2012-13 ISU Grand Prix Assignments

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, May 21, 2012.

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  1. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    Skating for a nation like Sweden allows him to do that. In a nation like the US, competition for senior Bs even is pretty competitive.
  2. YukiNieve

    YukiNieve Active Member

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    Have a few questions on host pick.

    - You can only pick one skater as host pick for 3 spots you have for your competition you host?

    - Do you have to choose the skater who has higher SB and/or WS even as a host pick if you have several candidates?

    Thanks!
  3. euterpe

    euterpe Well-Known Member

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    Additional notes:
    JPN
    8 men: six with two events each (Hanyu, Kozuka, Machida, Mura, Oda, Takahashi); one host pick (Murakami); and a TBA host pick

    USA
    7 men: five with two events each (Abbott, Miner, Rippon, Dornbush, Weir); one host pick (Razzano); and a TBA host pick

    RUS
    5 or 6 Men: one with two events (Gachinski); three with one invitation each (Menshov, Dmitriev, Voronov); one host pick (Bush); and a TBA host pick (could be Menshov, Dmitriev, Voronov or someone else)

    CAN
    4 or 5 men: two with two events each (Chan, Reynolds); one with one invitation (Rogozine); one host pick (Firus); and a TBA host pick (could be Rogozine or someone else)

    FRA
    3 men: two with two events each (Amodio, Joubert); and a TBA host pick

    CHN
    3 men: one with two events (Song); one host pick (Guan); and a TBA host pick

    CZE
    2 men with two events each (Brezina, Verner)

    ITA, KAZ, ESP
    one man with two events each (Contesti, Ten, Fernandez)

    BEL, SWE
    one man with one event (Hendrickx, Majorov)
  4. B.Cooper

    B.Cooper Active Member

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    Wouldn't this be reflective of Josh's coaching team....Damon Allen and Christy Krall being the ones who deliver the message to USFS as to if Josh wanted to stay on the JGP or move up to SGP??
  5. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    No (They have three host picks in each discipline.), and no.

    In fact, they can choose just about whomever they want, as exemplified by the French Federation chose Léna Marrocco, who was 69th on the Season's Best list.
    Last edited: May 22, 2012
  6. SamuraiK

    SamuraiK Well-Known Member

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    The ISU communication even states that Jr. Worlds and JGPF medallista are guaranteed a spot. Joshua Farris fits in both.. If this was a mistake from ISU I hope there's a way for him to appeal as son as possible.
  7. YukiNieve

    YukiNieve Active Member

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    Thanks, Vagabond!

    That is what I thought but I have been hearing different things,
    so wanted to make sure.
  8. HisWeirness

    HisWeirness Yay, new board!

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    Which communication??? The rules for GP selection are generally outlined in each season's GP announcement document, not an ISU Communication or in the ISU General or Figure Skating Rules.

    Last season's GP announcement (which was also IIRC released AFTER the GP assignments were announced :wall:) removed the language that guaranteed JGPF and JW medalists one GP spot.

    From 2011-12 GP announcement:
    From 2010-11 GP announcement:
    haribobo and (deleted member) like this.
  9. SamuraiK

    SamuraiK Well-Known Member

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    Here:
    http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/...3,4844-205151-222374-nav-list,00.html?id=1066

    How do we call this then? Press release???, whatever term you like to use, the fact is that they are publicly akwnoledging the that Jr. World medallists are assured of 1 spot.

    Maybe they just copied and pasted from an old announcement LOL
    HisWeirness and (deleted member) like this.
  10. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    This year's announcement says the same thing:

    http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/...3,4844-205151-222374-nav-list,00.html?id=1066

    ETA: IIRC, in the past, skaters who earned medals at both competitions received two berths, since each medal guaranteed them one berth.
  11. HisWeirness

    HisWeirness Yay, new board!

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    Right.

    I found a similar Grand Prix press release from last season here:
    http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vcontent/...-131973-133281-18886-313979-news-item,00.html

    The 2011-12 press release did not contain the JGPF/JW medalist guarantee that the 2012-13 press release states. I guess we'll have to wait for the ISU to issue the 2012-13 GP announcement (PDF document) to know what is going on... :confused: :)

    :wall: ISU :wall:
  12. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    Even if the rule about JGPF and JW medalists being guaranteed 1 event was removed, Josh is still number 20 on the most recently updated SB list which alone guarantees (or should have) him 1 event. Not getting 2 events I could understand, there were no promises about that, but either this is some kind of tactical error or USFS forgot to submit his name for selection or persuaded his coaches into having him stay on the JGP another season without him knowing. If he really wants to compete on the senior GP, he should make an appeal to the ISU outlining what I said above. There's even a chance he could get 2 assignments if USFS were to give him SA, and honestly, he's probably the skater most deserving of that spot if he tries to get this sorted out and turns down the JGP.
  13. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

