Best of these 5 Olympic gold medal winning performances?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Maofan7, Aug 12, 2014.

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Best of these 5 Olympic gold medal winning performances?

Poll closed Sep 12, 2014.
  1. Viktor Petrenko at the 1992 Olympics

    6 vote(s)
    3.2%
  2. Alexei Urmanov at the 1994 Olympics

    3 vote(s)
    1.6%
  3. Ilia Kulik at the 1998 Olympics

    33 vote(s)
    17.8%
  4. Alexei Yagudin at the 2002 Olympics

    94 vote(s)
    50.8%
  5. Evgeni Plushenko at the 2006 Olympics

    49 vote(s)
    26.5%
  1. addamsfamily

    addamsfamily New Member

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    Exactly. Compared to Stojko a dying horse is artistic. Today Urmanov would be laughed at as artistic.
     
  2. addamsfamily

    addamsfamily New Member

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    Kulik and Plushenko have more difficult and superior overall jumps, Urmanov is by far the poorest spinner of the three (although Kulik is also poor, and Plushenko average), he had by far the least and poorest footwork of the three, was overall the slowest and no his basics are no way stronger than Plushenko.
     
  3. Sasha'sSpins

    Sasha'sSpins Well-Known Member

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  4. Meoima

    Meoima Well-Known Member

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    Same thought here. Kulik's SP was great, but the costume!! It looked like he was wearing some torn and thin curtain!
    And his LP with that giraffe costume!! His jumps, his landing...all was great but that costume!! I wonder what was Tat thinking at that time. UhHHHH :wall::wall:
     
  5. montrealsurfa

    montrealsurfa New Member

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    Plushy! Technicaly by far the best and contrary to what some want to believe really good artistry too.
     
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  6. montrealsurfa

    montrealsurfa New Member

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    Don't make me laugh. An injured Stojko, Eldredge, and baby sick Yagudin is tougher competition than Lambiel, Buttle, Joubert, Weir, Takahashi.
     
  7. Susan M

    Susan M Well-Known Member

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    This is the reason I voted for Kulik. He skated and landed every planned element in both programs. His Olympic FS was the best FS of his life (costume aside), and that's always cool.

    Look again Unicrorn. Kulik did not have a "weak landing on 3S" - he flowed out of it. There never was any "planned 3S-3T" combination in that program. (Scott Hamilton was delusional.) Kulik skated that program with a couple steps between those jumps all year. He may have characterized them as a jump sequence, but there was never any combo planned there.
     
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  8. itoaxel

    itoaxel Member

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    How can Petrenko who had one of his worst skates ever that night have 2 votes. Defend his controversial gold over Wylie's great skate if you wish, and argue he deserved it; but don't pick it as best over perfect skates by Yags, Plushy, and Kulik.
     
  9. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    Urmanov also had the most and best MITFs of all three and the most textbook jumps (including the most controlled, stretched and held out landing position). He was also the most musical and used his entire body in his expression.

    As to Urmanov vs Plushenko, Urmanov showed much more 1 footed skating than Plushenko did. Both pumped but overall I would say Urmanov had better posture while maintaining more speed.
     
  10. daverobert

    daverobert New Member

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    Plushenko was like a machine. Incredible jumps, great footwork, very good spins, the whole package.
     
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  11. operagirl

    operagirl Active Member

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    No one mentions Brian Boitano? Shame.
     
  12. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    In 1998, Stojko and Eldredge had a total of 4 World Champ titles, 1 OSM and 5 other world medals between them while Kulik himself was only a one time World silver medallist from 2 years ago. I don't believe Kulik was even a OGM favorite going into the 1998 season at all (since he didn't medal at 1997 Worlds). A medal contender at most.

    In 2006, Plushenko was already an OSM and multiple World Champ and medallist, and amongst his legitimate competitors, only Lambiel was a World Champ and he didn't exactly have a 3axel. Only Buttle and Joubert medalled at Worlds previously, but Buttle had no quads and Joubert was always inconsistent. Takahashi and Weir were only up and coming and never even medaled at Worlds.
     
