss or is the boss's muse or is simply the boss's favorite won't have very many friends among fellow dancers.

    Not a remotely interesting non-fiction movie. Much better as a documentary.
  18. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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    I don't recall such a model as specifically applied to the dance company from my home town. But I do remember the stories about back biting and general :revenge: atmosphere, especially surrounding the competition for the lead roles.
  19. vesperholly

    vesperholly Well-Known Member

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    :eek: I didn't know it was possible to both arch your back and slouch at the same time.

    They did make that movie, it was called The Company and starred Neve Campbell. Excellent IMO but it certainly wasn't all that dramatic.
    IceAlisa and (deleted member) like this.
  20. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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  21. Satellitegirl

    Satellitegirl New Member

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    I remember seeing The Company....I thought parts of it were great and other parts were very *yawn* ...I'm a fan of Neve Campbell(where the crap is she lately?) so I wanted to watch it. Nice movie, but not great imo.
  22. orbitz

    orbitz Well-Known Member

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    I have the DVD of "The Company" but could never sit through the entire thing, LOL.

    Neve is/was filming Scream 4.
  23. ArtisticFan

    ArtisticFan Well-Known Member

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    I bought it too. I have yet to make it through that movie though I wish I could.
  24. KikiSashaFan

    KikiSashaFan Well-Known Member

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    I also have The Company and have yet to watch the whole thing. I do love the original Center Stage though. It's so bad, but so good. :slinkaway
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  25. Holley Calmes

    Holley Calmes Well-Known Member

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    I was always told by dancers from the old USSR that the coach-ballerina relationship was important for many reasons. The coach being a great dancer of the same sex who is now retired and teaching. One reason for this relationship was to properly hand down the nuances and small details that elevate Russian classical dance over many other traditions, especially in regard to the great Russian ballets. It doesn't mean cookie-cutter dancers. It just ensures that the depth of artistry survives. They didn't have video equipment and centuries of film readily accessible to study. Besides, working side by side with someone who has lived the roles is different from watching a video!

    My daughter was corp de ballet for Swan Lake, Giselle, and Don Quixote in a professional company run by a Romanian male dancer, a former classmate of Baryshnikov-Kirov training. This was about 20 years ago....but he brought in a woman coach (former Zagreb IBC winner) to drill the proper stylistic nuances into our corp. Just a small tilt of the head makes a tremendous difference. And there is a great deal of emotional content in all of it that you just don't get from most American companies, anyway.

    I absolutely shudder when some pre-professional little company puts on one of these ballets. It's a desecration. It's like playing Beethoven on a kazoo.

    Then again, Russians couldn't tap dance worth a darn...:lol:
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2010
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  26. Satellitegirl

    Satellitegirl New Member

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    lol same here, I love Center Stage.
  27. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

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    Did anyone go see the movie? I want to see it but it isn't playing here. Does anyone know when it will get a wide release?
  28. LuckyCharm

    LuckyCharm Well-Known Member

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    The link worked ok for me but I changed it anyway. This one is IMDB so it should be low risk.
    Dec. 22.
    http://www.imdb.com/news/ni6022460/
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2010
  29. Cupid

    Cupid New Member

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    Don't click on the link above posted by LuckyCharm - my Norton just blocked a high threat virus shortly after I clicked on it.
  30. skatemommy

    skatemommy Well-Known Member

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    I want to see this because of the dance aspect, but when Natalie reports that she was "crosstraining with swimming" this kind of loses it for me for the credibility factor.
  31. Louis

    Louis Tinami 2012

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    Saw the movie today. It is seriously fecked up and not for the squeamish, but pretty cool. :oksana1: :cool: It had me feeling tingly for about two hours after it ended. I'd definitely recommend it.
  32. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    I read some opinions along the lines of: "beautiful but empty."

    Still, Aronofsky is a really interesting director and all of his films to date have been excellent, so I'm definitely going to see this and make my own mind up (whenever it gets released over here :rolleyes:).
  33. danceronice

    danceronice Corgi Wrangler

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    I kind of want to see it, though the WSJ reviewer seemed a bit...mixed. Like s/he kind of liked it, but was disturbed by it, but that was kind of why it worked, etc. All of which may actually be the point. Overall it was a positive review, though.

    Re the height thing, yeah, most are shorter than you think (except, obviously, NYCB and even then.) My cousin really couldn't swing a ballet career, despite being good (she wound up teaching for a few years) because she's 5'7" in her stocking feet and for the companies she tried for, she was just too tall en pointe, and she wasn't SO great she would make it at something like NYCB. 5'2 or 5'3" is going to be a pretty good height for most male partners, I would think, as a lot of them strike me as being on the shorter side (especially some of the Russians!)
  34. Anita18

    Anita18 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not familiar with how long ballet dancers train each day, but maybe she needed more/different conditioning if they were experiencing long shooting days. Especially if they were doing the elaborate dance scenes all day for days on end...
  35. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa Port de bras!!!

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    I am not a big fan of Aronofsky--too OTT IMO, so after reading some reviews I think I will wait to Netflix this one after all.
  36. agalisgv

    agalisgv Well-Known Member

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    I remember another thread where some professionally trained ballet dancers on this board said many ballet companies screen for height, and someone under 5'6" doesn't have a chance for the most part (I *think* that was the height mentioned).

    It's shorter dancers that are at a disadvantage because they don't produce the same lines as taller dancers.

    ETA: Here are the posts I was thinking of:
    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showpost.php?p=973602&postcount=57
    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showpost.php?p=974133&postcount=65

    Note that in the second post, someone miscalculated 168cm cited to be 5'4" when in fact it's 5'6"
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2010
  37. jenny12

    jenny12 Well-Known Member

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    I saw it today and enjoyed it. It definitely is over-the-top and some parts made me flat-out laugh, but I think you'll enjoy it if you treat it as camp. I thought Natalie Portman was awesome.
  38. Kwantumleap

    Kwantumleap New Member

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    I thought the movie sucked. The lesbian plot was over advertised. It really had little to do with the film and the part about her even hallucinating becoming an actual swan on stage in her defining moment as the lead was laughable.
  39. Allen

    Allen New Member

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    I saw the movie today and thought it was fabulous. I kind of went into it looking at it as a non-slasher Suspiria. I love Aronofsky's style, so that could have something to do with the fact that I loved the movie.
  40. Carmen Ovsiannikov

    Carmen Ovsiannikov New Member

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    I haven't seen it yet but even though I find Natalie herself to be kind of :rolleyes: at times I think she is gorgeous and with the right material an excellent actress. After years of misteps with the films she's chosen I'm glad she seems to have found the right vehicle to show off her acting talent. I'd love to see her nominated for an Oscar the way some say she will be.