PDA

View Full Version : Czisny to undergo surgery for torn labrum in left hip



Pages : 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

euterpe
05-22-2012, 01:41 AM
The one thing that was noticeable was that from the GPF on, often when Czisny tried to land her jumps, she would instinctively pull her body down towards the landing leg, as if to save herself the pain of the landing. That's why so many of her jumps failed at the Challenge Cup and Worlds.

She doesn't admit to being in pain until after Worlds, but I can't help wondering if she WAS feeling pain but was in denial about it---or couldn't admit to it without facing USFS reprimand and fine ala Flatt in 2011.

rfisher
05-22-2012, 01:46 AM
Anyhow, I hope she recovers. I suspect, though, this will likely be a career-ender.

Not necessarily. The surgery is an arthroscopic type which is minimally invasive. They are doing excellent work with these now and this is not an uncommon injury for golfers and skaters who twist their hips repetitively. Of course, the success is dependent on the degree of tear, but she could be back on the ice in 2-4 months. Even if she decided to opt out of NHK, she should be completely well by US Nationals.

I just did quite a bit of reading on this and one key point is that the tear is often asymptomatic until it's really a problem. Which means she very likely didn't feel any pain until very recently. Athletes often can pin point when things started feeling "wrong" after the fact, but not while it's happening. And, it doesn't necessarily impact every movement meaning she could land one jump and then not the next and not know exactly what went wrong. It would depend on how she landed and whether the hip was torqued so that the tear was stretched enough to cause the head of the femur to move just a little. That would be sufficient for her to not "get her legs under her" as she described at Worlds. She has a surgeon who specializes in this procedure so I'd say her odds are good.

agalisgv
05-22-2012, 02:03 AM
Not necessarily. No, it's not a given. It's just a hunch I have that even if she competes again, her skating career is pretty much over. You don't typically see skaters bounce back after having hip surgery and return to competitive skating. Show skating, yes. But not competition.

Could be wrong of course--just a hunch

triple_toe
05-22-2012, 02:04 AM
Right, so am I the only one who thinks this injury may be a *result* of some of the awful falls she had been taking in the first half of 2012, not the cause?

agalisgv
05-22-2012, 02:09 AM
Right, so am I the only one who thinks this injury may be a *result* of some of the awful falls she had been taking in the first half of 2012, not the cause? This goes back to something her coach said.

"Yuka and I always tell [our students], 'If you never give up out there, we will always be there for you.' When I looked at [Czisny's free skate], I saw that she never quit, so I'm there for her, and so is Yuka. Most people would have started just doing doubles, but Alissa kept fighting ... In that respect, I'm very proud of what she did, because she didn't give up."

To me that sounds rather foolhardy. If something in your body is off, it does damage to keep falling repeatedly like that. Praising someone for choosing to fall rather than protect their body by going for doubles doesn't sound smart to me.

Thoughts?

Aussie Willy
05-22-2012, 02:12 AM
She wasn't falling all over the place during warm ups at worlds. Or during her practices.

I wish her a speedy recovery, but I still think about 80% of this is in her head.
Competition is a different environment. The body does strange things. If there are any weaknesses, then it is more likely problems are going to occur because of nerves. I think in this instance she needs to be given the benefit of doubt.

rfisher
05-22-2012, 02:18 AM
Based on what I read, it's not the falls that causes the problem. It's the twist of the hip that stretches the labrium. Do it over and over and it eventually will tear. This is why this is a common injury for hockey player and pro golfers. In golf, they twist the hip during the swing. It's the repetitive movement; not the fall. Many, many athletes don't know what's happening. The labrium prevents the acetabulum from coming out of the joint. The stretching allows movement of the acetabulum. Which would cause your landing to be off enough to let you fall. MK tore hers and she was hardly known for falling. Neither was Tara. If bad enough, this could cause the hip to dislocate which often happens in auto accidents.

I thought this injury was one of the reasons for the age limit in the hope the younger skaters wouldn't be practicing the triples so much. Not that that worked since the kidlets throw down triples like they're nothing.

Louis
05-22-2012, 02:34 AM
To me that sounds rather foolhardy. If something in your body is off, it does damage to keep falling repeatedly like that. Praising someone for choosing to fall rather than protect their body by going for doubles doesn't sound smart to me.


To be honest, I think it's mistake to assume Alissa could've even landed doubles at Worlds :shuffle:. At Challenge Cup, she was struggling with double toes and single axels.

ITA with you that this is a career-ender. You have an older, highly inconsistent skater with a hip injury. There's no happy ending here.

triple_toe
05-22-2012, 02:47 AM
Based on what I read, it's not the falls that causes the problem. It's the twist of the hip that stretches the labrium. Do it over and over and it eventually will tear. This is why this is a common injury for hockey player and pro golfers. In golf, they twist the hip during the swing. It's the repetitive movement; not the fall. Many, many athletes don't know what's happening. The labrium prevents the acetabulum from coming out of the joint. The stretching allows movement of the acetabulum. Which would cause your landing to be off enough to let you fall. MK tore hers and she was hardly known for falling. Neither was Tara. If bad enough, this could cause the hip to dislocate which often happens in auto accidents.


