3 women abducted as teens a decade ago found alive in Cleveland; 3 brothers arrested

Discussion in 'Off The Beaten Track' started by Sylvia, May 7, 2013.

  1. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    The Daily Mail, not known for its journalism, has this

    Sounds like she had a less than happy home life before she disappeared and then a horrible, horrible time in captivity. I hope she can have a happy life after this!
  2. Jenny

    Jenny From the Bloc

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    So sad :( If the poor woman has severe facial injuries it might not be a pretty picture - I do hope the media does not go crazy trying to get a picture of her.
  3. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    Me too.

    Apart from the one released when Amanda was reunited with her sister, there haven't been any other pics so far. Amanda, her daughter and Gina all hid their faces when they returned home.

    I'm sure they'll give interviews at some point, if they want to, but I doubt that's high on their to do list right now. There's a lot of emotional healing that needs to be done. The media hanging around outside their houses isn't going to hasten that at all...
  4. Buzz

    Buzz Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't sound like Michelle's mother stressed herself out about her missing daughter all that much if her neighbours had no idea about Michelle. Barbara Knight also seems to have her hands full already so even if she is genuine, I'm nor sure Michelle will get the love, attention, and patience she will need on her long road to recovery if she lived with her mother.
  5. Jenny

    Jenny From the Bloc

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    I don't know if I'd hold that alone against her. Not everyone likes to talk about their losses and sorrow, and since she had other children perhaps she chose to focus on energies on them, for their own benefits and hers.
  6. dardar1126

    dardar1126 Well-Known Member

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  7. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    She searched for her daughter for years after the police refused to register her as a missing person. She made up and handed out fliers at her own expense, and continued to do it long after she left Ohio. I don't think you can say anything about the love and attention she needs and deserves from the lack of neighbourly gossip and an article in the Daily Mail, which I refuse to even call a newspaper...
  8. Twizzler

    Twizzler Well-Known Member

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    Watching all the news reports, I'm stunned that they are repeatedly saying the child's name. She's a minor. Isn't that some sort of violation??

    I don't recall the names of Jaycee Dugard's children ever being released.
    Last edited: May 9, 2013
  9. FigureSpins

    FigureSpins New Member

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    The reason why all three brothers were taken in is explained in this article.[FONT=.HelveticaNeueUI] http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2013/05/police_report_michelle_knight.html[/FONT]
    [FONT=.HelveticaNeueUI]
    [/FONT]

    [FONT=.HelveticaNeueUI]Apparently, the culprit and one brother were found together and one asked if it was related to the third brother's own issues. Smart move- easier than letting him go and trying to find him later if there were questions.[/FONT]
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    [/FONT]
    Last edited: May 9, 2013
  10. FunnyBut

    FunnyBut Well-Known Member

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  11. Rob

    Rob Beach Bum

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    This looks like it is a current picture of Amanda, her daughter, and her aunt. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rys-baby-save-lives.html?ICO=most_read_module
    I saw another version of this with the child's face blurred, but this one is dailymail, ya know.
  12. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    That's the one I'm talking about - the one they released when she was reunited with her sister.

    The face is blurred now because the family have decided that they don't want the little girl's picture published. Too bad media outlets around the world had already shown it! The same goes with the name - it's whatever the family wants.

    Jaycee Duggard didn't want her daughter's names or faces revealed, and I think that was a very smart move. This seems to have been a far more chaotic, opportunistic rescue. A lot of information and details went out before the families had a chance to stop it.

    Incidentally the Guardian (UK newspaper) has a policy of not printing the names of sexual assault victims. Now that Castro has been charged, the Guardian has stopped using the girls' names, even though they can be found all over the internet. I really admire this :)

    And yes, poor Michele Knight has had a horrible time of it. She's apparently told police there was another girl there who she never saw, but who disappeared suddenly. The tabloids are all saying who it could have been, but I've yet to see this be reported by a reputable news source.
  13. dardar1126

    dardar1126 Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: May 10, 2013
  14. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

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    The current issue of People Magazine shows Amanda's daughter and mentions her name as well. I read elsewhere that the first girl abducted, Michelle, has still not been reunited with any family members and is apparently still hospitalized.
  15. danceronice

    danceronice Corgi Wrangler

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    Well, there are FBI teams in the backyard in "protective gear" (I would assume coveralls and masks for biologic contamination) digging big holes, per CNN this afternoon...one of my coworkers said he hoped they'd find evidence one of the dead babies was born alive and killed, so they could charge him with capital murder (which IIRC is the only way you can get the death penalty in Ohio-we were getting this back to back with Jodi Arias coverage and he was of the opinion Castro deserves to fry even more than she does.) If there was another girl and she "disappeared" maybe there's another option for a capital murder...
  16. attyfan

    attyfan Well-Known Member

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  17. Twizzler

    Twizzler Well-Known Member

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    A good start would be to chain him to his bed, open his cell door, and let the inmates have their way with him.

