10 Greatest Skaters Who Never Won An Olympic Medal?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by lamarenee, Mar 5, 2012.

  1. lamarenee

    lamarenee Active Member

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  2. orientalplane

    orientalplane Mad for mangelwurzels

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    I think the list is ridiculous.

    Urbanski and Marval, and no Kurt Browning? :rofl:

    And it's VERY US-centric.
  3. alij

    alij Active Member

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    Really confused as to how they discuss Kurt Browning in regard to Chris Bowman but he doesn't appear on the list in his own right as for me he is one of the greatest skaters never to have medalled at Olympics
  4. pat c

    pat c Well-Known Member

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    Their opinion, their list. I think they left off quite a few skaters who might be more deserving and didn't lay it down.
  5. DBZ

    DBZ Well-Known Member

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    I agree it's ridiculous.

    Marval and Urbanski? Seriously?
  6. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    Ridiculous sounds about right. That list without Kurt Browning cannot be taken seriously.

    I take it the authors are not very familiar with non-US skaters? Yeah, I thought so.

    The user comments are nearly as bad.

    ETA: Re Urbanski - "31 is like Betty White in figure skating years." Uh, not in pairs it's not. Obviously it's older than the average, but it's not that unusual.
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2012
  7. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

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    Delete Bonaly, rename the list "10 greatest AMERICAN figure skaters who never won an Olympic medal," replace Urbanski/Marval with Babilonia/Gardiner or Starbuck/Shelley, and add Blumberg/Seibert . . . and then I would have few quibbles with their list.

    As is, it's hard to believe they actually followed the sport outside the US media coverage. (And that does include Skating magazine, I'm afraid)
    alilou and (deleted member) like this.
  8. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Urbanski & Marvel. Oh my. :lol: They would be by far the worst skaters in any discipline to win an Olympic medal if they had.
  9. wickedwitch

    wickedwitch Well-Known Member

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    Not having Kurt Browning makes this more than just a difference of opinions. They're just wrong.
  10. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    A very strange explanation of their reasoning appears in the comments:

    So apparently if a skater was actually a medal contender, they don't count as one of the greatest who didn't medal, but those who weren't good enough to be considered real contenders can be considered as the underrated greatest. :confused:

    Was Todd really "always expected to medal"?
  11. Cheylana

    Cheylana Well-Known Member

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    I was a casual fan at best when they competed at the Olympics, and I remember thinking back in 1992 that the name "Rocky Marval" sounded like a character from the Flintstones. :shuffle: Oh, and their SBS spins were never in unison.
  12. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Actually the whole list is ridiculous. Tiffany Chin, Elaine Zayak, Surya Bonaly, Tonya Harding, and Jill Trenary could all be on a top 10 ladies singles to never win an Olympic medal, but it is doubtful any of them would have made a top 10 considering all disciplines.

    Meno & Sand is quite hilarious as well, despite that i liked them. Bowman and Bobek, the lazy and hard partying underachievers, please.

    As for Todd, despite that he would be a worthy inclusion on the list, he was rarely ever expected to medal as it turned out. In 92 and 2002 he wasnt for different reasons despite being the reigning World bronze medalists. In 94 he wasnt expected to make the team and didnt. In 1998 Kulik and Stojko were thought to be a lock on the first 2 medals, leaving Todd fighting with the up and coming Yagudin for the bronze (which Candelero eventually won), and had Urmanov competed he wouldnt have been given much hope of any medal. If he had skated his best in all Olympic the only medal he could have won is a bronze in 1998, or perhaps not with Candelero skating so well that night and getting very high artistic scores. So by that logic (only counting underdog types) he could have been included on the list.
  13. Sparks

    Sparks Well-Known Member

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    Before I opened the link, I immediately thought of 2 - Kwan and Browning. This list is bogus.
  14. Cheylana

    Cheylana Well-Known Member

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    Huh? Kwan medaled twice, what am I missing?
  15. Sparks