Yeah, that's kind of what I mean. I think her problems started before worlds because of... whatever, but not because of this. Often when your jumps go off you start to compensate. Pick harder, torquing more, etc. Placing more stress on the hip because you think if you just try harder it'll start working. You do that over and over, you start taking bad falls, and something starts hurting.

My guess would be things started to go wrong for some other reason. She was shaky all year, apart from TEB. Things started snowballing and the injury came about from that. It was a symptom of the problem, not the cause.

Coco
05-22-2012, 02:58 AM
The one thing that was noticeable was that from the GPF on, often when Czisny tried to land her jumps, she would instinctively pull her body down towards the landing leg, as if to save herself the pain of the landing. That's why so many of her jumps failed at the Challenge Cup and Worlds.

She doesn't admit to being in pain until after Worlds, but I can't help wondering if she WAS feeling pain but was in denial about it---or couldn't admit to it without facing USFS reprimand and fine ala Flatt in 2011.

Yeah, this is where I'm at. I mean, I just don't understand how the injury can occur slowly over time, but not cause pain while it's occurring. That is Chewbacca living on Endor. Can the medical people explain it?

I mean, is it possible that the injury is totally unrelated to the jump issues she had after Nationals? If not, and it was just weakness but no pain, wouldn't you at least feel the difference? I guess that's a question for the people who actually know what doing a triple jump feels like.

I will say, in her defense, that I messed up my sacroiliac, which is close to the hip, lol, and the injury is really inconsistent. Some days everything's in the right place and there's no serious pain. Other days, stuff moves around, locks up, etc, and I have issues. So maybe it was something like that, and there was no apparent pattern, just good days and bad days?

And wrt what triple toe said, I do wonder if those falls made things way worse. I know a torn labrum is a torque injury, but if the blade locks into the ice and the body keeps twisting, that could injure a hip pretty quickly. This is what appears to happen on some falls.

DickButtonFan
05-22-2012, 03:29 AM
It looked very much like an injury during worlds, from the way she took off on the 3loop, she didn't bother to make her hips square, she just wipped the jump and hoped for the best. The setup was all off. I'm really surprised her coaches let her go to worlds like that. Hope she recovers well from this surgery.

AxelAnnie
05-22-2012, 04:49 AM
i have a really high tolerance for pain. This is nit a good thing. I can be hurting myself riding or exercising or whatever, and not think anyhring is really wrong. I broke a bone in my pelvis until the chiropractor said...maybe you need an xray.

With an elete athlete who is used to dealing with pain, especially with an inconsistency in her jumps,and an amazing heart and enormous grit.....I could imagine that torn hip muscle would be one of the last places Alissa would go for an explanation or excuse. It isn`t in her nature to complain or look for excuses.

boy I hope she can come back. She is a unique young woman and extremely gifted

Alex Forrest
05-22-2012, 04:52 AM
To be honest, I think it's mistake to assume Alissa could've even landed doubles at Worlds :shuffle:. At Challenge Cup, she was struggling with double toes and single axels.

ITA with you that this is a career-ender. You have an older, highly inconsistent skater with a hip injury. There's no happy ending here.

And let's face it, that is the reality of the situation. I am very sorry for Alissa, but it's game over. I'm not even sure her coaches 'get it'. She was clearly off and/or injured yet they praise her for going for one heinous fall after another? If Jason and Yuka think that an American senior worlds competitor who does not land either a 2axel or triple in either program is a 'fighter', something is wrong with the coaching team. Sure she didn't give up, but she didn't DO anything except fall. I respect Alissa, she is very nice and kind in person, and heaven knows she's had so many 5 fall programs that she'd be immune to it. But reality is reality, and as beautiful as she is and if she chose modelling, I'd still peg her on ANTM to fall at least three times on the runway. She probably falls out of bed each morning. Not to be mean, but it's alarming how comfortable she is with 'losing her balance'. I was hopeful with her new coaching team, but after the last round of articles, I'm not sold. Alissa deserves a happy ending, she really is as nice as ABC wants to project.

DickButtonFan
05-22-2012, 05:11 AM
Even if Yuka and Jason didn't know if she was injured, they must have seen something was very off with Alissa's take offs and and the leaning in the air as she's about to land. They should have withdrew her with all those falls, the olympics are just around the corner, it's not worth risking it.

jlai
05-22-2012, 05:22 AM
And let's face it, that is the reality of the situation. I am very sorry for Alissa
But reality is reality, and as beautiful as she is and if she chose modelling, I'd still peg her on ANTM to fall at least three times on the runway. She probably falls out of bed each morning. Not to be mean, but it's alarming how comfortable she is with 'losing her balance'.

Is this necessary? :(

Happy endings in skating are few, but let us hope Czisny will be happy with what she has accomplished no matter what happens, and that it will end somewhat happily for her.