Any tips for the Killian Choctaw?

Discussion in 'Moves In The Field' started by The Accordion, Nov 23, 2012.

  1. The Accordion

    The Accordion Well-Known Member

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    I am having a ton of trouble trying to get onto the back outside edge with speed.
    Does anyone have any suggestions?

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. C_T_T_

    C_T_T_ Well-Known Member

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    I'm doing these as part of a field move at the minute. These are exactly magic tricks but I just try to lean back a bit on my blade, keep my hips forward on the entrance and turn my hip out as far as I can. I to have as little body movement as possible throught the turn so the free foot can just drop onto the ice without anything else changing. My coach had me do back pivots after the choctaw to begin with to try and get the feeling of the turn and body position needed.
     
  3. Spazactaz

    Spazactaz New Member

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    ^all good suggestions. this is the only dance that i absolutely hate! i had to partner a girl on it today and she just couldn't get it.. we couldn't even continue after the choctaw. but yeah, just really opening the free hip and drawing it around before you step to the outside edge, then just really checking the free hip back and not letting it rotate.
     
  4. backspin

    backspin Active Member

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    I found it helpful to practice doing the pattern through the choctaw, & then hold the back outside edge for a full circle. It gives you time to find your correct body position & the more you do it the quicker you'll get into that right position.
     
  5. The Accordion

    The Accordion Well-Known Member

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    Thanks everyone! I will give all of these a shot! Part of the problem is that I now have a mental block :( with it. But anyhow - you have given me lots of ideas! :)
     
  6. pp55

    pp55 Member

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    ^^ Yes, all are good suggestions.

    Here are a 2 "simple" exercises.
    Sometime I had to give this exercises to my students when they had trouble with body control in the Choctaw.

    Hockey blue line. 2 foot gliding along the line. Now twist your upper body in a way that the left arm is in front and the right one is behind. Both along the line. The arms and shoulders should make a straight line.
    While gliding do 2-foot turns turning the hips and legs. Your upper body, arms, shoulders, head should not move during the turn. Do a couple turns, back and forth.

    Same blue hockey line. 1-foot gliding on your left foot and on left side of the line. The right foot in front. The upper body position as above. The left shoulder should be slightly down.
    Now step over the line on the right foot backward, left foot cross behind the right foot. While stepping over try to move the hips forward while keeping the shoulders back. The upper body should not move(twist) similarly to the exercise above.
    Stay on the right foot (while gliding along the line) and try to control your body. Remember to keep you "leading" left shoulder slightly down.

    Key points: while turning try to separate the upper body from hips and below; in the Choctaw push the hips forwards while trying to keep the shoulders slightly back.
    And you can practice these exercises even with a partner. It could arm-to-arm position or a Kilian position.
     
  7. Synchkat

    Synchkat New Member

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    Try practicing it on a figure eight. So do the progressive around one circle, cross onto your right outside to get onto the next circle and hold that for half the circle. At the top of that circle put your left foot down onto the left inside and hold another half circle. Turn your choctaw at the centre of the two circles to get you back on the original circle. Hold that edge until at least the quarter point of the circle, if possible the halfway point of the circle. Do this over and over and over and it will help your choctaw. When I was competing once a week we would do "dance patch" and work on dances on figures. It is a goo way to work on the edges, especially the transitions from one circle to another.
     
  8. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    All I can say is good luck with it. :)
     
  9. Rochelle

    Rochelle Active Member

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    Is the issue that you can't get to the BO edge comfortably when you execute the choctaw with notable speed... or that you loose speed once you step onto the back outside edge)? Also, do you have really open hips (can easily do bauers, spread eagles, etc.) or really closed hips or about average?
     
  10. The Accordion

    The Accordion Well-Known Member

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    I think my hips are pretty closed in general and moreso right now. This may be related to the slight scoliosis that I have - but actually there seems to be something wrong with my right hip in general right now. Sometimes when I stand up from sitting it kind of turns - feels like when you turn an ankle when you are walking if that makes sense. Sorry for such a long answer to a simple question!

    As far as your other question goes - I seem to be able to get onto a back outside edge much better when I am skating more slowly. But when I get up to the speed I would like to have I think I chicken out or something.

    Also - when I dance with a partner it seems to be far less of a problem for some reason?

    Thanks again everyone!
     
  11. Jasmar

    Jasmar Active Member

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    I have miserably closed hips, some really had to work for this one. I finally had success by making sure the the two edges right before the choctaw (XF-RFO - XB-LFI) were very strong and deep, and I worked on leaning back a little on that LFI, and having perfect posture there. That would put my body in position that I could just open up the right heel and step onto the RBO edge. Also critical to bend knees deeply on the RBO edge.

    I was terrified by that dance when I started, but it became one of my favorites eventually. Good luck!
     
  12. The Accordion

    The Accordion Well-Known Member

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    Thanks again! And for your personal experiences and specific tips!
    Hey - guess what!?
    I have been skating on and off for the last while - and every time my dances would start to get close to testing I would have to stop. But this fall I decided I really wanted to go for it and made skating a priority!
    Long story short - I just got my skates sharpened - and it has made a really big difference. I realized I can't remember the last time I had them sharpened and I have been skating 2-3 times a week since September and then lots on and off before that!

    Anyhow - it is going better - with your tips and the sharpened skates. I wish I could say Jasmar that it is becoming a favourite - but I can't!
     
  13. Jasmar

    Jasmar Active Member

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    Great news, Accordion! Sharpened skates - wish I'd thought of that.

    One other piece came to mind the other day, and I finally remembered to come post it. When you hit the RBO edge of the choctaw, check hard with the left shoulder and spine. It makes a huge difference. Also make sure to keep the rear tucked in.

    I'm glad to hear its going so well!