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View Full Version : U.S. Ladies [#5]: All That Glitters Is Not Gold



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ambern024
11-03-2012, 06:29 PM
I really wish Mirai could get with Rafael Arutunian. I think he woud be a great technical coach for her! He's there in California, but since she left Frank because of the driving distance I doubt she would want to drive to Lake Arrowhead. She's 19 years old though. If she wants to be a world champion she needs to do whatever it takes to have a coach as good as Frank or Frank himself. If you don't like the drive...you're 19 pack yourself up and move there. If you can't afford it then find a friend at the rink to stay with. I really think Mirai is a total package. I just wish she could get some consistancy to her and a coach that is going to be good for her technically.

jlai
11-03-2012, 06:48 PM
If US ladies continue the way they are I think things can go very well for US ladies at the end of the season. Finally there's a leader and someone who is skating well in the leader's shadow. Plus for once, both the Russians and Japanese ladies team are showing signs of vulnerability. These could add up to success at worlds -- but of course so many things can change from now till March...

I hope Wagner will stay healthy and strong for the season!

chipso1
11-03-2012, 07:37 PM
After Cup of China. Nagasu improves ever so slightly on her total score from Finlandia Trophy. Also, for those that missed the announcement, Rachael Flatt is out for the rest of the season.

2012-13 U.S. Ladies -- Top International Scores

1. Ashley WAGNER (188.37), Skate America
2. Christina GAO (174.25), Skate America
3. Agnes ZAWADZKI (172.95), U.S. Classic
4. Gracie GOLD (171.15), U.S. Classic
5. Mirai NAGASU (163.46), Cup of China
6. Angela WANG (162.65), JGP Zagreb

7. Hannah MILLER (158.52), JGP Linz
8. Samantha CESARIO (157.72), JGP Linz
9. Leah KEISER (156.33), JGP Istanbul
10. Courtney HICKS (153.77), JGP Lake Placid
11. Caroline ZHANG (149.87), Skate Canada
12. Barbie LONG (147.19), JGP Bled

13. Kiri BAGA (142.22), JGP Lake Placid
14. Vanessa LAM (140.89), JGP Courchevel
15. Ashley CAIN (136.51), JGP Courchevel
16. Rachael FLATT (136.09), Skate America out for rest of season
17. Nina JIANG (115.48), JGP Istanbul

Japan Open (free skate only) scores: Ashley WAGNER (123.57); Agnes ZAWADZKI (89.95)

Upcoming assignments:

Rostelecom Cup (Gracie GOLD, Agnes ZAWADZKI, Caroline ZHANG)
Trophee Eric Bompard (Christina GAO, Ashley WAGNER)
NHK Trophy (Alissa CZISNY, Agnes ZAWADZKI)
JGP Final (Leah KEISER, Hannah MILLER, Angela WANG)

mrinalini
11-03-2012, 07:46 PM
Yes, Mirai needs to get to a jump specialist. She still has that weird hooking thing on the landings of her jumps that plagued her years ago. Her jumps travel well and the height she gets on them seems okay - I'm still not sure why she's underrotating the landings. Otherwise, her LP is fairly decent - the music is pleasant enough, and I don't suppose we should expect her to be as exuberant as she was in the SP as that would be a bit repetitive.

It's hard to feel excited about the podium at CoC - between the blandness of Korpi, the sheer flatness of Lipnitskaia (who is borderline frightful on some of her jumps and who, I swear, stuck her leg up whenever she had the opportunity), and a Mao whose technical capabilities have fallen far from where they were only two years ago, there wasn't much to delight in.

I will say this, though - Zijun Li needs to get to a coaching team that can polish her up nicely; she is so pretty that she could be such a star in her native country.

edonice
11-03-2012, 07:49 PM
I'm pretty psyched about US Ladies skating right now. All it took was one determined skater - Ashley Wagner - and now the other top skaters are rising to the challenge.

Mirai got dinged on underrotations at Cup of China, but I haven't seen her skate as determined as she did in a long time, particularly in the short program.

Christina Gao is finally getting used to her long limbs, and looks so much more calm on the ice.

And hopefully, having such strong skaters at the top already will take some of the pressure off of Gracie. She's so new to the Senior level, she shouldn't feel discouraged if it's ever overwhelming.

Then again, maybe it's just that these skaters are getting older and more mature. They've been trading places on the Senior podium for so long that it's hard to remember that most of them are still under twenty.

aftershocks
11-03-2012, 08:08 PM
^^ Yes, definitely. I had forgotten that Mirai is only 19, she's been under such a spotlight for six years. Winning U.S. Nats at age 15 seems to have been more of a burden than a boon.

I wish her well, and its too bad she doesn't have another GP, but she should use her time effectively to prepare for Nationals.

pinky166
11-03-2012, 09:02 PM
The 3t on the end of the 2ax was an obvious 1/2 turn underrotation even in real time. Most of her jumps were a bit grind-y and on the slow-mo replay were 1/4 turn cheats. The loops, however, both looked clean to me- they didn't slow-mo the 2nd on the video I watched but it didn't seem in real time to have anything wrong that I could see. If you watch Christina Gao's FS from Skate America to compare, Christina's jumps appear much more effortless and clean.

