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JasperBoy
05-22-2012, 05:26 AM
I am concerned that Canada's #4 man, Elladj Balde, is not listed for any GP. He could be given the one TBA at Skate Canada but surely he deserves an assignment in light of his placement at Cdn Nats.

sadc
05-22-2012, 05:34 AM
I am concerned that Canada's #4 man, Elladj Balde, is not listed for any GP. He could be given the one TBA at Skate Canada but surely he deserves an assignment in light of his placement at Cdn Nats.

But the #3 man doesn't?

love_skate2011
05-22-2012, 07:06 AM
just came back from a month of remote vacation
holy cow, I am happy for Miki's return :eek:

weak entries for NHK trophy
and Julia will be competing amonst all the big girls in France and China. good luck Julia

and Shelepen getting only 1 assignment :(
I hope she gets the host pick so she can get 2 or to Polina K.

kwanfan1818
05-22-2012, 09:26 AM
I knew that! :shuffle: (ETA: That was kwanfan1818's original error, not mine. ;)) I've edited the correction into my above post.
:o Thank you for correcting it :)



https://twitter.com/#!/joshdfarris/status/204684561077121024

Josh wanted a gp but didn't get one. ETA: IMHO, that s*cks esp when skaters not on top 24 world ranking or sb got one gp
If USFS submitted his name, he would have gotten at least one.


Machida is top 24 WR
Not sure how Ragozine, Menshov, Dmitriev, Hendrix, and Voronov got one as they weren't host picks. Rules must have changed?
The rule for the initial selection has been that after all of the skaters guaranteed two get two and all of the skaters guaranteed one get one, the host nations can pick from the Top 75 list for non-host picks.

For the alternates list, last year's rules (v.1) state that all of the skaters in the Top 24 SB and WS guaranteed one who got only one in the initial selection have to get two before anyone in the Top 75 get selected for non-host picks, although there's no obligation to choose them.


Right.
The 2011-12 press release did not contain the JGPF/JW medalist guarantee that the 2012-13 press release states. I guess we'll have to wait for the ISU to issue the 2012-13 GP announcement (PDF document) to know what is going on... :confused: :)

:wall: ISU :wall:
They had the JGPF/JW medalist guarantee up until last season.

I'm not sure who is affected here: Lipnitskaia, Shelepen, Korobeynikova, Sotnikova, Gold, and Sinitsina/Zhiganshin all were Top 24 SB and would have been guaranteed one without taking JGPF/JW medals into consideration, with Sui/Han guaranteed two from their Worlds result. All of the rest weren't submitted for senior GP.

Last year, without the medal guarantee, Monko/Khaliavin got two in the initial selection, and neither of them (USA, CHN) were host picks.

This year, of the 12 Ladies who were Top 24, but not Top 12 at Worlds,
Five got two: Lipnitskaia, Tukhtamysheva, C. Zhang, Gold, Sotnikova (1 host)
Seven got one: Czisny, Nagasu, Korpi, Biryukova, Korobeynikova, Shelepen, Li.

Gold doesn't have a host pick, and she didn't medal at JGPF, so I don't think the number of spots is tied to the number of JGPF/JW medals.

I thought there might be a pattern where skaters in Top 24 SB and Top 24 WS got two over skaters with one but not the other, except where a skater got a host pick and a second, but I'm not seeing that: Korpi, for example, is ranked 5th in WS and 14th in SB. Nagasu is 13th in WS and 11th in SB. Zhang isn't in Top 24 WS.

On a different note, skaters are tweeting left and right about how thrilled they are with their picks. As expected, no one has yet tweeted "I hate [list event]. My selections sux."

But I thought Alex Shibutani (https://twitter.com/#!/AlexShibutani/status/204604599661887488)'s was worth posting:


Now I know why @rossminer wanted to call it a day at 8:30 last night. He wanted to check GP assignments at 2am.

