Best female skater of the 90s

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by KimGOAT, Apr 9, 2013.

Best lady skater of the 90s

  1. Yamaguchi

    104 vote(s)
    43.3%
  2. Lipinski

    5 vote(s)
    2.1%
  3. Kwan

    98 vote(s)
    40.8%
  4. Ito

    21 vote(s)
    8.8%
  5. Bauil or Kerrigan or Gusmeroli

    6 vote(s)
    2.5%
  6. Chen

    6 vote(s)
    2.5%
  1. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    Who is the best lady skater of the 90s, my favorite ever decade of skating. I went with Yamaguchi since 1 Olympic Gold, 2 World golds, and 4 World Pros is better than 2 World Golds, 1 Olympic silver or 1 World Gold, 1 Olympic Gold, or 1 Olympic Silver, 1 World Pro, and the rest. I think she is far above the others.
     
  2. DimaToe

    DimaToe Well-Known Member

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    :lol:... Why are Oksana, Nancy, and Vanessa all grouped as one choice? :confused:
     
  3. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    It was the poll option for the mutually crazy people. I didnt want them to feel left out.
     
  4. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    I would have voted for Ito since I think she is the best skater on the list thinking of whole career but Ito is a skater of the 80s, not the 90s.
     
  5. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Either Ito or Kwan. Yamaguchi was solid, excellent, nice, and perfectly forgettable (atleast for me). Well as a pro she was more memorable, as an amateur she was by the book and collected points and won, often when the big jumpers fell apart. A female Lysacek.
     
  6. bardtoob

    bardtoob Well-Known Member

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    Ito or Kwan. If Bauil or Kerrigan or Gusmeroli got to share a slot, Harding should have been an option.
     
  7. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

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    :rofl: Kristi had technical difficulties few ladies could do. So, she was technically one of the very best, and artistically better than the better jumpers. That's why she won. Not because she was a female Lysacek.

    I can't vote. I'd say Kwan or Ito or Yamaguchi.
     
  8. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    OK she is alot better than Lysacek, she just didnt do anything for me as an amateur. She was by the book, pleasant, excellent, but not every exciting or inspiring for me. Mind you if you go by accomplishments and nothing else she is by far the best on this list (talking just the 90s decade).
     
  9. FunnyBut

    FunnyBut Well-Known Member

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    I voted Kwan, but I could see going for Ito too.

    Kristi has the OGM that eluded but Kwan and Ito. But much as I liked her as a person, Kristi never did much for me as an amateur . I think it was the tiny spinny jumps and overall small skating that bothered me. I do like her better than Tara, the other tiny spinny jumper OGM.

    Why is Gusmeroli on this poll? I like her fine, but her accomplishments are dwarfed by the others. I'd be insulted if I were Bauil and Kerrigan sharing a poll option with her. Bauil will probably sue FSU, and Kerrigan probably thinks it's more corny than Mickey Mouse.
     
  10. lala

    lala Well-Known Member

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    Kwan,no doubt. But my favorite was Lu Chen.
     
  11. angelflies

    angelflies Active Member

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    Kristi clearly. I dont know how anyone could vote otherwise. Kristi was hands down the best skater in the World from 91-95, and that is already most of the decade.
     
    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  12. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    Are we taking into account the pro career as well as eligible one?
     
  13. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    Didn't Ito and Yuka Sato beat her at two World Pros during that period?
     
  14. angelflies

    angelflies Active Member

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    Ito beat her at the Worlds Pros in December 95. So not part of the 95 season. That is why I said 95-96, since by 96 season there were some skating better than her maybe, Sato in pros, and Kwan in amateurs. However from 91-95 she was always by far the best skater. Ito did beat at the World Pros in December 93, but Kristi came back to crush her at the Challenge of Champions event where Ito was only 3rd behind a really old Denise Biellmann, and Kristi won all her other events that year so she was still the best.
     
  15. blue_idealist

    blue_idealist Well-Known Member

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    I said Kwan, even though it was really the late 90s/early 00s that she was dominant.
     
  16. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

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    Midori Ito won 1993 World Pro with her gorgeous Rose of Pain program, 3Axel included. ;)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Dg3jlLS9W4
     
  17. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

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    Michelle Kwan is not my favourite and I'm no Kawaniac whatsoever, but my vote went hands down to her without even having to think twice. :)
    It's just the consistent good skating over years, the big wins (except OG) and the overall skating package where she had no real weaknesses other girls on this poll had.
     
