Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by siberia82, Dec 21, 2010.
Except that youths (or, as Joe Pesce says in My Cousin Vinny, "youts") nowadays think it is.
Yes, this. When I met him, maybe 6 years ago, his Swedish was very poor. I don't know how it is today though.
The following article was publishe in 2006:
Alexander Majorov times two – meet the father/son team
Really? According to the author of the Absolute Skating article:
The dude is Swedish, through and through.
Majorov Press Conference in Swedish: "I Am Not a Bad Person"
According to the Google translation, Majorov said he's "not a bad person," he just wante to be comforted by his friends, he would never say such things to an adult, and he's "not a racist."
1) Racist + Sexist speech
2) Admitting that he doesn't feel Swedish at all, that Swedes are a separate group to him - a PR disaster for somebody who's supposed to represent this country
And it's not like he's an immigrant who just moved there a few years ago. He's spent most of his life in Sweden.
3) Immaturity more akin to a 6 year old throwing a strop than to somebody who's supposed to be an adult.
Also, whilst it's interesting and valid to explain how his thinking might have worked, racism, sexism, homophobia and other forms of discrimination are never ok.
It is not ok to use words like these in public. It was posted on Facebook and his friends don't just include his closest mates but a large number of people, a lot of whom he barely (if at all) knows.
To all the people who say that he isn't being racist and that this is being blown out of proportion:
Do you not realise that discrimination and all its institutional and psychological effects exist precisely because of speech like this existing in public discourse and being acceptable?
I'm not saying that he should be stoned to death. He made a mistake, he could have not fully understood what he was saying and so on, and so forth.
But it needs to be clearly said that language like this isn't appropriate, shouldn't be used and yes it's racist and sexist to use words like these. Using them as insults implicitly stigmatises those groups.
Is he racist and sexist? He's probably just a bit ignorant. But the words he used definitely are.
I used the term blown out of proportion because it has been
.3 pages worth???
I never said what he said was acceptable, far from it. He realized what he said in the heat of anger was wrong, took it down, apologized and was given a warning by his federation. I'm sure he clearly knows now (if he didn't know then) that what he said was not acceptable in any language or country.
That 19 year old learned a valuable lesson and I hope his parents did as well. I am granting the same leniency I would want for my kid's mouthy mistakes.
Is he racist or sexist, no, just uneducated.
Thank you so much for the translation, meierfan!
I hope Majorov realizes how fortunate he is that he got a slap on the wrist. We've heard stories of people insulting their boss or their workplace on Facebook and getting fired for it. I'm not saying that the Swedish federation would've dumped him or anything like that, but they could've denied him the chance to go to senior Worlds this season since he needs to mature a little. (The top 3 Swedish men will have to battle for the 2 Worlds spots at the Nordic Championships.)
Wait, where did he say this? I might have missed something with Google Translate, or perhaps this was mentioned in either the video or radio interview.
Did you read his original Facebook message, first link in the first post in this thread?
"F***ing Swedish pussies idiots n*****s! ...."
Actually, I was the one who started this thread. And you must have missed my post which contained the links for the video and radio interview because you reposted the latter unnecessarily. (Not that it really matters or anything. )
I assumed when Sasha used the word "Swedish" in his status update, he was referring to the federation, not Swedes in general. I may not know this young man, but based on other articles I've read about him within the last couple of months, he identifies himself as being more Swedish than Russian.
Tony Wheeler spoke to Majorov about this incident, so at least English-speaking FS fans have one statement from him which doesn't require Google Translate : http://www.flutzingaround.com/2010/12/alexander-majorov-apologizes-for.html
I certainly don't blame his mother for being furious... Not only did Sasha potentially ruin his own career, but he could've ruined his parents' as well. Luckily it never reached that point, but the tabloids could've made accusations that the Majorovs didn't raise their boy properly and whatnot.
I sure am glad it wasn't Patrick Chan who spouted that kind of verbal diarhhea.
The thread is only this short because the skater involved is a relative unknown.
We would be well into thread #2 by now if Chan had said this (1000 posts per thread for the uninitiated).
He probably feels more Swedish in Russia but has the Russian thing to fall back on when things don't go his way in Sweden. In other words, he's human....
They don't have to.
As for the "Swedish pussies" bit, I would say it could be read either way. Not that it matters. I think he wanted to be outrageous and offensive, and he succeeded beyond his wildest dreams.
True and there haven't been any major competitions the past couple days to occupy our time.
Half of the posts being by apologists who say Chan's vocabulary and mastery of language is so far superior to that of other skaters that he's allowed several epithets under current regulations.
wow,he may go to another sw.... Switzerland got 3 spot and couldn't find a good skater
as for Chan,after meet him several times in person,I found he is a intersting,cute and handsome man,and get along sooooooooo well with every skaters and workers,strange!now I curious why the media always try to make him like a ugly devil,just because he's not white?...