ItalianFan
05-22-2012, 10:35 AM
:scream: for TEB. As usual :)

The good news are, that Pluschenko won't compete at CoR because Chan is there :P

I wouldn't bet on that if I were you.......

pinky166
05-22-2012, 12:02 PM
I think the US federation blocked the request from Joshua. Their reason might be 2 JG assignments is better than 1 SG assignment. Moreover, if the proposed rule change is passed, once you enter into the SG circuit, you cannot go back to JW anymore.

This is what I'm saying. Shouldn't Josh decide when he wants to move up, instead of the Federation? USFS is selfish if they didn't submit his name just so they can send him to JW again and rely on him to secure maximum JGP spots if Josh told them he wanted to move up. It's what he DECIDED and they should respect that. This means he also probably wants to try and go to senior Worlds but maybe USFS will make sure this doesn't happen but lowballing his PCS again while giving others mega-inflation to make sure he gets JW and that's it...

This will be his 5th season on the JGP :shuffle: and his JW performance showed at the age of 17, he is already one of the best senior men in the US. I mean, Denis Ten beat Abbott at Worlds and Josh creamed him at JW where Denis had performances of similar quality. Wake up and smell the coffee. Rippon is going nowhere without a major overhaul of technique and Ricky needs to prove himself to show he's a contender, just giving him more and more chances likely isn't going to rev him up to do so and show he really is a contender, because now he know it doesn't matter. I have my doubts about Miner ever being World or Olympic medalist material. They are being so dumb honestly, had his name been submitted I wouldn't be surprised to see Josh get 2 assignments and be the highest ranked American behind Abbott after the conclusion of the GP season, honestly.

love_skate2011
05-22-2012, 12:11 PM
btw, with Miki coming back is she staying with Morozov ?
It will be interesting if Miki will stick with him and his new star Leonova :drama:

Farris, Han and Brown seem like forever in juniors
same for Shoji and Agafonova

Jeschke
05-22-2012, 12:46 PM
btw, with Miki coming back is she staying with Morozov ?
It will be interesting if Miki will stick with him and his new star Leonova :drama:


after the interview with morozov i cannot imagine miki and him working together again.
ao it will be very interresting to see, who will be her coach, especially as she seems to be very instable with her nerves.

i wish so bad for her to get an olympic medal, but competition will be tough.

jlai
05-22-2012, 01:53 PM
Do you think this is strategic or an omission?

:o Thank you for correcting it :)



If USFS submitted his name, he would have gotten at least one.


The rule for the initial selection has been that after all of the skaters guaranteed two get two and all of the skaters guaranteed one get one, the host nations can pick from the Top 75 list for non-host picks.

For the alternates list, last year's rules (v.1) state that all of the skaters in the Top 24 SB and WS guaranteed one who got only one in the initial selection have to get two before anyone in the Top 75 get selected for non-host picks, although there's no obligation to choose them.


They had the JGPF/JW medalist guarantee up until last season.

I'm not sure who is affected here: Lipnitskaia, Shelepen, Korobeynikova, Sotnikova, Gold, and Sinitsina/Zhiganshin all were Top 24 SB and would have been guaranteed one without taking JGPF/JW medals into consideration, with Sui/Han guaranteed two from their Worlds result. All of the rest weren't submitted for senior GP.

Last year, without the medal guarantee, Monko/Khaliavin got two in the initial selection, and neither of them (USA, CHN) were host picks.

This year, of the 12 Ladies who were Top 24, but not Top 12 at Worlds,
Five got two: Lipnitskaia, Tukhtamysheva, C. Zhang, Gold, Sotnikova (1 host)
Seven got one: Czisny, Nagasu, Korpi, Biryukova, Korobeynikova, Shelepen, Li.

Gold doesn't have a host pick, and she didn't medal at JGPF, so I don't think the number of spots is tied to the number of JGPF/JW medals.

I thought there might be a pattern where skaters in Top 24 SB and Top 24 WS got two over skaters with one but not the other, except where a skater got a host pick and a second, but I'm not seeing that: Korpi, for example, is ranked 5th in WS and 14th in SB. Nagasu is 13th in WS and 11th in SB. Zhang isn't in Top 24 WS.

On a different note, skaters are tweeting left and right about how thrilled they are with their picks. As expected, no one has yet tweeted "I hate [list event]. My selections sux."