    Sparks Well-Known Member

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    Sorry. I was thinking Gold. Omit Kwan. Add Tai and Randy.
  16. mia joy

    mia joy New Member

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    Funny that there are no post-2000 skaters on the list, I could definitely think of some who could also make the list. Delobel/Schoenfelder and Brian Joubert come to mind, for example.
  17. icellist

    icellist Member

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    We should create a new thread for greatest alters that never made it to the Olympics: yukari nakano. I felt really bad for her and maybe Alissa czisny if she doesn't stick around until Sochi
  18. julieann

    julieann Well-Known Member

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    I would have to leave Rudy off the list as well :(
  19. nylynnr

    nylynnr Active Member

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    The coupling of Bowman and Bobek is hardly unique to judgejudy, it happens a lot when fans do retrospectives. But for whatever reason, I just want to point out that whatever Bowman's flaws, he never went to a world championships or Olympics and gave an embarrassing, or even "hot mess," type of performance (on the ice, at least). IIRC in four Olympic programs he fell once and turned out of perhaps two or three other jumps. He was never lower than 7th at worlds, and that 7th was after two really fine free skating programs in 1987. He also had a string of fine Skate America performances and, with the exception of the 1990 Goodwill Games, I don't remember many really poor international programs. Unfortunately much as I like her the same cannot be said of Bobek.
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  20. Susan M

    Susan M Well-Known Member

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    For me, Browning is THE greatest skater never to have medalled at the Olympics.

    I disagree with this. When I saw the subject, Todd was actually the first skater I thought of. Going into the 98 Olympics, I think most folks assumed the podium would be him, Kulik, & Stojko in some order. Folks did not expect Candeloro to come up with programs like that after wandering in the wilderness for the previous couple years.

    ITA about the author's logic - make a "best skaters who never medalled" list but exclude the very ones who were actually good enough to be expected to medal. :huh: I think they needed a different headline, like "skaters I used to enjoy watching who were not really good enough or dedicated enough to medal at the Olympics or who got really unlucky with injuries". Or maybe "skaters who should have medalled at the Olympics but got jobbed" would have been fun, too.
  21. leesaleesa

    leesaleesa Active Member

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    Kurt Browning, obviously.

    Maria Butyrskaya. Much more so than Harding or Bobek. She may have gotten shafted in Nagano for bronze.

    I vaguely remember Urbanski/Marval because he was a truck driver, and she got into some sort of fight with a speed skater or something. Being the top pairs skaters in the US usually meant top 10 internationally, not a medalist. Didn't John Zimmerman and that girl he skated with come closer than Urbanski/Marval?
  22. duane

    duane New Member

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    I disagree about Tonya. I think she easily makes a top 10 with all disciplines considered.
  23. HSGP21

    HSGP21 New Member

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    Kurt for sure. I also do agree with Todd...1998 was heartbreaking.

    In terms of US pairs, Kyoko Ina (with either partner) is a better choice than Urbanski and Marvel.

    Punsalen and Swallow, Bourne and Kratz, and Dubreuil and Lazon are all good choices in dance...
  24. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    Not having Browning and having Bonaly doesn't give the list credit.
  25. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    That is basically the same thing I said. The 98 Olympics are really the only Olympics he was expected to medal in. As for Candelero, I agree, but what about young Yagudin who skated the best performances of the year at Cup of Russia. As it turns out even with Yagudin opening the door for him with a poor free skating performance, he still probably couldnt have medaled, since Candelero did so well in the long program, even beating Stojko in the long. If we presume a clean Todd wasnt capable of beating Stojko in the long program, it means he wouldnt have been able to beat Candelero either, and with the short program placings would not have medaled.

    I still agree with him being on the short list of best skaters to not medal due to all his World medals, but as it is, it would have been hard for him to ever medal nonetheless.
  26. RFOS

    RFOS Well-Known Member

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    I don't think one can presume that at all, considering even with his very subpar performance Todd took 3 ordinals from Stojko in the free skate (as well as 2 from Candeloro).

    http://winter-olympic-memories.com/html/results/jp_3d/18_nagano/18_figure/18_figure_m_ex.htm
  27. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    My Top Eight (not in order of preference):

    Denkova & Staviski
    Delobel & Schoenfelder
    Babilonia & Gardner
    Biellmann
    Butyrskaya
    Harding
    Browning
    Joubert

    Plenty of others who could be in the Top Ten: Fadeev, Eldredge, Sato, Ando, Zayak, etc.
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2012
  28. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    In terms of pure skating talent I definitely agree, but I dont think an accurate list is based mostly on talent and (unfullfilled) potential. In terms of her overall career and how much a factor she was, she wouldnt be close to top 10 with all disciplines considered. She was only a medal contender at one Olympics and only the 3rd favorite going into that one.
  29. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    I agree with Chin and Harding. I'd add Blumberg/Seibert, Kurt Browning, Alexander Abt, Pestova/Leonovich, Delobel/Schoenfelder, Rakhamo/Kokko, John Misha Petkevich, Gary Beacom, Toller Cranston.
  30. Conga

