2012-13 ISU Grand Prix Assignments

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, May 21, 2012.

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  1. a56

    a56 New Member

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    I agree as well. The only reason any country would have to care about qualifying for WTT is the prize money. It would certainly not be because they primarily wanted to get the last spot over Italy for face-saving purposes, which makes no sense. It isn't the Olympics or worlds.
  2. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    Actually I do think China cares about WTT / Olympic Team Event. With their strong pairs fading and their singles disciplines not quite soup yet, I think they would love to still be able to grab a medal here and there.

    Also, a team event reflects more on the country's overall prowess, whereas an individual medal reflects more on the strength of the medallist.

    I am no gymnastics fan but IIRC they were happiest about their Team Gold back in 2008 and didn't really care nearly as much about individual medals.

    Exactly. Isn't qualifying a second man for Sochi / 2014 Worlds more important than some JGP spots that they are not going to use anyway?

    Zhang He can stay junior all he wants and secure JGP spots, but Yan Han has a legit top 10 shot at 2013 Worlds IMO.

    I hope if Yan Han performs well this season, China will at least consider sending Yan to 4CCs, and if he beats Nan Song there, sending him to Worlds instead. I can totally see Yan making top ten for years to come.
    Last edited: May 25, 2012
  3. Sasha'sSpins

    Sasha'sSpins Well-Known Member

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    ^^^
    THIS!
  4. NMURA

    NMURA Member

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    Prize money? What a corrupt notion of capitalism. National pride (=face) is the most important thing in Confucian-communist China. Especially, next year's WTT is a testing ground for Sochi team event. They surely don't want to miss that.

    I don't think 4CC is the deciding factor who goes to worlds. Song was not the highest finisher but still chosen. Han Yan has lost to Song about three times in a row at Chinese domestic competitions. The results could be different under the international judges though, the Chinese federation doesn't consider Yan is SO much talented as to override the tradition of seniority.
  5. fscric

    fscric Active Member

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  6. fscric

    fscric Active Member

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    I certainly agree with China caring about the Olympic Team Event but I'm not convinced about the other.
  7. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    I know. That's why I said I hope.

    And to be fair, Song isn't even that senior or more reliable. He went senior for 2 seasons and despite breaking through at the GP circuit last season he underperformed at 4CCs and Worlds for 2 seasons in a row.

    I can see China having hope in Song because, unlike Wu Jialiang and Guan Jinlin, he has the big jumps and is quite consistent. But so does Yan, and he is also a big PCS getter.
  8. jjane45

    jjane45 New Member

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    At this rate, Yan Han has zero chance for worlds even if he skates the lights out next season. Idiot federation! Grrrrrrr
  9. Frau Muller

    Frau Muller President of Dick Button Appreciation Club

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    The best news about the Sr GP assignments is the return of Johnny Weir, with TWO asignments. WOOOOHOOOO!!!! Oh yeah, baby!!!!!
  10. Mirai4life

    Mirai4life New Member

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    Mirai should have gotten two, eeeew.
  11. toddlj

    toddlj Well-Known Member

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    Rest assured, assuming she wants another, she will get another. She will be the top sub on the list and it is VERY likely someone will need a sub.

    (Perhaps she turned down a second assignment for some reason? Perhaps with a coaching change, she is worried about being ready? She's been remarkably quiet on Twitter about it.)
  12. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    You might be right. I guess it really depends on how close the Indy results are. For example, if Duarte/Grafton, Z/B, and C/S have really good showings it could be a tighter race. IIRC, pairs hasn't been this wide open in years. D/C were the obvious choice last year and, I believe, V/B were the TBA the year before and they had a great showing at Nationals the year before and were quite good throughout the summer. With both new pairings D/L and Y/R already getting a spot it would be good to give Z/B some international points since D/G have been on the JGP circuit for sometime. I am also curious about the new Danny O'shea partnership with Tarah Kayne. Maybe they will do well and grab a Senior B.
  13. RD

    RD Well-Known Member

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    well, last time she was open about her (skating) thoughts, she got eaten alive...I can't blame her for that this time.
  14. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Nagasu is first in line on the alternates list. There is a 95% chance she will get a second. There was almost no chance that Zawadzki would as a alternate.
  15. babayaga

    babayaga Active Member

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    Exactly. Most likely it's not Mirai who is robbed, but someone else who is 3rd-5th on the alternate list. One of them might not get the second assignment because Agnes got hers ahead of them.
  16. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

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    Mirai didn't skate well enough last season to deserve 2 events on the GP this year. She needs a wake up call.
  17. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    Well, Mirai did medal at a GP last year. I am sure she will end up with two GP's with her World Ranking and alternate standing. Or maybe this is USFS way to tell her to pull it together and skate to her potential. Worked for Zhang (who has nowhere near the success of Nagasu, but I had written Caroline off a couple of years ago and look what happened)
  18. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    Actually, no. He can always make his senior debut at Worlds 2012 and likely will if Song has an underwhelming season and Yan beats him at Nationals. He Zhang is a strong skater who can represent China well at JW if Yan goes to senior Worlds. Han Yan can do what Ricky Dornbush did in 2010-2011, JGP in the fall then senior Worlds in the spring, same goes for Josh Farris or Jason Brown.
  19. timmybopper

    timmybopper New Member

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    Did anyone figure out why Cynthia Phaneuf was left off the Canadian assignment list? Have they lost hope in her already? I see this going the way of Mira Leung...
  20. jjane45

    jjane45 New Member

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    The problem is, Chinese Fed tends to make up its mind at the beginning of season and stick to it. Yan will not win Nationals over Song barring major disasters. Seniority rules :S
  21. demetriosj

    demetriosj Well-Known Member

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    If she doesn't "deserve 2 events", who in your opinion did?
  22. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Jammers' likely reply: Why Ashley Wagner and Gracie Gold, of course! Every other U.S. girl should just decline their GP assignments. ;)
  23. demetriosj

    demetriosj Well-Known Member

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    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
  24. Pikachuusb