  13. unicorn

    unicorn Member

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    Ok with the 3s/3t jump series, I checked his planned jump layout at the beginning of that video and it says it's a combo. But does't matter, that's not the reason I said it's a weak landing. If you notice, his free leg clearly sliced off the ice on the landing of that 3s. Judging by the flakes that produced, it's not just a slight touch down. It's called a weak landing, should be a -1 GOE. There were lots of other flaws about his jumps, such as his first 3A was clearly short of rotation, the only jump had good flow out was his 3F, but looks he took off on the outside edge, I was just too lazy to mention.
    You don't need any reason to vote for Kulik, just go ahead, why acted so hypocritically like other people here are all stupid. Besides it's a "which is the best performance" vote, not a who's performance is the skate of his life vote. I don't mind at all a not-even-his-best Yagudin might have performed better than a the-best-FS-of-his-life Kulik.
    And I don't understand why the heck someone's costume can affect someone's performance? It just shows your personal taste, you guys are really interesting!
    Anyway, life is short, enjoy the skaters you like.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2014
  14. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    I think the OP just wanted to compare those 5 specifically (for whatever reason, maybe all the Russian or Soviet winners, or all the most recent winners who weren't clunkers- Lysacek and a subpar Hanyu). I don't think it was ever implying these were the 5 best of all time. Of course Curry in 76, Boitano in 88, would be on any poll about that, and Petrenko of 92 or Urmanov in 94 would never be on one about that.
     
  15. antmanb

    antmanb Well-Known Member

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    :rofl: well duh!! The programme that was made for and skated under IJS would do better under IJS than the other programmes which, you know, weren't!
     
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  16. kwanette

    kwanette Fetalized since 1998

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    I'd take Boitano's over any of those listed.
     
  17. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    This makes a lot of sense
     
  18. coldblades

    coldblades New Member

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    eh, I would still give my vote to Yagudin, he's technically great and aesthetically pleasing. But I thought Boitano would have been listed when I saw the title of this post.
     
  19. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    I actually find Boitano more aestheticaly pleasing as far as perfect lines, positions, stretch, and purity of edges, basics, and skating than Yagudin. Yagudin has much more advanced choreography though, and a much more diverse range of musical talents. Both are great athletes, although Boitano has flawless technique on his jumps, while Yagudin has imperfect technique that works for him and creates huge jumps. Yagudin can do footwork Boitano who never had fancy feet can only dream of. Yagudin is probably the better skater, but Boitano had the slightly more outstanding (in the context of the time, and overlooking technical difficulty which naturally progresses over time) Olympic performance.

    Brian B. was in a different position though. He had to go all out, be spectacular, and be flawless, to win over the reigning world champion in his own country, who would be politically more in favor than him all things equal. Yagudin just had to stand up to avoid losing gold with Plushenko 4th in the short, and skated well to protect his lead, and did a much better job in his performance than say Yamaguchi who was in the same comfy position after the short program in 92. I think had Plushenko been in gold contention, and skated a cleaner LP than he did, you would see a more aggressive Yagudin.
     
  20. Susan M

    Susan M Well-Known Member

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    I find this contradictory. Generally, "the whole package" in figure skating requires musical and nuanced movement and personal style and flair, kind of the opposite of skating like a machine.

    Years later, I finally read an explanation from her that kind of made sense. The music dates from the Roaring 20s. Kulik is portraying a young man in evening dress who has been partying all night (losing his tie and coat along the way). The cut of the white vest and shiny black pants actually are consistent with white tie. He is walking down the street at dawn. The yellow and black pattern on the shirt is supposed to represent morning sun filtering through the leaves of the trees on the sidewalk. Personally, I don't think the giraffe pattern quite captures the idea they were going for (and especially not with the weird vinyl fabric) but there was surprisingly coherent thinking behind it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2014
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  21. sadya

    sadya Active Member

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    Thank you for the explanation. It does make more sense now. I once read somewhere that Tarasova had claimed that that fabric was fashion in the '20s?

