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sap5
08-26-2012, 03:26 AM
I went to the CNE today. Saw T&S's programs. They appeared very relaxed. The show was not as crisp as stars on ice was - I guess two shows a day takes its toll on them. And most other performers werent up to snuff. Trampoline performers were also good.

Was supposed to meet Misha there but didnt see her. I kept a seat for her and then gave it up to someone else.

Tried some gross food and finally enjoyed a lobster roll from the gourmet food trucks.

Its 20 years since I have last been and I think its my last CNE. The place doesnt improve with age.

The best of all was the cat show - the kitties were adorable.

Aw -- after this post, I thought you were really going to enjoy trying the food there!


No but maybe the fried coca cola, red velvet pancakes with pulled pork or bacon fudge!

martyross
08-26-2012, 03:29 AM
i would love to see the kitties (:

pani
08-26-2012, 08:39 AM
I went to the CNE today. Saw T&S's programs. They appeared very relaxed. The show was not as crisp as stars on ice was - I guess two shows a day takes its toll on them. And most other performers werent up to snuff. Trampoline performers were also good.

Was supposed to meet Misha there but didnt see her. I kept a seat for her and then gave it up to someone else.

Tried some gross food and finally enjoyed a lobster roll from the gourmet food trucks.

Its 20 years since I have last been and I think its my last CNE. The place doesnt improve with age.

The best of all was the cat show - the kitties were adorable.

Thanks for report! I love kitties :D
Still cant understand, why V-M need to do CNE. Cant say they enjoy to do this 2 show per day.

pani
08-26-2012, 08:41 AM
It seemed strange to me at first pani, but on thinking about it:

1. Margaglio is a tech specialist. He has had to be trained on the latest version of the SD rules, which are pretty scary. Basically, to get the level for a key point, you both have to do the step as described, and now you have to have the timing as well. If you watched Monko & Khaliavin back in juniors, they used to get level 4 on the pattern dance while never being on the correct beat. That isn't happening now.

If you look at the SD protocols from JGP Courchevel, you see something like this:
http://www.isuresults.com/results/jgpfra2012/jgpfra2012_JuniorIceDance_SD_Scores.pdf1Bl3
These are Papadakis's & Cizeron's grades.
2BL3+kpNYY
1BL1+kpTTT

Notice they lost all 3 of 4 levels for the first blues sequence for T=timing. That's a huge penalty. Last year, even for a severe timing problem, teams lost maybe one point.

This costs 3 points.

It is a good idea to have a tech specialist in camp, I think

Will see, how they will help, because last season Shpilband-Zoueva teams had big problems with pattern dance levels and even at WCh didnt get levels 4, like W-P.
But i think Klimova better specialists, if we are talking about CDs.

pani
08-26-2012, 08:43 AM
Well, you know pani can never miss an opportunity to remind us all that D/W are evil incarnate. ;)

Pani doesn't read and doesn't write in D-W thread, like crazy D-W ubers made in V-M thread :lol:

IoanaC
08-26-2012, 10:45 AM
I'm not either.

I suppose the idea is to lower Tessa & Scott's & Meryl & Charlie's SD marks.


This is crazy - and frustrating for the skaters, as Marty said. The sport is slowly becoming robotic. If they want to lower their marks overall, why not change something in the way they score the PCS? It's PCS where the two Canton teams have the big advantage over the others anyway.

pani
08-26-2012, 10:59 AM
This is crazy - and frustrating for the skaters, as Marty said. The sport is slowly becoming robotic. If they want to lower their marks overall, why not change something in the way they score the PCS? It's PCS where the two Canton teams have the big advantage over the others anyway.

I dont think this change was made for to lower someone SD score. Just for mage get level 4 more difficult. And in CDs skaters all the time get marks for timing so i think its good idea to get level for this, because timing is one of the most important things in CDs.
If they want to made some marks lower the could change some rules, like you said. Like this was after 2006, when ice dancers had very high scores ofr FDs.
And i think any program didnt deserve 10 in any component last season, so this the way to made marks lower - give skaters reall marks in PCS.

IoanaC
08-26-2012, 11:37 AM
And in CDs skaters all the time get marks for timing so i think its good idea to get level for this, because timing is one of the most important things in CDs.