    Pikachuusb Active Member

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    LOL and gag all at once. Id stop watching if only those 2 were allowed to compete. Give me the others who didnt "deserve" to get a 2nd.
  25. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    I imagine the fed is over her, but she will get an assignment. SC just is in such disarray with their ladies right now. And we thought the US had a slump. I think the Junior Skater Osmond? has potentially, but she is nowhere near the quality of our Junior or middle of the pack senior skaters..... They will probably monitor Phaneuf, but her technique isn't horrible. I can't figure out her problem. It seems mostly mental and growth issues. She seems scared on the ice and needs a good skate to bring her confidence back. Seeing her live at 4cc was sad. I do think she is okay and would hope she tries for one more year.
  26. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    The only spot Phaneuf has a reasonable chance of getting is the TBD for Skate Canada, as, if the rules are the same as last year, there are ten Ladies ahead of her that have to be offered a second before Top 75 skaters are considered, assuming their country doesn't have three and the travel/visa logistics aren't prohibitive. Last season, there were three non-host withdrawals (two for Lepisto, one for Hecken), and two substitutes in total.
  27. Rock2

    Rock2 New Member

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    I'd send Cynthia to B comps this year and let her ride the bench a little. She hasn't had a decent result in any GP in her comeback so time's up honey, as much as I love ya.

    I want to see Samson get monitored, do well, and get the 3rd spot.
  28. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    They should just send Duhamel........
  29. danafan

    danafan Canadian ladies ├╝ber

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    We should send Phaneuf, Desanctis, and Najarro to the new US senior B and send the highest of them to Skate Canada.
    I'm sure her dismal skate at WTT didn't help Phaneuf's cause.
    Osmond seems by far the best chance of getting two spots for Sochi.
    What are the chances of Osmond picking up a second grand prix later on?
  30. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Unless she wins an early Senior B and they've changed the rule so that the winners of Senior B's go to the top of the alternates list, not the bottom, about the same as Pfaneuf's, virtually none without more rule changes (like putting GP medalists at the top of the alternates list): there are six women with Top 24 SB and four women with Top 24 WS ahead of her on the alternates list, each of whom has to get a second before she is even in the Top 75 selection pool. After that, both she and Phaneuf would be in the first group of three with Flatt, and even if a flu swept the Ladies and over 1/5 of the remaining field had to pull out of the other five events to to the Top 75, would a host nation choose her over the other two, if they are trying to protect their own Ladies' chances, since they get a choice of the top three?
  31. justAfsfan

    justAfsfan New Member

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    I really want to know if Chinese fed choose Song over Yan just because of age?

    If they care so much about face then Yan has much more chance to give China the result than Song.
  32. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    I must say I am a bit frustrated re: Phaneuf. I mean, she is as inconsistent as Czisny or Korpi, but she has the skating skills to be at the top. But for various reasons just couldn't quite make it happen.

    Shame that she got held back during 03-04 when she could have gone to a world championship, and that she didn't medal at 2010 worlds (her best showing).
  33. NMURA

    NMURA Member

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    When I said "face", it means qualifying for WTT over small countries like Italy. I assume the Chinede federation (officials) felt humiliated this year, since they were the only GP host failed to qualify. The best chance to accumulate points is to send Yan to JW and Song to WC. Sending Yan to both is a waste.
  34. zgr4088

    zgr4088 New Member

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    JW doesn't count because China has three skaters in 4CC. It's better to send Han Yan to GP and 4cc if the Chinese federation really cares about WTT
  35. manhn

    manhn Well-Known Member

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    Why in the friggin world would China give a friggin damn about friggin WTT? Where is this coming from? Unless, I see the Chinese Fed forcing Shen/Zhao to compete at WTT, I am assuming the folks at the Chinese Fed are not idiots.
    LadyNit and (deleted member) like this.
  36. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    I don't know if I would compare her to Cziney or Korpi, but Phaneuf has been a mess since her great showing as a young girl in the early 2000's and in 2010, but it was a weak post Olympic field, no disrespect for her, but Cziney and Korpi have pulled things together, even if not consistently for a few years. Cziney had a great season last year and looked good a SA and even TEB. She started faltering at GPF, but her Nationals performance wasn't a travesty. The 4CC's lack of invite concerned me and so did the senior B, but I do honestly think Phaneuf will get the TBA.
  37. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

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    Aside from the not insubstantial :bribe:, there is also the fact that team medals will be at stake in Sochi.
  38. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    China specifically targeted summer sports with the most available Olympic medals for its summer sports program. It wouldn't be at all a surprise if they looked at WTT as a route to the Olympic team event.
  39. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    I can see China caring about the Olympic team event, but I don't see a big link between that and keeping Yan Han in JGP. I mean, Yan can totally help the team event by rocking senior worlds next year. That said, I can see them keeping Yan Han's option open by deciding later whether to send him to jr or senior world. If Yan does GP and the new rule passes then Yan has no option but competes for the one Senior world spot. But that is a good option regardless of the team trophy
  40. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    It's possible that they look at Men's and think that if the make the final in 2014, given the likely competition -- Canada, France, and Russia, at least -- the odds of beating those men are not great and it won't impact their team strategy so much for Sochi. They could use Sochi as a development tool, and, at this point, they could be looking at Yan Han as their future strategy.

    I never thought I'd see a top 12 dance team from China, but if the Zaretski's can come in 6th, there's always hope.
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