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    Except I can't understand it when Dornbush got 2.
  14. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    Dornbush got 2 because the 3 top juniors of the season who were all supposed to get at least 1 event if not 2 aren't getting any events at all, whether it be voluntary or unvoluntary. Ricky was good last season at least and that's why his WR is as high as it is.
  15. seabm7

    seabm7 Member

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    I think the US federation blocked the request from Joshua. Their reason might be 2 JG assignments is better than 1 SG assignment. Moreover, if the proposed rule change is passed, once you enter into the SG circuit, you cannot go back to JW anymore.
  16. JasperBoy

    JasperBoy Well-Known Member

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    I am concerned that Canada's #4 man, Elladj Balde, is not listed for any GP. He could be given the one TBA at Skate Canada but surely he deserves an assignment in light of his placement at Cdn Nats.
  17. sadc

    sadc New Member

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    But the #3 man doesn't?
  18. love_skate2011

    love_skate2011 Well-Known Member

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    just came back from a month of remote vacation
    holy cow, I am happy for Miki's return :eek:

    weak entries for NHK trophy
    and Julia will be competing amonst all the big girls in France and China. good luck Julia

    and Shelepen getting only 1 assignment :(
    I hope she gets the host pick so she can get 2 or to Polina K.
    Last edited: May 22, 2012
  19. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    :eek: Thank you for correcting it :)


    If USFS submitted his name, he would have gotten at least one.

    The rule for the initial selection has been that after all of the skaters guaranteed two get two and all of the skaters guaranteed one get one, the host nations can pick from the Top 75 list for non-host picks.

    For the alternates list, last year's rules (v.1) state that all of the skaters in the Top 24 SB and WS guaranteed one who got only one in the initial selection have to get two before anyone in the Top 75 get selected for non-host picks, although there's no obligation to choose them.

    They had the JGPF/JW medalist guarantee up until last season.

    I'm not sure who is affected here: Lipnitskaia, Shelepen, Korobeynikova, Sotnikova, Gold, and Sinitsina/Zhiganshin all were Top 24 SB and would have been guaranteed one without taking JGPF/JW medals into consideration, with Sui/Han guaranteed two from their Worlds result. All of the rest weren't submitted for senior GP.

    Last year, without the medal guarantee, Monko/Khaliavin got two in the initial selection, and neither of them (USA, CHN) were host picks.

    This year, of the 12 Ladies who were Top 24, but not Top 12 at Worlds,
    Five got two: Lipnitskaia, Tukhtamysheva, C. Zhang, Gold, Sotnikova (1 host)
    Seven got one: Czisny, Nagasu, Korpi, Biryukova, Korobeynikova, Shelepen, Li.

    Gold doesn't have a host pick, and she didn't medal at JGPF, so I don't think the number of spots is tied to the number of JGPF/JW medals.

    I thought there might be a pattern where skaters in Top 24 SB and Top 24 WS got two over skaters with one but not the other, except where a skater got a host pick and a second, but I'm not seeing that: Korpi, for example, is ranked 5th in WS and 14th in SB. Nagasu is 13th in WS and 11th in SB. Zhang isn't in Top 24 WS.

    On a different note, skaters are tweeting left and right about how thrilled they are with their picks. As expected, no one has yet tweeted "I hate [list event]. My selections sux."

    But I thought Alex Shibutani's was worth posting:

    Now I know why @rossminer wanted to call it a day at 8:30 last night. He wanted to check GP assignments at 2am.​
  20. ItalianFan

    ItalianFan Member

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    I wouldn't bet on that if I were you.......
  21. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    This is what I'm saying. Shouldn't Josh decide when he wants to move up, instead of the Federation? USFS is selfish if they didn't submit his name just so they can send him to JW again and rely on him to secure maximum JGP spots if Josh told them he wanted to move up. It's what he DECIDED and they should respect that. This means he also probably wants to try and go to senior Worlds but maybe USFS will make sure this doesn't happen but lowballing his PCS again while giving others mega-inflation to make sure he gets JW and that's it...