    Conga New Member

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    Kurt Browning definitely, Butyrskaya, Babilonia/Gardner, Rakkamo/Koko (terribly underrated IMO)
  31. TwizzlerS

    TwizzlerS Well-Known Member

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    If you take out Meno & Sand and Jill Trenary, the list is like a collection of great (mostly American) skaters who didn't fit the mold or had some sort of scrappy, off-beat story. In that case, I think this is an interesting list.
  32. pat c

    pat c Well-Known Member

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    Underhill/Martini, Yuka Sato, Annenko/Sretenski, Drobiazko/Vanagas...........
  33. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I

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    Oops, just got a PM that Cranston won a bronze medal, so he has to be scrapped from my list :eek:
  34. Bronxfan

    Bronxfan Active Member

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    Denise Biellman - I still think she should have won it all in Lake Placid - I know she had terrible school figures, but her skating in the short and long was amazing.
  35. Vash01

    Vash01 Well-Known Member

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    Urbanski & Marvel on this list? Beyond ridiculous.

    31 is not that old for a pairs skater. Did U&M ever get within a mile of an Olympic medal?

    Do these two ladies know much about figure skating? No Browning, Eldredge on this list just tells me that they know nothing.

    Even Jill Trenary does not belong on this list. Her only chance at an Olympic medal was in 1988, and she was lucky to finish in 4th (or was it 5th?) place.
  36. bardtoob

    bardtoob Well-Known Member

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    I feel like I know less about skating after reading that Pinhead, oh, I mean Hairpin article.
  37. BreakfastClub

    BreakfastClub Active Member

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    For the most part, especially in 1998.

    He was the two-time reigning world bronze medalist ('90, '91) going into 1992, though he was injured in '92 and controversially named to the US team he surely was considered to have a shot at the podium.

    He had a streak of nothing but world silver ('95, '97) and gold ('96) going into 1998 where someone else already mentioned that it was pretty much presumed that Stojko, Kulik and Eldredge would be the podium in some order. The only guy to invade the world podium from those three from 95-97 was Galindo's bronze in 96 and that's only because Stojko had the wipeout of his career in the SP.

    In 2002 he was again the reigning world bronze medalist, though expectations weren't huge, he was definitely considered a threat for bronze with a half dozen other guys (while Yags and Plush were pretty much assumed to go 1-2 in either order.)

    While the Browning omission completely discredits the list, I'm fine with Bonaly off of it. Tumbling on ice with flat edges and no stretch, lines or musical interpretation. Her lack of an O medal is one of the things they've got right it in the history of the sport. :shuffle:
  38. Vash01

    Vash01 Well-Known Member

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    That girl was Kyoko Ina, and yes they were much closer to an Olympic podium than Urbanski-Marvel ever were. However, I don't think they had a realistic chance to beat B&S/S&P/S&Z for an Olympic medal in 2002 (the only Olympics they skated in), unless one of the top 3 pairs bombed. Actually Ina & Dungjen (4th place in 98) were closer to the podium than Ina-Zimmerman (5th place in 2002, I think)
  39. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Ina & Dungen probably would have medaled at the 98 Games if they had their 98 Nationals LP. With Elena & Anton having 2 huge errors, Woetzel & Steur injured and very subpar, and the controversy (justified or not) about their short program placing, if they duplicated their U.S Nationals performance I am pretty sure the judges would have had to give them a medal. That was the skate of their life though so it would have been hard to repeat under the Olympic pressure, and as it turns out they werent even close. With mistakes they had no chance as their unision, speed, and artistry did not stack up to the other top teams, nor their reputation. They probably would have won silver at the very weak 98 post Olympic Worlds but had to pull out with injury.

    Ina & Zimmerman had no chance to medal in 2002 IMO. I enjoyed their programs that year and it was great to see them finally hit their peak as a pair. However even a very subpar Shen & Zhou in the LP easily beat them (all 9 judges had them ahead), and even a subpar and pre prime Totmianina & Marinin edged them. They just hadnt done enough that quad to build any momentum with the judges, Ina & Dungen atleast had been close to medaling at the 97 Worlds and were much more athletic than Ina & Zimmerman.
  40. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    Thanks - I figured he was a contender for part of his career, but there's a difference between being a contender in some years and "always expected to medal".

    I'd have Browning at #1 by a mile, and I'd include Butyrskaya, Denkova/Staviski, Delobel/Schoenfelder (would they have medalled had she not gotten pregnant?), Joubert and probably Yuka Sato.