But I thought Alex Shibutani (https://twitter.com/#!/AlexShibutani/status/204604599661887488)'s was worth posting:


Now I know why @rossminer wanted to call it a day at 8:30 last night. He wanted to check GP assignments at 2am.

misskarne
05-22-2012, 02:47 PM
Interesting.

Josh has deleted his tweet about the GPs.

Sylvia
05-22-2012, 02:52 PM
^^^ Yes, I just noticed that this morning.


The men's 60 GP slots break down by country & number of men per country as follows:
12 countries, 33 different men + 6 TBA slots

JPN 13 slots / 7 [corrected from 6] different men

Additional notes:
JPN
8 men: six with two events each (Hanyu, Kozuka, Machida, Mura, Oda, Takahashi); one host pick (Murakami); and a TBA host pick

I've since corrected my earlier post -- Japan has 7 different men with GP assignments and no TBA at NHK. They've filled their 3 NHK slots with Takahashi, Hanyu and Daisuke Murakami (host pick).


This will be his 5th season on the JGP
It will be Farris' 4th season (he's competed in 6 JGPs and 2 Finals in 3 seasons).


and his JW performance showed at the age of 17, he is already one of the best senior men in the US. I mean, Denis Ten beat Abbott at Worlds and Josh creamed him at JW where Denis had performances of similar quality.
Farris had an extremely successful junior international season and skated superbly at 2012 Junior Worlds. Competing at the senior level nationally and internationally is a different ballgame, though, particularly mentally. I'm sorry that he won't get the chance to do the Senior Grand Prix (if that's what he really wanted), but he should have ample opportunities to prove himself and to continue improving his overall skating in the coming season, even if he's back on the JGP.

JasperBoy
05-22-2012, 04:28 PM
But the #3 man doesn't?

You're right! J10 doesn't have an assignment either. What's happening at SC?
Have they decided to overlook 2 seniors and go right to the junior rankings?

Surely both J10 and EB are not injured?

Sylvia
05-22-2012, 04:32 PM
I am concerned that Canada's #4 man, Elladj Balde, is not listed for any GP. He could be given the one TBA at Skate Canada but surely he deserves an assignment in light of his placement at Cdn Nats.

But the #3 man doesn't?

You're right! J10 doesn't have an assignment either. What's happening at SC?
Have they decided to overlook 2 seniors and go right to the junior rankings?
Liam Firus is ranked #40 on the ISU's Season Best scores list and that's probably why Skate Canada picked him for one of their SC host spots.

The Grand Prix minimum score cut-off for the men in 2012-13 is 159.66:
78 Jeremy Ten 159.22 (2012 Four Continents)
91 Elladj Baldé 151.57 (2011 Skate Canada)

It shouldn't matter, though, if either man is Skate Canada's TBA host pick, correct? Perhaps both will be sent to the planned U.S. Senior B in Salt Lake City in September or to Nebelhorn Trophy to determine who will get Skate Canada?

From the ISU's bulletin on the 2012-13 Grand Prix: http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/page/directory/0,10853,4844-205151-222374-nav-list,00.html?id=1066

The minimum score for the 2012/13 season is 3/5 of the highest score per discipline at the 2012 World Figure Skating Championships, which is 113.43 points for Ladies; 159.66 points for Men; 120.90 points for Pairs and 109.59 for Ice Dance.

MEN
1 GP assignment received (listed in order of ISU SB score ranking):
25 Sergei Voronov RUS
28 Jorik Hendrickx BEL (#27 in World Standings)
29 Andrei Rogozine CAN (#33 in WS)
30 Artur Dmitriev RUS (#37 in WS)
31 Jinlin Guan CHN (host pick)
32 Zhan Bush RUS (host pick)
33 Konstantin Menshov RUS (#21 in WS)
36 Daisuke Murakami JPN (host pick)
37 Alexander Majorov SWE (#15 in WS)
38 Douglas Razzano USA (host pick)
40 Liam Firus CAN (host pick)