  18. wristflick

    wristflick New Member

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    Kristi since she dominated when the sport had the 2 best jumpers ever Ito and and Harding at their peaks. Kwan meanwhile lost 4 of 5 meetings with Tara Lipinski in her brief prime, and Tara was just a jumper like Harding and not as good of one as Ito or Harding.
     
  19. Andofanatic

    Andofanatic Member

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    Kristi won 6 World titles (2 amateur, 4 pro) and the Olympics. Had she continued competing she would have won atleast 7 straight Worlds and Olympics- 91 Worlds, 92 Olympics, 92 Worlds, 93 Worlds, 94 Olympics, 94 Worlds, 95 Worlds. She would have even been contending for gold with Kwan and Chen in 96, and Lipsinki and Kwan in 97 and 98. I cant believe anyone would think it isnt her.
     
  20. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    Regarding 1996-on, Yamaguchi would have fell or doubled on a Salchow. How many consistent 7 triple routines could she have done? One can say she probably would have won all those titles (1993 Worlds-1995 Worlds), but we really don't know if she would have. She could have lost. We're just assuming she would have won because we think she would have been perfect or clean every time (although for 1993 Worlds-1994 Worlds, she may not have needed to be clean).

    As for comparing Yamaguchi's rivalry with Ito and Harding and Kwan's rivalry with Tara, Yamaguchi may not have beaten Ito or Harding if they had Tara's or Michelle's consistency. IMO, Michelle Kwan's 1998 Olympic performance blows Yamaguchi's 1992 Olympic performances away, as did her 1996 Worlds one, and even her 1997 Worlds LP. It's not as if Kwan could have gotten away with doubling the Salchow and falling out of her loop in Nagano the way Yamaguchi was able to in Albertville. Plus, since we're using pro competitions, Kwan did beat Yamaguchi the one time they competed against each other in the Ultimate 4.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2013
  21. girlscouse62

    girlscouse62 Active Member

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    I had to vote for Yamaguchi since she was a favourite of mine in that decade. While i understand why people really loved Kwan, she just didn't do it for me. Sorry, Kwan fans. :)
     
  22. duane

    duane New Member

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    Though not the most accomplished skater of the 1990's, I don't think anyone compares to Chen Lu. Definitely the best skater of the 1990's in my book.
     
  23. Andofanatic

    Andofanatic Member

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    No I am not assuming she would have skated perfectly each time. She didnt have to skate perfectly to have won any of the 93 Worlds, 94 Olympics, 94 Worlds, 95 Worlds.

    1993 Worlds- Newcomer Oksana wins with 5 triples, no combo. Kristi would only need land 5 triples to be sure to win.
    1994 Olympics- Oksana wins with 3 clean triples. Nancy who never beat Kristi their whole careers is .1 from winning gold.
    1994 Worlds- Sato won with lovely performance with 6 triples, yet still only won by .1 over a sloppy Bonaly who only made 5 triples, had 2 major mistakes, and a had a flat and overall mediocre performance. Kristi based on name value alone would have pretty much only had to show up to win this one.
    1995 Worlds- Chen wins with 5 triples, only 1 triple lutz. Regardless if you think she deserved it or not Kristi also would have gotten as high or higher of presentation marks, Chen was never a judges favorite as proven with many of the events people thought she was robbed of winning or a higher medal in- 1992 Worlds, 1996 Worlds, 1994 Olympics, even 1993 Worlds. Again easy win for Kristi, and she doesnt have to be perfect.

    1996 is the first year she would have needed to start skating perfectly with 7 triples.

    I base her winning all those years on the fact her pro performances each year were better than the winning World and Olympic performance. Watch the 92 World Pros, 93 Challenge of Champions, 94 Gold Championships, 94 World Pro Championships and compare it to the winning World and Olympic performances from 93-95 and you will get why it should be just assumed she would have won all those events.

    Who knows. Harding has skated well many times and still lost to Kristi- 89 Nationals and that was when Kristi was just a little jumping beans and not the total package she was later, 91 Worlds short program, 91 Nationals short program. Ito's Olympic LP even with the fall was still great, with a huge triple axel late in the program and some beautiful combination jumps, and she still lost the LP handily to subpar Krist.

    You may feel that way but the judges may not agree. Kristi's Albertville LP got the same marks as Michelle's Nagano LP- five 5.7s and four 5.8s for technical, and straight 5.9s on the 2nd mark, despite that both were skating first in the final flight, and there was a stronger group of girls to come after Kristi than after Michelle where it was just Tara and the 7 dwarfes. Remember Kristi did a triple lutz-triple toe, a super difficult combination and much harder than anything Michelle did in Nagano. That makes up for just 1 or 2 small mistakes easily.

