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love_skate2011
08-24-2012, 10:46 PM
Did you know, this will only be Artur's third international Senior season? I think he's done quite well so far and with time will only get better...if people will give him a chance. There are a lot of excuses and defenses made of other skaters who are just as if not more head-casey than Artur. I don't see him being given the same liberty on here.

He's not perfect. Nobody is. He's not Plushenko either. I wish people would just give him a chance.

With the exception of Worlds last year, Artur has never finished outside of the top 10 at any of his Senior events. Since his first two GPs, and excluding Worlds again, he has never finished outside the top 5.

3rd chance is more than enough :shuffle:, then why is Yuzuru now on his way to a superstar, while Gachinski is stuck as a headcase ? they competed both at junior worlds and are now crossing different paths, with Yuzuru expected to become the biggest threat for Gold by Sochi 2014, the other might not even go to Sochi....

and you forgot Gachinski was a disaster at 2012 Worlds.

caseyedwards
08-24-2012, 11:49 PM
3rd chance is more than enough :shuffle:, then why is Yuzuru now on his way to a superstar, while Gachinski is stuck as a headcase ? they competed both at junior worlds and are now crossing different paths, with Yuzuru expected to become the biggest threat for Gold by Sochi 2014, the other might not even go to Sochi....

and you forgot Gachinski was a disaster at 2012 Worlds.

They did not forget. They oppose the view that Gachinski will be disaster for the rest of his life in every competition! Hanyu's is considered a good bronze unlike Gachinski's fluke bronze and Hanyu is better than Gachinski in many many areas. One area is recovery from falls. Gachinski falls and his performance suffers and he skates like a zombie. Hanyu falls and has no effect. It's totally isolated.

Vash01
08-25-2012, 12:09 AM
They did not forget. They oppse the view that Gachinski will be disaster for the rest of his life in every competition!.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Cherub721
08-25-2012, 12:53 AM
Maybe that's the idea [not to compete against the top Asian/NA skaters].

Agreed, but I don't think it's wise. He can lull himself into a false sense of security again. Going into Vancouver, Lysacek and Weir were not doing quads, Takahashi and Chan were inconsistent, and he had beaten Lambiel and Joubert. He felt confident in his programs enough to omit his second quad and cocky enough to make dumb comments about his own lack of transitions. Maybe if he'd had a rude awakening by losing GPF, he would've adjusted and won in Vancouver. If I were him I'd be skipping Russian Nationals and Euros since we all know he can win them. I wish he could somehow do GPF in Sochi without doing two GP events. :lol: That would be a perfect opportunity to test his home ice advantage bonus. ;)

But what can you do, he has injuries/readiness issues and unfortunately the timing of the GP doesn't work out for him.


At this point it has been 7 years since his last worlds experience and if he doesn't go to London that is 10 years since since he completed a worlds. He was at worlds in 2005 but didn't finish for injuries but I think I read about resentment of big names dropping in on big events. You could say he hasn't paid his dues in 10 years in Sochi by not going to a worlds. Is worlds really "paying dues" maybe or maybe not. So he went to the Olympics in 2006 and 2010 but no worlds since 2005 and not a finish since 2004! If it doesn't matter it doesn't matter but I know I read about elite athlete "drop ins" and seeking the big titles.

I think it's funny that he has 3 Olympic medals and "only" 3 World titles. With that kind of longevity, and a senior World career ranging from 1998-2011, you'd think he would have a lot more! I wish he had done Worlds in Torino, then he would have won all the major titles in that arena.


3rd chance is more than enough :shuffle:, then why is Yuzuru now on his way to a superstar, while Gachinski is stuck as a headcase ? they competed both at junior worlds and are now crossing different paths, with Yuzuru expected to become the biggest threat for Gold by Sochi 2014, the other might not even go to Sochi....

and you forgot Gachinski was a disaster at 2012 Worlds.

So Hanyu won a bronze in his Worlds debut. That's great. So did Gachinsky. We'll see what happens next year. Kozuka was everyone's darling in 2011, but bombed in 2012 as well. No one is a lock for the podium except Chan.

Susan M
08-25-2012, 02:16 AM
Yuna will probably go to qualifying too as she plans to only compete in Worlds ?
I believe she is planning to compete in a Senior B event this season to post a qualifying score needed for 2013 Worlds. If she does skate at Worlds, I can't imagine her skating badly enough not to earn a spot for Korea in the Olympic field.


