Adelina Sotnikova

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by koatcue, Sep 29, 2011.

  1. kwanatic

    kwanatic Well-Known Member

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    I never said Adelina was without her problems nor did I say she could beat Kim, Kostner or Asada...but she could put pressure on them to perform as she proved at Europeans when she beat Kostner in the SP. I did say her jump technique needs to be tweaked as does most of these younger girls and that includes Gracie Gold who often jumps with too much of her upper body when she gets nervous and Kaetlyn Osmond who pitches forward on her landings.

    Adelina has her issues, no denying that. But if she were to tweak her technique over the next few years that would help to stabilize her jumps. If her jumps were stable that would give her more confidence and may lead to better consistency in her jumps. Consistency in jumps for Adelina would put her among the top contenders in the post-Sochi field of ladies. She usually gets the highest PCS of all the newer girls even with her weaker performances and with clean performances she'd build up her reputation and from there, her PCS would rise.

    I don't think Adelina has as much room for improvement as Gracie does but then again Adelina isn't in the same boat as Gracie when it comes to presentation, maturity, interpretation, performance, etc. She has all of that already...Gracie needs a lot of work in those areas. Adelina can improve but she's pretty decent in those areas already. She needs better programs to showcase those aspects of her skating. I thought her SP from last season was great but her FS was a bit of a hot mess.
     
  2. Autumn_girl

    Autumn_girl Active Member

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    I wonder where all these "chronic of UR problems" talks come from. She does have problems with rotating her 3-3, but that's about it, her single triples are usually fully rotated and she gets good GOEs for them. Someone like Mirai Nagasu could be called a chronic URer, Adelina doesn't have such problems to be called that.
    I think she is the best all-around skater among younger ladies, but her scores didn't really reflect that yet because of inconsistensy and not so good programs. She is 17 now and hopefully puberty issues stay in the past, plus she has a new choreographer (and Chernyshev can choreograph such amazing things like Clair de Lune LP he made for Kawaguti-Smirnov), I hope this year Adelina finally gets the programs she deserves. With clean skates and good programs, IMO, she will deservedly get significally higher PCS than Gold or Osmond
     
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  3. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

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    But the only way urs would go away is if she stopped doing triple toes in combos. Or got rid of the uring by going to a jump coach. So ur is a chronic problem on triple toes. Like it's a limited chronic uring but consistent. She's not uring every triple bit enough to hurt her. 3/3 and 2a/3t ur. Also when she tried lutz loop combos. So she can eliminate triple toes and do double toes but there goes any future. It would be good if she did something about her jump problems. I am sure she is trying something to improve but it's rare that she's ever asked about jumps. Just music really.
     
  4. shine

    shine Well-Known Member

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    And why? SS I give it to her, but I wouldn't say she's substantially better. PE? CH? IN? TR? No really at all.
     
  5. Autumn_girl

    Autumn_girl Active Member

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    Among the youngsters Osmond, IMO, has the weakest basics, Adelina's basics, on the other hand, are the strongest. Better skating skills, ice coverage, much better lines and she is growing into a real performer. She just needs better programs
     
  6. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    Really? I would think Li Jijun has the weakest basics. But I am no expert
     
  7. museksk8r

    museksk8r Holding an edge and looking dangerously sexy

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    I believe Osmond and Sotnikova are the only two of the young crop who can come anywhere close to the top 3 in the World on a PCS standpoint. Osmond's transitions, choreography, and musical interpretation are sensational for someone as young as she is. She has attack and confidence and doesn't appear fearful of competition at all. Sotnikova's skating skills, lines, and maturity are marvelous as well for her young age. I have a soft spot in my heart for Tuktamysheva as well; I hope she can skate with confidence and happiness; her smile is infectious. :)

    Gold rushes through the music seemingly ignoring anything is playing, has windmill arms, doesn't finish or extend any of her choreography, but can rely on her mostly steady technique. Her transitions aren't anywhere near as difficult as Osmond's either.

    Li would be my pick for most lacking in skating skills of the young crop.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2013
  8. kwanatic

    kwanatic Well-Known Member

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    I agree with your points regarding Osmond, Sotnikova and Gold.

    I don't think Li is "lacking" in skating skills per se, but she's not as good as the other 3. Osmond, Sotnikova and Gold all skate big and leave a bigger overall impression on the ice. Li's style is very light, delicate and lyrical and sometimes it's harder for that kind of skating to stand out when you compare it to flair/pizazz (Osmond), maturity/presentation (Sotnikova) or just straight power/speed (Gold).

    From a skills standpoint Li moves with ease across the ice, her speed isn't bad, and she generally skates relatively well. She'll have to work on bringing out that power and making her skating stand out.
     
  9. Blair

    Blair New Member

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  10. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    I'm not an expert. From my layman's pov, Li doesn't show good use of edges, and when she changes edges she often has to put the other foot down quickly.
    Adelina definitely has good SS compared to the other upcomers.
     
  11. troika

    troika New Member

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    In the new EX program Adeline demonstrated superb musicality, attention to all nuances and overall was very enjoyable (especially when she put wings down). She could not be compared to Mao or Carolina yet, but surpassed Gold by far.
     