    This will be his 5th season on the JGP :shuffle: and his JW performance showed at the age of 17, he is already one of the best senior men in the US. I mean, Denis Ten beat Abbott at Worlds and Josh creamed him at JW where Denis had performances of similar quality. Wake up and smell the coffee. Rippon is going nowhere without a major overhaul of technique and Ricky needs to prove himself to show he's a contender, just giving him more and more chances likely isn't going to rev him up to do so and show he really is a contender, because now he know it doesn't matter. I have my doubts about Miner ever being World or Olympic medalist material. They are being so dumb honestly, had his name been submitted I wouldn't be surprised to see Josh get 2 assignments and be the highest ranked American behind Abbott after the conclusion of the GP season, honestly.
  22. love_skate2011

    love_skate2011 Well-Known Member

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    btw, with Miki coming back is she staying with Morozov ?
    It will be interesting if Miki will stick with him and his new star Leonova :drama:

    Farris, Han and Brown seem like forever in juniors
    same for Shoji and Agafonova
  23. Jeschke

    Jeschke Well-Known Member

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    after the interview with morozov i cannot imagine miki and him working together again.
    ao it will be very interresting to see, who will be her coach, especially as she seems to be very instable with her nerves.

    i wish so bad for her to get an olympic medal, but competition will be tough.
  24. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    Do you think this is strategic or an omission?
  25. misskarne

    misskarne Spirit. Focus. Ability. Tenacity. Aussie Grit.

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    Interesting.

    Josh has deleted his tweet about the GPs.
  26. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    ^^^ Yes, I just noticed that this morning.

    I've since corrected my earlier post -- Japan has 7 different men with GP assignments and no TBA at NHK. They've filled their 3 NHK slots with Takahashi, Hanyu and Daisuke Murakami (host pick).

    It will be Farris' 4th season (he's competed in 6 JGPs and 2 Finals in 3 seasons).

    Farris had an extremely successful junior international season and skated superbly at 2012 Junior Worlds. Competing at the senior level nationally and internationally is a different ballgame, though, particularly mentally. I'm sorry that he won't get the chance to do the Senior Grand Prix (if that's what he really wanted), but he should have ample opportunities to prove himself and to continue improving his overall skating in the coming season, even if he's back on the JGP.
  27. JasperBoy

    JasperBoy Well-Known Member

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    You're right! J10 doesn't have an assignment either. What's happening at SC?
    Have they decided to overlook 2 seniors and go right to the junior rankings?

    Surely both J10 and EB are not injured?
  28. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Liam Firus is ranked #40 on the ISU's Season Best scores list and that's probably why Skate Canada picked him for one of their SC host spots.

    The Grand Prix minimum score cut-off for the men in 2012-13 is 159.66:
    78 Jeremy Ten 159.22 (2012 Four Continents)
    91 Elladj Baldé 151.57 (2011 Skate Canada)

    It shouldn't matter, though, if either man is Skate Canada's TBA host pick, correct? Perhaps both will be sent to the planned U.S. Senior B in Salt Lake City in September or to Nebelhorn Trophy to determine who will get Skate Canada?

    From the ISU's bulletin on the 2012-13 Grand Prix: http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/...3,4844-205151-222374-nav-list,00.html?id=1066
    MEN
    1 GP assignment received (listed in order of ISU SB score ranking):
    25 Sergei Voronov RUS
    28 Jorik Hendrickx BEL (#27 in World Standings)
    29 Andrei Rogozine CAN (#33 in WS)
    30 Artur Dmitriev RUS (#37 in WS)
    31 Jinlin Guan CHN (host pick)
    32 Zhan Bush RUS (host pick)
    33 Konstantin Menshov RUS (#21 in WS)
    36 Daisuke Murakami JPN (host pick)
    37 Alexander Majorov SWE (#15 in WS)
    38 Douglas Razzano USA (host pick)
    40 Liam Firus CAN (host pick)

    No initial GP assignment (in order of ISU SB score ranking, all JGP age-eligible men removed):
    3 Evgeni Plushenko RUS (Rostelecom Cup's TBA?)
    31 Misha Ge UZB
    41 Armin Mahbanoozadeh USA
    42 Brandon Mroz USA
    43 Peter Liebers GER
    44 Christopher Caluza PHI
    46 Viktor Pfeifer AUT
    47 Jialiang Wu CHN
    48 Chafik Besseghier FRA
    49 Kim Lucine MON
    50 Gordei Gorshkov RUS
    51 Zoltan Kelemen ROU
    53 Timothy Dolensky USA
    56 Paolo Bacchini ITA
    57 Ryuichi Kihara JPN
    59 Jiaxing Liu CHN
    61 Paul Fentz GER
    63 Javier Raya ESP
    65 Maciej Cieplucha POL
    66 Philip Warren USA
    77 Romain Ponsart FRA
    [Cut-off (159.66) is above #78 Jeremy Ten CAN 159.22]

    No SB score from 2011-12: Evan Lysacek USA - status still unknown (Skate America TBA?)