If he has a Top 24 SB from Euros like this year, he will be guaranteed a spot in the initial selection, but if he really doesn't want to skate, the Russian Fed can withhold his name,

I think you are looking at it backward. I don't think Plushenko is worried about getting GP assignments, but about avoiding them. From the ISU archives, it looks 2003-4 was the last time he did two GP events and the final. Since then it was only Cup of Russia or none at all.

If he is top 6 at Worlds, then he is required to accept assignment to two GP events or be banned from skating anywhere else during the whole fall season. If he accepts the assignments then he must produce a doctor's certificate to withdraw from an event (hence my snarky remark about the conveniently timed injury). This is found in Rule 3.4 of the GP announcement.

caseyedwards
08-25-2012, 02:33 AM
Agreed, but I don't think it's wise. He can lull himself into a false sense of security again. Going into Vancouver, Lysacek and Weir were not doing quads, Takahashi and Chan were inconsistent, and he had beaten Lambiel and Joubert. He felt confident in his programs enough to omit his second quad and cocky enough to make dumb comments about his own lack of transitions. Maybe if he'd had a rude awakening by losing GPF, he would've adjusted and won in Vancouver. If I were him I'd be skipping Russian Nationals and Euros since we all know he can win them. I wish he could somehow do GPF in Sochi without doing two GP events. :lol: That would be a perfect opportunity to test his home ice advantage bonus. ;)

But what can you do, he has injuries/readiness issues and unfortunately the timing of the GP doesn't work out for him.



I think it's funny that he has 3 Olympic medals and "only" 3 World titles. With that kind of longevity, and a senior World career ranging from 1998-2011, you'd think he would have a lot more! I wish he had done Worlds in Torino, then he would have won all the major titles in that arena.



So Hanyu won a bronze in his Worlds debut. That's great. So did Gachinsky. We'll see what happens next year. Kozuka was everyone's darling in 2011, but bombed in 2012 as well. No one is a lock for the podium except Chan.

He should face the top competitors and see what the judges do! That is something vital he didn't do in 2009-2010! He just managed to avoid all the top competition from North American and Japan. He definitely shouldn't avoid the world champion.

From 2006 to the present that was a lot of worlds Plushenko missed. He was retired a lot of that time but world titles were up for grabs! He even said so after 2007 worlds. After that worlds Joubert won he was like "I want to return!" Then you had the 2010 worlds controversy and nothing in 2011 because of a lot things and 2012 surgery. 2013 should be obvious!


If he is top 6 at Worlds, then he is required to accept assignment to two GP events or be banned from skating anywhere else during the whole fall season.

That could be a problem!! Maybe he can do short programs and leave before the LP! LOL. How about going all out in the SP and being "surprisingly" conservative in LPs? Just annoucing "I'm here because of rules and wont do quads and will don't care where I place at all!"

peibeck
08-25-2012, 02:50 AM
That could be a problem!! Maybe he can do short programs and leave before the LP! LOL. How about going all out in the SP and being "surprisingly" conservative in LPs? Just annoucing "I'm here because of rules and wont do quads and will don't care where I place at all!"

Plushenko not caring where he places??? :drama:

Cherub721
08-25-2012, 04:13 AM
Plushenko not caring where he places??? :drama:

I actually kind of believe this considering he didn't do a quad in the euros SP. He totally could've been 7th or 8th if everyone hit, and he alluded to that in the post-SP interviews, basically thanking the other guys for letting him get 2nd. :lol:

But when he skates his best, he definitely expects to win. ;)

kwanfan1818
08-25-2012, 06:10 AM
If he is top 6 at Worlds, then he is required to accept assignment to two GP events or be banned from skating anywhere else during the whole fall season. If he accepts the assignments then he must produce a doctor's certificate to withdraw from an event (hence my snarky remark about the conveniently timed injury). This is found in Rule 3.4 of the GP announcement.
I tend to doubt he'd worry about this in pre-Olympic year. There are several Senior B's in December and January, if he just wants to get the rust out before Euros and the Olympics.

yaya124
08-25-2012, 07:16 AM
At this point it has been 7 years since his last worlds experience and if he doesn't go to London that is 10 years since since he completed a worlds. He was at worlds in 2005 but didn't finish for injuries but I think I read about resentment of big names dropping in on big events. You could say he hasn't paid his dues in 10 years in Sochi by not going to a worlds. Is worlds really "paying dues" maybe or maybe not. So he went to the Olympics in 2006 and 2010 but no worlds since 2005 and not a finish since 2004! If it doesn't matter it doesn't matter but I know I read about elite athlete "drop ins" and seeking the big titles.