    The death penalty is too easy of a solution for him. He needs to suffer for awhile...a long while.
  18. backspin

    backspin Active Member

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    A part of this that makes my blood boil is that, even if he spends the rest of his life in prison, his life will still be better than his victims' were.
  19. Twizzler

    Twizzler Well-Known Member

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    They just showed a brief clip of Castro's mother speaking on Telemundo. Heart wrenching. I do feel for her. I can't comprehend how a mother can process giving birth to such a sick, twisted monster.
  20. Choupette

    Choupette New Member

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    I don't know if I can express how sad I feel every time I think of this. :( :( :( It's so depressing...

    I even have trouble to think of the criminal as a human being. This is just so inhumane.
  21. danceronice

    danceronice Corgi Wrangler

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    Only if they put him in solitary...otherwise, just put him in with the general prison population and don't be too attentive with surveillance and the problem solves itself. It's a point of pride for more garden-variety killers, drug dealers, and rapists to take out notoriously twisted prisoners or at least make them suffer. Accidents and homemade weapons happen....
  22. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    Being in long term solitary confinement is really not something to look forward to, and I think it sounds like an apt punishment for Castro.

    I don't believe in execution (or rape) by inmate as a form of punishment that society should accept, even for the nastiest of criminals.
    missing and (deleted member) like this.
  23. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    And I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
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  24. skatingfan5

    skatingfan5 Well-Known Member

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    ITA -- While I can understand that some feel intense rage and wish for "an eye for an eye," it disturbs me to think that some wish for murder/torture to be enacted by others in the name of "justice". The idea of lowering oneself (even in thought) to the same violent level of the perpetrator makes me cringe.
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  25. danceronice

    danceronice Corgi Wrangler

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    I don't care one way or another, just saying what tends to happen to perpetrators of certain crimes in the general prison population. It simply is. Personally I favor execution or, I think technology has advanced we could develop true solitary--no need at all for human contact or even allowing the prisoner out of a cell ever, as everything can be monitored and accessed remotely.

    And of course it's always interesting what sort of crimes people who've committed fairly horrible offenses themselves consider beneath them and intolerable.
  26. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. And while obviously it's not relevant to this case, there is the possibility of wrongful convictions. I would rather not imagine what someone like, say, James Bain went through.

    They tried that in the 19th century with the idea of silent prisons, no interaction and very little sensory experience. Prisoners were meant to reflect on their actions and do penance, but it didn't go very well - many developed serious mental health issues. I'm not sure such a thing would be constitutional.

    BTW, existing supermax prisons/units already keep inmates in the cells for 22-23 hours a day, and allow them very little contact with anyone.

    ETA: I've been thinking of the three women and the many challenges facing them, and I'm especially concerned about Amanda Berry's daughter. She's probably too young to understand what her mother went through, but some day she will, and I'm sure it will be difficult for her. I hope they'll all get the help and care that they need.
    Last edited: May 10, 2013
  27. Norlite

    Norlite New Member

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    Well said.
  28. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    I couldn't agree more.

    The whole point of the jury trial and "reasonable doubt" thing is to prevent abuse of the system. The number of people who would just happily lock people away without a key and without caring whether or not they are really guilty is just alarming.

    The same goes for punishment. I visited a prison once when I was in law school and believe me...it's one of the most depressing places on the planet. The prisoners may have a TV, but they're also in a confined place where they can't spread their arms out and turn 360 degrees, where they live in constant fear, where the days are endless and life is grim. It is a fairly apt punishment.
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  29. Angelskates

    Angelskates Active Member

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  30. Jenny

    Jenny From the Bloc

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    Agree - I don't think that the solution to violence is more violence, and I like the idea that anyone "deserves" what some here and elsewhere are suggesting. Do we really want justice to be delivered by other criminals, or to encourage people to bypass the justice system and conduct their own trial and punishment?