    Anyway, here is webpage from frogsonice.net about the mystery of Ilia Kulik's costume, not meant to insult him, but in good fun:
    http://www.frogsonice.com/skateweb/ilia/
     
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  22. yunatripleflip

    yunatripleflip Member

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    Kulik is way overrated. Those of you who like him probably due since he is cute. He is a good skater but not in the league of Yagudin, Plushenko, or even Petrenko (but his Olympic skate was better than Petrenko's). He had trouble winning titles in the era Stojko was the top skater for crying out loud.
     
  23. sadya

    sadya Active Member

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    Kulik is to me as cute as Yagudin, to cite an example, but in a different way of course. Yet, that's not a reason to vote for him or whatever 'cute' skater. After all, it's about the art and sport of figure skating, not a Mr. Cutie contest. I voted for Kulik in this poll, btw. My reasons were that his Olympic skates seemed almost effortless, they weren't perfect, but very well done. He really did seem to float on the ice without much effort. Even his jumps seemed almost too easy, if that makes sense.
     
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  24. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    Kulik's strength at that time was his jumps. They were perfect. However, he had not developed artistically (presentation, if you want to use that). His spins were not very good either. He did have a lot of flair which was nice and refreshing. He was not juniorish, but one could see that he needed more development. Yagudin and even Plushenko in 2002 were more complete skaters than Kulik in 98. I would have loved to see him go for another Olympic, but he chose to turn pro. He did develop a lot as a pro, and became a more complete skater later.
     
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  25. yunatripleflip

    yunatripleflip Member

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    Kulik wasn't even the best jumper. Stojko and young Yagudin had better jumps than he did.
     
  26. LilJen

    LilJen Well-Known Member

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    NOT RUSSIAN!!!! Therefore does not count. :lol:
     
  27. kwanette

    kwanette Fetalized since 1998

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    Boitanokov!
     
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  28. unicorn

    unicorn Member

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    Plushenko is way overrated technically too, he's no better than Kulik, both of them lack the ability to control their blade like Yagudin. Both of them needed looong run to build up speed and set up their minds for jumps (Boitano too) and hence simply couldn't command the more complex choreography. Kulik has that lightness on ice, but his moves were gawky and stiff, overall IMO Yagudin's skating skills were better in terms of deeper edges, softer knees, much more agility on the ice. And those who never saw Yagudin skate live when he's still competing have no idea how freakingly fast he was. If you ask Kurt Browning, he might still remember.
    And what makes Plushenko's 2006 performance way above Kulik's? His old lady like kick kick kick ugly strokes? His first jumps and then arm movements, then jumps, then arm movements program? His dancing around the same place in front of the judges? (Though I understand some fans may think that diva like dance is pretty attractive, but that's not figure skating). That not-really-difficult-but-frantic footwork? Even his jumps were no better than Kulik's. If you want to see broke at the waist landing, go to watch that performance, if you want to see tilted air position, go to watch that performance, if you want to see poor flow out landing, you go to watch that performance.
     
  29. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    No way. Kulik's jumps were so light; I think it was Boitano who said "he jumps like God". Stojko's landings of the jumps were always forward. Yagudin had more power, but Kulik's jumps were effortless. He didn't have the 4-3 combination (Stojko & Yagudin did), but in 98 only Stojko was doing a 4-3 (unless I am missing a chinese skater perhaps?). Plushenko had the perfect technique for jumps but in 98 he was just a 15 year old kid with great potential. So if we are comparing the skaters in 98, Kulik had the best jumps.
     
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  30. unicorn

    unicorn Member

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    We also have Robin cousins said that Yagudin had text book jumps, textbook footwork, textbook spin, he's the best around skater out there in 1998. Yagudin was already technically a better skater in 1998. And Yagudin is the only person ever got a 6.0 for technical elements in men's technical program in figure skating history, so ironic. Plushenko's jumps were far from perfect, his jump landings quite often lack the flow out, he tended to stop dead after finishing the rotation in the air.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2014