    I totally disagree especialy on Kwan's 1997 Worlds LP being superior. A program with a doubled 2nd triple lutz which Kristi did a beautiful one easily very late, and a shaky and wobbly triple toe-triple toe vs Kristi's beautiful and easily done triple lutz-triple toe, and artistically a program that just a ripoff of Salome. I would take Kristi's Albertville performance easily.

    You also talk like Kristi's 92 Olympic winning LP was her best performance ever, comparing it to Michelle's best. That is makes no sense, since, Kristi has had dozens of skates better than her Albertville LP. It was one of her worst performances ever after the figures era and her pairs career ended. You might as well compare it to Michelle's worst at the 97 Nationals, ok that might be extreme, but no more than trying to compare it to Michelle's best ever performances when it was far from Kristi's best. Anyway what relevance are 2000 performances, the thread is about best skater of the 90s decade, so anything Michelle did in the 2000s is meaningless.

    Kristi did what she had to do in order to win that day. Remember she had the gold medal locked up before the LP even began due to what transpired in the short. Her two main rivlas Ito and Harding fell in the short, and were 4th and 6th, and Kerrigan and Bonaly who were no threat to her at that point were the ones in 2nd and 3rd. The event was over, and Kristi knew it even though she would never admit it, she probably threw a party to celebrate her gold medal before the LP even began, LOL, so of course she didnt have intensity to skate her best. I think had Tonya and Midori been 2nd and 3rd after the short you would have seen a much different performance.

    That was not a pro competition, it was a pro-am competition, and it was far more amateur than professional. It was judged under ISU rules in front of ISU judges. The judges were no doubt favoring the amateur skaters, and the rules heavily favored the reigning World Champion over a skater who had been out of amateur competition for 5 years. Despite that in the SP when both skated perfectly Kristi won. Nobody in the World could beat a clean Michelle in the SP at that point, except for Kristi. Kristi even did it was just a simple triple toe as her solo jump, like Michelle, vs the top amateurs who had to try triple flips and even then still couldnt come close. Michelle won since Kristi had an uncharactersistic bad LP with several falls, including falling on her opening double axel.
     
  24. iarispiralllyof

    iarispiralllyof Active Member

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    no one cares about the world pros.
    and your "what ifs" about kristi staying in to compete in future worlds are so pointless and hilarious. the fact is she didn't. how is that any different from a michelle fan saying "what if michelle didn't fall in salt lake", or "what if she didn't have a shaky landing at 97 worlds sp"

    :yawn:
     
  25. Andofanatic

    Andofanatic Member

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    The point is that from 91-95 Kristi was clearly the best in the World, by a long margin. She was skating at a higher level than any pro or amateur skater all those years. That is already about half of the decade, and should firmly cement her best of the decade. Kwan was arguably best in 96, 98, and 99 at most, and even in 98 and 99 she lost the years biggest event, and in 96 she had an unconvincing and controversial win in the years biggest event.
     
  26. iarispiralllyof

    iarispiralllyof Active Member

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    sure, based on nothing but wild speculations
     
  27. iarispiralllyof

    iarispiralllyof Active Member

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    I have to add something: when comparing US skaters to each other, national titles come into play

    Michelle won 9 National golds vs Kristi's 3
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2013
  28. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

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    No it wasn't. People disagree about who should have won, but I wouldn't call it unconvincing or controversial because Kwan had enough content to back up a win. A disagreement with a result does not always amount to an undeserving win. Many who think Chen should have won the LP in 1996 usually give Kwan credit for putting up a strong fight.

    As for your comparison of scores between Albertville and Nagano, you can't compare 6.0 scores from 1992 and 1998. The level of skating was different nobody knows what would have happened if someone of Kwan and Lipinski's level and consistency skated against her.

    All of your arguments are wildly speculative. You're arguments regarding 1993 and 1994 Worlds and Olympics are strong enough that I think I may agree with that, but again, Kristi could have fallen all over the place.
     
  29. falling_dance

    falling_dance D. Murakami's Newest Fan

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    I wonder if there's ever been a thread in which real competitiveness in multiple disciplines was considered as a factor in ranking "greats" of all time or a particular era.
     
  30. KimGOAT

    KimGOAT Active Member

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    My poll was just about the 90s only and only about singles so 3 National golds for Michelle to 1 for Kristi.