    I think it's more important than ever at times like these to uphold the principles of justice in a civilized society, and to set a standard of humanity rather than cruelty.
  31. taf2002

    taf2002 Well-Known Member

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    As details about Castro come out, I can't understand why NO ONE ever told police that he might be a person of interest, esp since all 3 women disappeared in his vicinity. He was on record of committing domestic violence against his wife which included not only beating her but locking her up & isolating her. For that matter, the police in his district had to know his history so when they got calls about strange noises coming from his house & about women calling for help, why didn't they take it seriously?

    As for Dejesus's mother, she sounds like a nut & if I were Gina I would get as far as possible away from her. Forgiving is one thing but to say you'd go up to him & hug him is insane. Gina was 14 yrs old - he raped a young girl & then kept on doing it! How does that compute to a mother hugging him & God blessing him? Many religions encourage forgiveness - does any of them say to do that?
  32. bek

    bek Guest

    I haven't read the article but I don't think she's saying he shouldn't be tried for his crimes. I do know that apparently the Dejesus family are offering their home to Michele Knight. So they do sound like good people.
  33. duane

    duane New Member

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    Exactly. The PC comments are funny. What do people think goes on in prison on an everyday basis? If people are so against rape, torture, and murder in prison, then they should be against anyone being sent to prison. And yes, there is a hierarchy in prison, and those convicted of crimes low on the hierarchy (and child rape and/or murder is the lowest of the low) suffer the worst. I won't feel at ALL sorry if Castro suffers while in prison, and it that means I'm lowering myself, so be it.
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  34. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    So be it. :rolleyes:
  35. *Jen*

    *Jen* Well-Known Member

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    I think that's pretty naive.

    Firstly, as the media have been so effective in pointing out, the hero neighbour also has a pretty extensive record of domestic violence. Castro has no record after a domestic incident in 1993. The crime statistics for that area of Cleveland could make Castro look like a saint with his record, and I'm pretty sure the fact he isolated his wife wasn't on the record...just the assault.

    Police receive hoax calls all the time. Something calling to say there's a woman and a baby in a house looking sad and like they want to leave doesn't give the police probable cause to enter, especially when they knocked on the door, looked around and no one was home. If the police started breaking into houses every time they received a call like that, there would be outrage.

    Thirdly, the police have no record of a lot of the incidents the media are reporting. For the most part, it's neighbourhood gossip and urban legends. Hindsight is always 20/20 and the day these girls were found, everyone was shocked and said they couldn't believe their friendly neighbour could have been involved. All the other allegations came out later, and just as with Jaycee Duggard, I think a lot of it comes from a community struggling to make sense of a shocking crime they don't understand.

    Even his kids had no idea, and they'd visited the house. The man is a sociopath. He was capable of carrying on in every day life as though nothing had happened, and while the signs make sense looking back, at the time no one alone had a clear enough picture to be able to connect the dots.

    As for Gina Dejesus's mother - I read that on the Daily Mail so don't believe for one second that they got the context right. She's probably just glad he didn't kill her daughter. She may have been quoted only partially, and or out of context. Who knows. Who cares? I don't think we can conclude from it that she's a bad mother.
  36. made_in_canada

    made_in_canada INTJ

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    I think it's admirable. What's the point of directing hate at a man who clearly is messed up, and will now have to be accountable for his actions. She's not saying what he did was acceptable or denying that it's despicable just that that level of hate has no business in her life.
  37. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    Actually, at least one person pointed a finger at him at the time. But there was no evidence.

    I didn't see anything crazy about her remarks. I wouldn't be able to hug him myself but I think that says more about me and how I have trouble forgiving than it does about her.
  38. duane

    duane New Member

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    I'm sure Castro would appreciate it if you became his pen pal and provided moral support :)rolleyes: right back at you).
  39. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    That's what you take away from a person's belief that no one should be raped and/or tortured even if they're in prison? Ooooookay.
  40. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    That's some bizarre logic. I'm against rape, torture and murder anywhere - prison included. This does not mean I'm opposed to the existence of prisons or to sending convicted criminals to prison; it means that I don't want people to be raped or murdered or otherwise assaulted in prison. While I am well aware that it does happen, I don't think society should accept it, and I most certainly don't think society should condone it. I don't feel sorry for Castro for having to go to prison, as his crimes appear to warrant that he spend the rest of his life behind bars. But I don't believe rape and murder should be considered appropriate (informal) sentences for anyone. Even if they are scum.

    And yes, what milanessa said too.