I do not see the problem here since 2005 he was really badly injured, he did some big surgeries after withdrawn from 2005 Worlds. He won the 2006 Olympics and took a break. Without this break, I do not think he can maintain his health as he does now to be able to take a shot at 2014 Olympics.

His only "sin" for not attending worlds probably was in 2010 where his injury prevented him to perform Quads consistently. I think it was understandable that after 2010 Olympics, he had to have quads to compete and he was not interested in competing without quads and not medal in the end.

He was banned so he could not attend Worlds 2011, and he was injured and needed surgery in 2012.

As for 2013 worlds, he did not say that he will not go, so just wait and see. If Artur did poorly again, Plushenko will have no choice but to compete at Worlds 2013, isn't it.

He has a long career and a successful one, but he is only a human. And he won every title he could win, many not once, so he earns the right to choose the battle.

love_skate2011
08-25-2012, 07:36 AM
As for 2013 worlds, he did not say that he will not go, so just wait and see. If Artur did poorly again, Plushenko will have no choice but to compete at Worlds 2013, isn't it.

He has a long career and a successful one, but he is only a human. And he won every title he could win, many not once, so he earns the right to choose the battle.

wise words indeed for the God. :cool:

caseyedwards
08-25-2012, 04:05 PM
I do not see the problem here since 2005 he was really badly injured, he did some big surgeries after withdrawn from 2005 Worlds. He won the 2006 Olympics and took a break. Without this break, I do not think he can maintain his health as he does now to be able to take a shot at 2014 Olympics.

His only "sin" for not attending worlds probably was in 2010 where his injury prevented him to perform Quads consistently. I think it was understandable that after 2010 Olympics, he had to have quads to compete and he was not interested in competing without quads and not medal in the end.

He was banned so he could not attend Worlds 2011, and he was injured and needed surgery in 2012.

As for 2013 worlds, he did not say that he will not go, so just wait and see. If Artur did poorly again, Plushenko will have no choice but to compete at Worlds 2013, isn't it.

He has a long career and a successful one, but he is only a human. And he won every title he could win, many not once, so he earns the right to choose the battle.

Basically everything posted here is correct. The gap in worlds performances was something that is interesting. And he did not say he was not going- he didn't even mention worlds at all- in this particular piece.

Glacier cat
08-25-2012, 08:48 PM
I actually think Gachinski wuzrobbed at Euros. I mean, Plushenko's LP was epic and hard to beat, but Gachinski's lead after the SP should have been bigger.

So you think that Gachinski should earn 99.86 points in the short? :slinkaway

Probably the judges looked at his lacking speed and ice coverage. He obviously needed to improve skating skills. Though I don't even know how much he grew up since then. I talk about EC last season.

misskarne
08-25-2012, 10:22 PM
So you think that Gachinski should earn 99.86 points in the short? :slinkaway


:confused:

That's a ridiculous statement. We're a long way from anyone earning that many points for a short - genuinely earning it anyway. Of course Artur shouldn't have got that score. But to lead by only a couple of tenths of a point was a bit narrow.

Glacier cat
08-26-2012, 05:19 AM
:confused:

That's a ridiculous statement. We're a long way from anyone earning that many points for a short - genuinely earning it anyway. Of course Artur shouldn't have got that score. But to lead by only a couple of tenths of a point was a bit narrow.

But you said "I actually think Gachinski wuzrobbed at Euros" but "Plushenko's LP was epic and hard to beat"

When I read it I thought you believe Gachinski should have earn at least 99.86 in the short program. Am I wrong?? Sorry my English is not very good, I just thought you think so :rolleyes:


---
Now I see, you think that Plushy's correct points in the short was 76.12 or less as Brezina says. Right? It is ridiculous. 3rd to 6th young guys, nobodoy couldn't perform cleanly and except Tomas Verner lost Plushy in TES.