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BittyBug
09-12-2012, 11:09 PM
IIRC, Johnny Weir was wearing a "Russia" jacket to his competitions, while representing the U.S. Some people got offended, but it's what he wanted to wear. There may have been talk about it not being patriotic, but was anyone really confused and thought he was pretending to be a member of the Russian team? Or offended because he didn't put in the work to be a member of the Russian team?What Johnny wore in Torino was a jacket with CCCP on it ("USSR" in Cyrillic), which was a fashion jacket. The jackets were fairly popular at the time and widely available in ordinary department stores and fashion boutiques; it was not a Team Russia jacket.

(Johnny does have a bunch of Bosco Sport Team Russia stuff, but after the flak he took for the Torino incident I don't think he ever wore anything at a competition other than his Team USA gear.)

Otterpop
09-12-2012, 11:51 PM
Absolutely not. These kids have worked their backsides off for years to EARN these coveted jackets. Regardless of what some countries do it would be morally wrong. Give these athletes a pat on the back not a slap in the face.

misskarne
09-13-2012, 12:13 AM
Team Australia have to buy their own jackets anyway as well as earn them :eek:

Why does that not surprise me?


Anyway, I look at the pics of Josh and Jason in their USFSA jackets and I think about how hard they've worked to earn the right to wear them. I haven't worked anywhere near as hard. It would seem wrong to be able to just buy one.

kATYDID411
09-13-2012, 02:44 AM
I honestly didn't mean this to become so contentious of a debate. I only want a jacket to show SUPPORT for USFSA, which they clearly need based on tv viewship (and I like the jackets since 2008-present). I would never want to take anything away from Team USA members. When USFSA said they wouldn't sell them for the reason you're all using, I disagreed with it, but understood. But, if letting me buy a jacket would take something away from skaters, then SURELY, letting high-rollers buy them just because they have the most money, downgrades it worse, IMO.

PDilemma
09-13-2012, 02:49 AM
I honestly didn't mean this to become so contentious of a debate. I only want a jacket to show SUPPORT for USFSA, which they clearly need based on tv viewship (and I like the jackets since 2008-present). I would never want to take anything away from Team USA members. When USFSA said they wouldn't sell them for the reason you're all using, I disagreed with it, but understood. But, if letting me buy a jacket would take something away from skaters, then SURELY, letting high-rollers buy them just because they have the most money, downgrades it worse, IMO.

I didn't think it needed to be contentious, either, Katydid.

If my $50 or $90 or however much they could be sold for would dishonor the meaning of the jacket, then someone else's $10,000 does as well. If the reason for not marketing them is because they are to be earned by team members, giving them to the wealthy donors is hypocritical.

milanessa
09-13-2012, 04:55 AM
I
If my $50 or $90 or however much they could be sold for would dishonor the meaning of the jacket, then someone else's $10,000 does as well. If the reason for not marketing them is because they are to be earned by team members, giving them to the wealthy donors is hypocritical.

I agree.

overedge
09-13-2012, 05:36 AM
Personally, I wouldn't buy one (if only because I'm not American). However, I can think of plenty of pushy skating parents who would, because it would make their kid look more accomplished than their kid actually was.

hanca
09-13-2012, 07:49 AM
Personally, I wouldn't buy one (if only because I'm not American). However, I can think of plenty of pushy skating parents who would, because it would make their kid look more accomplished than their kid actually was.

But do we care if their children look more accomplished than they actually are? If the money go towards supporting skating in that country...

Hanna
09-13-2012, 08:12 AM
A team jacket from any nation is something that comes with years of hard work, not a credit card.

I disagree. You can buy Russian team jacket in a shop (at Bosco)
http://boscosport.ru/ru/#/en/238/archive/russian/category59

Also in Finland the figure skaters' team jacket is in stores for anyone to buy.

leafygreens
09-13-2012, 02:54 PM
But do we care if their children look more accomplished than they actually are? If the money go towards supporting skating in that country...

Why do you assume that buying a team jacket is to "make their children look more accomplished than they are"? Maybe they simply want a high quality, federation skating jacket that says figure skating on it. I would buy one for the same reason. I like wearing my club jacket everywhere to show that I'm a figure skater, but the logo doesn't really prominently say anything about "figure skating" and the shape is kind of frumpy and loose.

I doubt anyone involved with skating would think I'm presenting myself as a World Team member if I wanted to show support of skating with a jacket, and people at public sessions assume I'm going to the Olympics anyway, simply for having white skates. The jacket has nothing to do with it.

Anyways, the cat's already out of the bag. If wealthy donors are allowed to buy them, then everyone should. If it were that important, the donors would not be allowed to have them. It would only be worth getting upset over if the donors were allowed to have Gold Medalist jackets. It's obvious that wearing something that says "team" on it is support for the team, but a non-medalist would have no reason to wear a medalist jacket.

gkelly
09-13-2012, 03:32 PM
I really don't care one way or another.

However, if they think that a team jacket is an exclusive enough incentive to entice donors to contribute thousands of dollars, then making them readily available to anyone for maybe a hundred dollars would take away that incentive for large contributions.

overedge
09-13-2012, 04:43 PM
Why do you assume that buying a team jacket is to "make their children look more accomplished than they are"?

Because the parents who are always on about how their kid is going to go to the Olympics or World IME are generally the parents whose kid has very little chance of doing either.

hanca
09-13-2012, 04:47 PM
Why do you assume that buying a team jacket is to "make their children look more accomplished than they are"?

I wrote it because someone said exactly that a few posts before my post. Personally I don't really care, so I would not even think that way. I wouldn't think that this child is more accomplished than others because it has the jacket.

Saying that, I don't think that having a feeling of deserving the jacket doesn't outweigh the fact that if it was for sale, there would be more money to spend on the figure skating in that country. As I see it, would you prefer a small group of skaters on national team having the feeling that they earned their jacket, or would allowing the jacket to be for sale to public earn enough money that would help this selected group of individuals on national team? What is more beneficial? Having a good feeling that you earned something, or having more money for your training? After all, the great feeling that they earned it is not just tied to the jacket; they have earned the status of 'member of national team'.

Garden Kitty
09-13-2012, 04:58 PM
At least recently, the team jacket has been a nice reward for the skaters who've worked and been invited to an international competition. Whether or not I think it should be seen as something that is a recognition of accomplishment, it appears that's how a lot of skaters think about them.

I also think it's fine and certainly not wrong to want to show support for the team. The shop on the federation site has a lot of merchandise, including some jackets, that you can purchase. Many of the pieces are either purchased by or given to the skaters, so a lot of it is the same merchandise they use. If someone wants to support the team, there are a lot of ways to do it.

If the jackets are viewed as a "reward", I'd prefer to not see them given to large donors either and I doubt most people who are donating $10,000 are doing it for a jacket. But that is a lot of money that goes to help skaters, so I think it's reasonable to have some nice recognition to show that their contribution is appreciated.

I don't think any of this is "right" or "wrong", but I do think it's nice to find relatively inexpensive ways to let both the skaters and the people who donate to support the skaters know that they're appreciated and their contributions are recognized, while also finding ways to encourage fans to show their support however they are able.

Skatingfan924
09-14-2012, 06:44 PM
I support USFSA and was surprised to see in the benefits for this year the team jacket. I, like the original poster, wrote the association suggesting that they make the jackets available or something similar. I don't think the identical jacket going to fans would be fair. I did suggest that they could sell them without the team USA on it. I was just shocked to see if you have $10000 to give away, you can get one. Money does all things in the USA.