True, but as the scoring tends to be subjective and differ from one competition to another, I'm afraid it's going to be another cause for skaters to look at the protocol sheet and wonder what and where they did wrong.

pani
08-26-2012, 12:45 PM
True, but as the scoring tends to be subjective and differ from one competition to another, I'm afraid it's going to be another cause for skaters to look at the protocol sheet and wonder what and where they did wrong.

I think ISU wish skaters use original rythm for pattern dance, not like some skaters skated golden waltz on blues or tango thats why this rule was made (IMHO)

Proustable
08-26-2012, 03:41 PM
True, but as the scoring tends to be subjective and differ from one competition to another, I'm afraid it's going to be another cause for skaters to look at the protocol sheet and wonder what and where they did wrong.

But how would that be any different if they changed how they scored the PCS?

I think having timing be a key component of technical CD-step marking is fine.

DORISPULASKI
08-26-2012, 04:35 PM
Will see, how they will help, because last season Shpilband-Zoueva teams had big problems with pattern dance levels and even at WCh didnt get levels 4, like W-P.
But i think Klimova better specialists, if we are talking about CDs.

Unfortunately, today's version of grading pattern dances is completely unlike the past.

For example, Platov has shared that Grishuk could never do the back edge that all the teams were missing almost all the time in the rhumba last year. And for that matter, G&P had a deliberate delay in the steps in the GW, in order to obtain a more classy leg extension (at least so the commentators said at the time) With the new rules, both of those flaws would lose you a level.

Klimova was a wonderful skater. But it is her husband, AFAIR, that has the formal tech credentials, not her.

So I don't find Margaglio a super-funny choice. But reasonable people may differ, and YMMV.

And yes, rules are changed to lower scores in general. However, TPTB, when they consider the matter, I think there are only 2 countries that want V&M and D&W to have almost perfect scores. Everyone else wants a change (that would presumably benefit them.)

I'm happy with having the steps on the correct beats (that's really a fairly objective criterion). What I don't llike is the inconsistent way the key points were evaluated last year.

This new business just makes it messier.

martyross
08-26-2012, 05:31 PM
if the top two teams get caught in these rules and the teams from Detroit do well, the gap between the scores would be reduced for sure and i expect the judges to award W/P more this year in the PCS. who knows, they could even get 68-70 and 'threaten' the top two before Worlds. but all this only in the SD though. however i suspect this year things will be shaken up score-wise and by the time of Sochi the 'landscape' will be much different from now. just remember how much important are medals in ice dance for Russia. DomShab were not great in Vancouver but their technique was good, so i guess the 'chosen' team from Russia will have to be solid technically and it could get the bronze.

Shayii
08-26-2012, 07:34 PM
I want to ask something that I started thinking about after Marty said one of things she was worried about for next season was politics. How much do you guys think politics is going to a play a role in the events that unfold next season? Also who has the more political clout Marina or Igor, and how much factor will that play, if any?

Emdee thanks for the report. I'm glad to hear you had somewhat of a good time. Also I agree it must be exhausting to do two shows a day even if they are only 30 minutes long.

iggie
08-26-2012, 07:41 PM
i did go the cne yesterday. i enjoyed the show so much that i saw it twice. the show had no coherence, but it was a great chance to see tessa and scott live. this show was basically the only thing i did at the cne, besides hunting down some edible food. it was worth it. the crowds were huge. the lineups were huge (which is why i couldn't find emdee). tessa and scott seemed to be enjoying themselves and were much better at the program compared to previous outings... like when i saw them at stars on ice toronto.

i wrote about the experience on my blog. you can find it here (http://compulsorydances.blogspot.ca/2012/08/heres-to-front-row-seats.html)

eta fixed link

pani
08-26-2012, 07:42 PM
I want to ask something that I started thinking about after Marty said one of things she was worried about for next season was politics. How much do you guys think politics is going to a play a role in the events that unfold next season? Also who has the more political clout Marina or Igor, and how much factor will that play, if any?

Good question. I remember in the past people thought Igor is very good in politics. But i have impression Marina is very strong in politics too. But we could see only when competitions will start. IMHO, next season Zoueva need to made her best programs for her team to still on the top.