    LADIES
    1 GP assignment received (listed in order of ISU SB score ranking):
    8 Alissa Czisny USA (reportedly requested just one due to her injury; #4 in World Standings)
    11 Mirai Nagasu USA (#13 in WS)
    14 Kiira Korpi FIN (#5 in WS)
    15 Sofia Biryukova RUS
    17 Polina Korobeynikova RUS
    18 Kexin Zhang CHN (host pick, guaranteed 1)
    19 Polina Shelepen RUS (#23 in WS)
    24 Zijun Li CHN (#20 in WS)
    30 Christina Gao USA (host pick)
    35 Amelie Lacoste CAN (host pick, #21 in WS)
    37 Joshi Helgesson SWE (#17 in WS)
    38 Rachael Flatt USA (host pick)
    41 Kaetlyn Osmond CAn (host pick)
    42 Mae Berenice Meite FRA (#15 in WS)
    47 Bingwa Geng CHN (host pick)
    62 Sarah Hecken GER (#24 in WS)
    69 Lena Marrocco FRA (host pick)

    No initial GP assignment (in order of ISU SB score ranking, all JGP age-eligible ladies removed):
    39 Cynthia Phaneuf CAN (#25 in WS)
    44 Elena Glebova EST
    46 Jenna McCorkell GBR
    50 Sonia Lafuente ESP (#27 in WS)
    51 Joelle Forte USA
    53 Natalia Popova UKR (#31 in WS)
    60 Yuki Nishino JPN (#28 in WS)
    63 Min-Jeong Kwak KOR (ISU Junior age-eligible 1 more season)
    65 Isabelle Olsson SWE
    66 Adriana DeSanctis CAN
    68 Kate Charbonneau CAN
    70 Kerstin Frank AUT

    [I went down to #75 on the Ladies' SB scores list. Cut-off for the ladies' GP minimum score (113.43) is #98 Isabelle Drescher GER & above.]
    Last edited: May 22, 2012
  29. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    This.

    No, Josh should not decide when he wants to move up.

    It's not just about him and about what he wants.

    USFS should do what's in the best interest of US Figure Skating and not what's in the perceived best interest of an individual skater.

    Josh is certainly capable of making the JGPF and then even winning it, so keeping him on the JGP for one more season certainly makes more sense than him having just one GP and then placing in the middle of the pack, most likely.
  30. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    We dont know that Farris would have gotten just one gp. As more drop out he could easily end up with two.

    Anyway thetrickle down effect is that novice skaters like Shum or Howe will likely not get a jgp
  31. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    So then he could finish outside the podium at two GPs and never be able to skate in Junior events again.

    I guess USFS thought that him doing JGP for one more season would be a better option.

    And I agree with them.

    He still has a way to go with developing his PCS, building up reputation with the judges, etc.
  32. euterpe

    euterpe Well-Known Member

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    Then what happens if Josh finishes top two at Nationals? He can't do both JW and Worlds because of the date proximity.
  33. Theatregirl1122

    Theatregirl1122 Well-Known Member

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    He just goes to worlds. The point is for him to still have Jr. Worlds as an option, not that he must be sent.
  34. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    If he's top 2 at Nationals then they'd probably send him to Worlds and send Brown, Chen, and probably someone like Choate or Yostanto to JW instead. When Ricky won silver at Nationals after competing on the JGP they sent him to senior Worlds.
  35. pinky166

    pinky166 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, essentially that is how it works.

    I have a question though, I know skaters who have competed in senior internationals and no longer allowed to compete at JW, but can a skater who has competed in senior internationals but is still junior age eligible return to the JGP? I'm thinking of skaters like Juulia Turkkilla and Monika Simanckova who have competed at Euros and Worlds, but never on the GP yet, have no GP assignments, and are still young enough to do JGP again. Will they be allowed to compete on JGP this season or no?
  36. query5

    query5 New Member

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    all i am going to say is this,

    for the ladies, the cup of china, teb is going to barnburner with 3 world champs, up and comer junior if people stay the same.

    skate canada and rostelcom is really competitive because anyone like alena, adelina, caroline zhang, gracie gold, agnes, kanako , kiira can win it, not to mention victoria and valentina can medal-akiko elizaveta in skate canada and elene and ksenia

    skate america with ashley, adelina, rachel, alena, can win it plus christina, haruka possible medals

    nhk with mao, akiko, agnes, haruka possible alissa , elene

    so competitive if names stay same. stay tuned anyone can win and medal.

    the men in some events is just as competitive.

    the dance especially for 2nd 3rd so competitive anything can happen.

    hopefully not to many name changes in cast.
  37. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    I don't see why not.

    I'm compiling a list of JGP age-eligible singles skaters from the ISU Season Best scores list and will post it in the JGP Announcement thread in GSD later.
  38. love_skate2011

    love_skate2011 Well-Known Member

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    ^^

    Bloodbath at Trophee Eric Bompard and Cup of China for ladies
    weakest competitions are in Skate America and NHK in ladies
  39. Sylvia

    Sylvia Whee, summer club comps!

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    Re-posting from the U.S. Men's news thread since it's more relevant here:
  40. Maofan7

    Maofan7 Away

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    Yes, great job. Many thanks
    Last edited: May 23, 2012
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