No racial issue with Chan. Patrick has made a number of inappropriate comments to media regarding other skaters, along with other issues that would be better for him not to mention. The first time I chalked it up to being naive, but he has continued in this manner for a long time.
Majarov is not a world championship medalist or a GPF winner, in fact he made very little headway as a junior. So many people are not aware of him or not impressed by his skating to bother writing a comment about. Saying that there is no excuse for making that kind of statement.
P.S. why did you have to bring Chan into a thread about Majarov. Are you that obsessed with Chan that you see the every issue w.r.t to how it will effect Chan.
Random: But Tony Wheeler is a Void.
Just because many young people think it is doesn't make it so. People can lose their jobs or suffer consequences far greater than they would have by posting things publicly on Facebook than they would if they just vented to a few of their closest friends (even if a few of their closest friends have big mouths).
Majorov Sr started teaching in Sweden in 1992, but it was part time at first, and I don't know if he moved his family right away. He's said he did 3 months the second year, and then 5 months and in the 4th year they stayed (from this Absolute Skating interview), so if he didn't bring his family until then I suppose Jr would've been about 4? Most local news I've read about Majorov over the years says he's been in Luleå since he was 1, as does Skate Sweden. He didn't start skating until he was 5-6, and that was at a camp in Luleå.
I don't know if I ever heard him speak before he was in his teens, but he's never had much of an accent apart from a Luleå accent to my ears. If you know he's Russian you might pick up some small inflections, but these days I doubt most people would. He wasn't in public daycare as a kid, so I suppose he would've spoken mostly Russian until he started school at age 7.
I agree with most of your post, but where has he said he doesn't feel Swedish at all? In most interviews I've read or heard he's said he likes Russia, but Sweden's home to him, it's where all his friends are (which makes sense, since he's lived here since he was a toddler).
I missed the whole mess because I was travelling, but I hope he learned his lesson. The Swedish version of the n-word is taboo and further down in his comments he's calling the federations "c**ts" in Swedish which is a lot more offensive than calling someone "jävla idioter", and while teenagers might be less sensitive to bad language, he certainly would've known he was being offensive.
Apparently the Swedish federation had said that Nationals wasn't the determining factor for who got chosen to go to Euros (although it usually is), which is why he was so pissed off in the first place, but looking at how Berntsson skated at Nationals, I'd still give the nod to him rather than Majorov.
Before the Facebook travesty, I actually did think it was somewhat unfair that Sasha was left off of the Euros team. (I'm not a fan of using national rankings as the sole determing factor.) Majorov did have stronger international results in the fall, and since he's the future of men's skating in Sweden, I would want him to have more experience on the "big stage".
Berntsson was the clear winner at Nationals, but he didn't have a great LP, and coupled with his subpar scores this season, I just don't have a lot of confidence in him at the moment. Not that I'm implying that Kris will crumble at Euros, but he hasn't proven to me yet that he's over-all a better competitor than Sasha. As much as I adore Koffe (I'm probably his biggest fan on FSU), I know that he's a headcase.
However, the situation being what it is now, Majorov isn't emotionally mature enough to represent Sweden at big senior-level competitions like Euros and senior Worlds IMHO. A true athlete is a champion on and off the ice, and Sasha is clearly having trouble with the last part. I'm surprised the Swedish federation are still allowing him to fight for a Worlds spot at Nordics. I wouldn't have been so generous; he could still compete there, but I wouldn't name him to the 2011 World team even if he did skate better than his teammates. Denying Majorov a trip to Tokyo would be my "punishment" for his adolescent outburst, and hopefully it will force him to grow up a little.
I am certain that he could've expressed himself using more appropriate words. I hope he realizes that this isn't the only disappointment he will encounter in his life, especially considering that he's part of a sport where the odds of success is stacked against him. Hopefully he's learned a great deal from this experience and is better equipped to handle his anger/disappointment(s) in a more positive manner next time.
I also think that being taken out of consideration for the worlds team would have been a suitable punishment here. While I do feel rather sorry for him (I don't think he would get this much exposure in Swedish media even if he medaled at junior worlds), his reaction was very childish and makes it pretty obvious that he is not ready for senior worlds yet.
I guess it's a case of the Swedish federation needing Majorov as much as he needs them. They don't want to alienate him (and have him quit or leave Sweden) or have to be dependent on Berntsson if he scores really low at Euros.
It could of course also be the case of the federation knowing Majorov well enough to know that this behaviour is very uncharacteristic of him and feeling confident that he won't do anything similar in the future.