I wonder if Mirai's issues with URs are somewhat due to the body type she has now. And I don't mean this is a bashing way, to me at CoC she actually looked quite fit, she's just noticeably a sturdier build than most of the other female skaters competitive at this level. Triple jumps, especially ones like lutzes, flips, loops, are hard for women to do period. Mirai is strong and she gets good height on her jumps, but for some reason she just doesn't rotate fast enough in the air to get all the way around before landing. URs have always been an issue for her, and when she was younger I thought it was maybe due to her lacking power being so petite and skinny, then when she grew it got worse, until the time of the Olympics when she managed to clean up her jumps and get them around and not surprisingly, she did very well. But her body has definitely changed since the Olympics, she is by no means fat, and like I said I thought she appeared to be in good shape and quite muscular/toned, I think she just finally reached her adult body type which is probably around 10 pounds heavier than she was at the Olympics. I don't know if losing weight would help with the jumps, I don't think she needs to lose weight anyways, and I think now, even if she isn't quite at her fighting shape, that her new fighting shape would still be bigger than in 2010 just because she's a young woman now and not a 16 year old. But yeah, this is just what I wonder. Her technique seems solid and getting enough height is not the issue with her jumps, so that leaves rotational speed, and obviously it's easier to rotate faster when you are lighter, the key is to just not loose weight to the point where the quickness in rotation gained is not longer helpful due to the power lost.

olympic
11-03-2012, 10:26 PM
I just want to say that Mirai's scores belie what she put out on the ice. She went for all of her planned elements including a 3-3 in the SP and managed them w/o falls or step-outs. She looks fitter than ever and yes, there were UR's and downgrades, but I honestly haven't seen her skate w/ such attack since '11 4CC's. I also think her jumps will tighten a little more as the season progresses.

Next week will be interesting - will Gracie focus better? Will Agnes get over the LP curse? Will Caroline finally move her scores up this season to the ranks of the top US ladies

Ziggy
11-03-2012, 10:41 PM
I wish she had left Tom Z after her senior debut. I liked her at 14/15 but then she just seemed to hit a glass ceiling. The potential went unrealized.

But that's because of getting taught "quick fix" jumping technique which is not sustainable once you get your adult body.

Alex Forrest
11-03-2012, 11:01 PM
^^ Yes, definitely. I had forgotten that Mirai is only 19, she's been under such a spotlight for six years. Winning U.S. Nats at age 15 seems to have been more of a burden than a boon.

I'm pretty sure Nagasu won the Senior National title at 14 y/o. She was maybe two months older than Tara when Tara won her US title.

smarts1
11-03-2012, 11:24 PM
Yes, Mirai needs to get to a jump specialist. She still has that weird hooking thing on the landings of her jumps that plagued her years ago. Her jumps travel well and the height she gets on them seems okay - I'm still not sure why she's underrotating the landings. Otherwise, her LP is fairly decent - the music is pleasant enough, and I don't suppose we should expect her to be as exuberant as she was in the SP as that would be a bit repetitive.

It's hard to feel excited about the podium at CoC - between the blandness of Korpi, the sheer flatness of Lipnitskaia (who is borderline frightful on some of her jumps and who, I swear, stuck her leg up whenever she had the opportunity), and a Mao whose technical capabilities have fallen far from where they were only two years ago, there wasn't much to delight in.

I will say this, though - Zijun Li needs to get to a coaching team that can polish her up nicely; she is so pretty that she could be such a star in her native country.

Frank got rid of Mirai's hook landings, but now that she's not with him, they're back (although they're not as bad as they were under Charlene). I think it's really her rotation position and the way she goes up into the jump. She delays the rotation too much and on top of that she doesn't get into a fully tight back spin position, causing her to underrotate he jumps. The reason why her jumps were fully rotated back in 2009-2010 (even though her jumps were smaller then) was because they weren't delayed as much and she acheive a tight backspin position.

As for Mao, I wonder if losing all that weight when her mother was sick had an impact on her power. Her jumps are not as high or big as they used to be and Mao hasn't really gained much of that weight back.

aftershocks
11-04-2012, 01:59 AM
I'm pretty sure Nagasu won the Senior National title at 14 y/o. She was maybe two months older than Tara when Tara won her US title.

Yes, you're right. Mirai was a few months away from turning 15 when she won her first Nationals title in 2008. Her birthday is in April.

Mirai4life
11-04-2012, 05:16 AM
I'm really disgusted that Kiira girl won over Mirai, let alone Ying Zhang......... got a higher technical mark than Mirai -_____________-
Yuck. Robbery. Disgusting. Rude technical callers n judges. Her second loop is NOT >> :shuffle:

Vagabond
11-04-2012, 05:24 AM
Perhaps when Mirai Nagasu does her flips from an inside edge and lands five fully rotated triples in one program the way Korpi did, she will the get higher marks. :saint:

Marco
11-04-2012, 10:22 AM
Well, true to her Japanese heritage, Nagasu (and Murakami and even Asada) has caught the Nakano syndrome, performing visibly clean performances only to be disappointed in the K&C when most jumps got UR-ed/downgraded.

I think Nagasu has gotten too broad to rotate quickly enough. It's always going to be at the mercy of the caller for her from now on. Some of the jumps at COC I think were border-line. With that kind of treatment internationally, the caller at Nationals will be hard pressed not to be strict on her too. Such a shame.