No initial GP assignment (in order of ISU SB score ranking, all JGP age-eligible men removed):
3 Evgeni Plushenko RUS (Rostelecom Cup's TBA?)
31 Misha Ge UZB
41 Armin Mahbanoozadeh USA
42 Brandon Mroz USA
43 Peter Liebers GER
44 Christopher Caluza PHI
46 Viktor Pfeifer AUT
47 Jialiang Wu CHN
48 Chafik Besseghier FRA
49 Kim Lucine MON
50 Gordei Gorshkov RUS
51 Zoltan Kelemen ROU
53 Timothy Dolensky USA
56 Paolo Bacchini ITA
57 Ryuichi Kihara JPN
59 Jiaxing Liu CHN
61 Paul Fentz GER
63 Javier Raya ESP
65 Maciej Cieplucha POL
66 Philip Warren USA
77 Romain Ponsart FRA
[Cut-off (159.66) is above #78 Jeremy Ten CAN 159.22]

No SB score from 2011-12: Evan Lysacek USA - status still unknown (Skate America TBA?)

LADIES
1 GP assignment received (listed in order of ISU SB score ranking):
8 Alissa Czisny USA (reportedly requested just one due to her injury; #4 in World Standings)
11 Mirai Nagasu USA (#13 in WS)
14 Kiira Korpi FIN (#5 in WS)
15 Sofia Biryukova RUS
17 Polina Korobeynikova RUS
18 Kexin Zhang CHN (host pick, guaranteed 1)
19 Polina Shelepen RUS (#23 in WS)
24 Zijun Li CHN (#20 in WS)
30 Christina Gao USA (host pick)
35 Amelie Lacoste CAN (host pick, #21 in WS)
37 Joshi Helgesson SWE (#17 in WS)
38 Rachael Flatt USA (host pick)
41 Kaetlyn Osmond CAn (host pick)
42 Mae Berenice Meite FRA (#15 in WS)
47 Bingwa Geng CHN (host pick)
62 Sarah Hecken GER (#24 in WS)
69 Lena Marrocco FRA (host pick)

No initial GP assignment (in order of ISU SB score ranking, all JGP age-eligible ladies removed):
39 Cynthia Phaneuf CAN (#25 in WS)
44 Elena Glebova EST
46 Jenna McCorkell GBR
50 Sonia Lafuente ESP (#27 in WS)
51 Joelle Forte USA
53 Natalia Popova UKR (#31 in WS)
60 Yuki Nishino JPN (#28 in WS)
63 Min-Jeong Kwak KOR (ISU Junior age-eligible 1 more season)
65 Isabelle Olsson SWE
66 Adriana DeSanctis CAN
68 Kate Charbonneau CAN
70 Kerstin Frank AUT

[I went down to #75 on the Ladies' SB scores list (http://www.isuresults.com/isujsstat/sb2011-12/sbtslto.htm). Cut-off for the ladies' GP minimum score (113.43) is #98 Isabelle Drescher GER & above.]

Ziggy
05-22-2012, 05:08 PM
I think the US federation blocked the request from Joshua. Their reason might be 2 JG assignments is better than 1 SG assignment. Moreover, if the proposed rule change is passed, once you enter into the SG circuit, you cannot go back to JW anymore.

This.


This is what I'm saying. Shouldn't Josh decide when he wants to move up, instead of the Federation? USFS is selfish if they didn't submit his name just so they can send him to JW again and rely on him to secure maximum JGP spots if Josh told them he wanted to move up. It's what he DECIDED and they should respect that.

No, Josh should not decide when he wants to move up.

It's not just about him and about what he wants.

USFS should do what's in the best interest of US Figure Skating and not what's in the perceived best interest of an individual skater.

Josh is certainly capable of making the JGPF and then even winning it, so keeping him on the JGP for one more season certainly makes more sense than him having just one GP and then placing in the middle of the pack, most likely.

jlai
05-22-2012, 05:14 PM
We dont know that Farris would have gotten just one gp. As more drop out he could easily end up with two.

Anyway thetrickle down effect is that novice skaters like Shum or Howe will likely not get a jgp