Either way I rather hope Berntsson and Schultheiss do really well at euros and get to go to worlds.
Except that Majorov is usually an even worse headcase. His nerves got the better of him at Nationals, and I still remember his last outing at Euros where he fell 4 times in the FP (admittedly Schultheiss had a crap outing that year too). He's older now, but I don't know if his nerves are any better. If Berntsson implodes he tends to still perform his other elements reasonably well and will have higher PCS.
That said, if Majorov beats Schultheiss and/or Berntsson at Nordics, send him to Worlds. He needs the experience. I don't think most Swedish people gives a damned what he said or didn't say on FB (possibly because 99% of the population probably has no idea who he is ), so I don't think there'll be any in regards to him representing Sweden.
Sheesh, I didn't condone his rant. I just said I didn't understand why people were getting their shorts all in a bunch for a 19-year-old guy ranting stupid stuff on Facebook. Nor do people need to get their shorts all in a bunch over me stating that people do or say stupid things all the time. If I got a nickel for everyone who writes stupid offensive stuff on Facebook and Twitter for the world to see, I'd be so rich ...
Weeks later this post is still on the first page, I'd say that's pretty weird.
After watching the Men's SP for Euros, I think the Swedish fed may now be worried that Schultheiss might quit after this season. (Perhaps they were already aware about his depression, and it could partially explain why they were very supportive when Koffe announced he would compete for one more season.) I think you make a very good point as to why they were more lenient on Sasha than what we would've expected.
I haven't forgotten that Sasha can be inconsistent as well , but what I meant to say that he has been a better competitor over-all this season than Kristoffer so far. I should have made that clearer.
I can only speak for myself, but if a similar situation happened in Canada where a young athlete in a not-so-popular sport said racist/sexist comments, I wouldn't want him/her to represent my country at a major international event. I may not follow the sport s/he is competiting in, but I still care about how an athlete's behaviour might effect how other nations perceive us.
I used a hyperbole, as usual. Sorry.
What I meant is that by saying "Swedish pussies..." if he identified Swedes as "them" - a group separate from himself.
I imagine that you don't talk about your Swedish friends or Swedish tv because being a Swede who lives in Sweden those things are implicit and obvious to you.
You mention the nationality when identifying those elements which are different.
Of course Alexander might feel Swedish but in a moment of sadness and anger, could feel that he was not being seen so by the federation, that it was something that contributed to the decision not to select him for the national team.
Anyhow, just my musings.
I was over the top in my post, myself but I felt really angry with his outburst because I know too well what it's like being on the receiving end of speech like this.
I know this is old news, but in the interest of fairness, I thought I would post whiteskates' translations of the video and radio interviews that I've shared earlier. Now that Sasha will be at senior Worlds, there may be some non-Swedish speakers who want to hear more of his side of the story.
Majorov: I didn't mean what I said. It has been blown up out of proportion.
Reporter: Why did you write it then?
Majorov: I wrote it in anger. It was just an impulsive thing and was unnecessary, and I'm not proud of it, but I did delete it shortly afterwards. I hoped everything would be OK and that no one from the figure skating association would see it. And then I thought about things and realized it was partly my fault because I didn't skate well at the Swedish Championships.
Reporter: So what now? A new start or...?
Majorov: I don't know. I hope the figure skating association forgives me and understands that I didn't mean to criticize them. I was a bit angry at myself and took it out on others. But if they forgive me, all I can do is keep going and try harder.
Majorov: Hmmm... I feel really bad. What I wrote on Facebook was mostly for my friends. My parents weren't at home, so I couldn't tell them how I felt. I was crossed because I didn't get to go to Europeans, so I posted just to get some consolation from my friends and some comments with their opinions. But I did understand that it was wrong of me to write it, so I deleted it maybe ten or twenty minutes after I had written it and had calmed down. Then my mother woke me up and she was in tears and I immediately understood why.
Reporter: The first thing that you wrote which you yourself have quoted, for example "F*** you, idiots..." If you had been standing in front of the national team leaders, would you have been able to say it to their faces then considering the anger that you felt inside?
Majorov: Absolutely not! They know I never use bad language, I usually say nothing at all. What happened just happened, but I did delete it because I understood that what I wrote was wrong. I didn't think, I just wrote…bad words. I don't know why I did it, it was like if you hit your toe, you use bad language, it's the same thing. An impulsive thing that I did and I'm not proud of it.
Reporter: Do you think this will affect you in future in competitions?
Majorov: I hope it won't, but that's what I fear right now. I don't know if people are angry with me now or not, but some may understand what I meant, maybe they understand how sad I was because they've seen me work quite hard. But some may be angry and misunderstand me.
Separate names with a comma.