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  12. shine

    shine Well-Known Member

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    Do not agree. I would say Tukt and Li have the weakest basics. Osmond has one of the best power and speed but needs to use her knees and blades better to manage getting through all the turns across the ice in the step sequences without losing steam. That's where Sotinikova does better than her. I don't agree Sotnikova's lines are "much better" though. People always comment on her lines but I find her upper body hunched, arms awkward and a bit too forceful. She has straighter legs, but Osmond IMO has much more beautiful and "classier" upper body carriage. More like a dancer.
    Actually I think Gold probably has the best basics among these girls. Her speed is not only amazing but also seems so effortless.
    This is such an exciting crop :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2013
  13. Autumn_girl

    Autumn_girl Active Member

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    For Osmond I have only two words: ballet lessons. She desperetly needs them. No lines at all, rushed movements and very sloppy overall, unpolished, messy even. She makes it up somehow with difficult transitions and spark, but IMO, she needs to work on her weaknesses to reach the top.
    About Gold I don't like her "windmill" arms and the fact she is skating on straight legs, if she could bend her knees a bit her edges would've been deeper and cleaner. She also rushes with her movements and ignores the music, but maybe that can be improved with better programs.
    Li is lovely and light, her basics aren't weak, she just needs more power. Same with Tuktamysheva who needs to improve her ice coverage (can get better with well choreographed programs though). And both need to try different styles, Zijun's skating is very soft and lyrical even in programs like tango or Dark eyes where she needs more character, while Liza stucked with latinas and flamencos, I would rather see her in something lyrical, she is capable of so much more than she shows.
    With good programs Adelina deserves higher PCS than them because she already has it all, just needs a bit more work here and there and more confidence
     
  14. shine

    shine Well-Known Member

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    Pretty funny you should say that. Of course every figure skater can use some ballet training if they are not already doing so, but Osmond has a much better port de bra and pacing of movement than Sotnikova, who to me is the more desperate one in need of ballet classes. (Her Tango??) We obviously see lines and carriage differently, so to each his own.
     
  15. DobrinFan

    DobrinFan Active Member

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  16. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    There are some exceptions to this. Radka Kovarikova had a lovely posture and lines but she never had ballet training. I don't think Kristi Yamaguchi had any. Midori Ito did take some ballet lessons. I doubt that Irina Slutskaya had any, but I could be wrong.

    In general though I agree that all figure skaters should take at least some ballet lessons.
     
  17. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

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    Too bad the flip remains bad and first one couldn't be successful. Single. It's her biggest problem and even if she has a good program with Carmen for competitions a single flip has to be seen as almost a part of it. Or flip fall. Maybe she'll do a flip successfully in the long program.
     
  18. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    Is a 3lutz3loop with e and < still worth more than a clean 3toe3toe?

    Great that she is selling the program but I don't think Carmen and frentic are a good match. The steps are a little embarrassing.

    2axel is wonderful.

    I felt she had a great flying camel combination last season but this season she ends it in such a weird (albeit unique) position that it is almost distracting.
     
  19. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    She should just skip the flip and focus on what she does consistently well. Under COP she will not lose much by skipping the flip even in the LP.
     
  20. DobrinFan

    DobrinFan Active Member

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    Well at WTT she had a e and < on her lutz/toe and still scored 67+, compared to 67+ with a clean toe/toe at Europeans. So maybe she can still score around that with her e and < on lutz/loop. Which would still be a pretty good score! Maybe even 70+ if she didn't have those darn e and <.

    Also there is an interview with her coach today that says she skating to Rondo Capriccio by Camille Saint Saens an upgrade from her junior days. http://fsrussia.ru/news/664_elena-buyanova-vse-programmy-poluchilis-ochen-interesnymi/
     
  21. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

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    You are absolutely right! A message should be sent to tarasova about jump values!
     
  22. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

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    Low.
     
  23. Domshabfan

    Domshabfan Searching for Cizeron's Instagram

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    Very high on beating Mirai, and Low on beating Mao
     
  24. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

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    Frankly after last season, even Mirai might beat her.
     
  25. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    I like this new short. Tarasova has been eating her Wheaties and taking her vitamins lately. This almost didnt look like her work. This and her free for Mao last year are examples of some of her best work if you ask me. Anyway, the first spin with that sit spin that does not have a tight clean position should be modified or improved. I'm not 100% confident that the step sequence will ever quite move across the ice like TAT probably envisioned it. Overall though for this time in the year, this is quite beautiful. Tarasova has given her a really fresh look IMO. Womanly but not at all tacky. Bravo!
     
  26. Autumn_girl

    Autumn_girl Active Member

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    It's not TAT's work. Chernyshev coreographed both programs for Adelina this season
     
  27. DobrinFan

    DobrinFan Active Member

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    Peter Tchernyshev is choreographer of Adelina's SP, LP, EX. That's why her programs are looking better!
     
  28. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    Damn Wikipedia has me eating crow! I shouldnt have went against my gut. I thought i read somewhere that Peter did it so why i believed Wiki? My bad. SO great job peter! Tat, retire. lol
     
  29. DobrinFan

    DobrinFan Active Member

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    It's cool!!! You can believe she was there watching with a watchful eye though. lol
     
  30. DobrinFan

    DobrinFan Active Member

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