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View Full Version : Virtue/Moir #16: You can't blame me for feeling amorous



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elle123
04-05-2012, 01:09 AM
lol so do they think they are a couple off the ice too?

HAHA probably? or else the article makes no sense. And almost half of the couples they mentioned were only 50% Canadian lol
It would've made a lot more sense if they listed Other Canadian couples with great chemistry.

martyross
04-05-2012, 01:22 AM
Z/S strike again:D well just trust Tessa and Scott, if they stay it will mean that its the best for them and their career even though we outside fans might be puzzled at times. They are smart and grown up.

Golightly
04-05-2012, 01:53 AM
Er, I do not speak Russian, but given the sources, I very much doubt Z/S actually said that. I believe this is a case of 1) things being taken out of context and 2) language barrier. There is no way Zueva would talk about the reigning Olympic champions in such a condescending way.

I can, however, easily believe that Zueva said that given her past history with injuries, it is truly remarkable that Tessa was able to come back strong and win Worlds. That sounds more like something a coach would say.

clarie
04-05-2012, 02:15 AM
Er, I do not speak Russian, but given the sources, I very much doubt Z/S actually said that. I believe this is a case of 1) things being taken out of context and 2) language barrier. There is no way Zueva would talk about the reigning Olympic champions in such a condescending way.

I can, however, easily believe that Zueva said that given her past history with injuries, it is truly remarkable that Tessa was able to come back strong and win Worlds. That sounds more like something a coach would say.

That sounds more like it! I don't trust rough translations like that.

Bournekraatzfan
04-05-2012, 02:56 AM
I believe this is the article that Elkmaria referred to (the one with Anjelika Krylova's comments about V&M's skating):

http://winter.sport-express.ru/figureskating/reviews/20789/

Golightly
04-05-2012, 02:58 AM
By the way, I just watched the FD on high definition (finally!) and man, what bobbles? They are magnificent! Look a the variety of holds, ugh, so exquisite. I can't even describe it. And the characters! Look at the edge-work during the step sequences. So, so, so beautiful. Tessa's arms and back hold all those positions so beautifully. This is a program full of details. Unfortunately, the music turned many people off this season, but this program deserves to be more appreciated. You take that very same choreography and skate it to a more powerful piece of music and there is no contest, I am sure of it. And by powerful I don't mean popular, but with more accents and pace.

Bournekraatzfan
04-05-2012, 03:10 AM
Thank you so much, pani and IoanaC, for your reports. It is really neat to hear from fans who were lucky enough to attend. and thanks for the links, everyone.

now I am hearing fans of both teams asking for a coaching change...
but I agree with Golightly, something is being lost there in translation.

I look forward to reading more about music and program ideas:)

martyross
04-05-2012, 03:26 AM
By the way, I just watched the FD on high definition (finally!) and man, what bobbles? They are magnificent! Look a the variety of holds, ugh, so exquisite. I can't even describe it. And the characters! Look at the edge-work during the step sequences. So, so, so beautiful. Tessa's arms and back hold all those positions so beautifully. This is a program full of details. Unfortunately, the music turned many people off this season, but this program deserves to be more appreciated. You take that very same choreography and skate it to a more powerful piece of music and there is no contest, I am sure of it. And by powerful I don't mean popular, but with more accents and pace.
I want to thank you for saying this because it feels so weird to me reading negative comments on funny face. For me it was love at first sight and i wws sure people would have at least appreciated. I dont know its like getting a crush on,say, brad pitt and then finding ou that everyone finds him ugly. Lol. You start doubting your sanity.

sap5
04-05-2012, 04:11 AM
post deleted.

nlyoung
04-05-2012, 04:12 AM
I think people have to stop looking for conspiracy in all this. Given Tessa and Scott themselves acknowledged their few less than perfect moments (he covered it up, but Scott clearly tripped, for instance), Marina is simply repeating what many believe, that in terms of how well the teams performed in comparison to their own past performances, Davis and White skated better (L3 step sequence included as they've had them before). Tessa and Scott, on the other hand, didn't have a "perfect" outing for them and had performed better before.

Whether the content of the programs would justify placing one in front of the other isn't the point here and Marina isn't commenting on that. Marina is referring to these particular performances on this particular day. I'm sure Marina sees the two teams as equal all things considered, and for her, the team that skates their best on the day should come out ahead - in her opinion. In fact, this is exactly how Marina and Igor have managed to remain objective and fair with their students and not appear to favor one team over another. As they have said many times, when they arrive at competition they have done their job and it is then left up to the teams to execute. Sometimes V/M perform better, sometimes D/W. This doesn't mean she was rooting for one team over another to win it, just that she believes D/W had a better performance that day and for that reason deserved to have come out ahead, at least in the FD portion of this competition and on this day.

walei
04-05-2012, 04:36 AM
I think people have to stop looking for conspiracy in all this. Given Tessa and Scott themselves acknowledged their few less than perfect moments (he covered it up, but Scott clearly tripped, for instance), Marina is simply repeating what many believe, that in terms of how well the teams performed in comparison to their own past performances, Davis and White skated better (L3 step sequence included as they've had them before). Tessa and Scott, on the other hand, didn't have a "perfect" outing for them and had performed better before.

Whether the content of the programs would justify placing one in front of the other isn't the point here and Marina isn't commenting on that. Marina is referring to these particular performances on this particular day. I'm sure Marina sees the two teams as equal all things considered, and for her, the team that skates their best on the day should come out ahead - in her opinion. In fact, this is exactly how Marina and Igor have managed to remain objective and fair with their students and not appear to favor one team over another. As they have said many times, when they arrive at competition they have done their job and it is then left up to the teams to execute. Sometimes V/M perform better, sometimes D/W. This doesn't mean she was rooting for one team over another to win it, just that she believes D/W had a better performance that day and for that reason deserved to have come out ahead, at least in the FD portion of this competition and on this day.

I agree with your take on Z/S's sentiment that they did all they could as coaches and it's up to V/M and D/W to deliver. However as coaches do Z/S really think D/W and V/M are equal in terms of skating capabilities?

D/W should be worried if their coach think they skated to their 110% potential and they still can only get level 3s.

Carmen Ovsiannikov
04-05-2012, 04:56 AM
I'm probably going to get fussed at for this but....:shuffle:

For all the talk I've seen in the past about the need for younger judges because the current ones don't understand or purposely ignore this or that depending on who they want to win, it seems that many fans, skaters and coaches don't understand CoP either. Or like martyross, I'm going bonkers. Maybe CoP has changed and I'm the one who does not understand.

I guess that's why outside of Europe and Russia icedancing will never be as popular as the three other disciplines. Well it's more popular in Canada than the U.S. but anyway...

From what I've seen (youtube) and read (PBP) D&W were eye clean; fast exciting (to many) and seemed to have the cleaner program. However, did not D&W lose points at least in part because of negative GOE's? What they did didn't appear to have mistakes but the skating skills and the execution of those skills were deemed not as good as V&M's. The crowds don't seem to understand that and Marina for whatever reason doesn't seem to either. I guess V&M's bobbles (one was barely noticeable) are something more tangible that people can pick up on. V&M may have GOE points because of those small errors but with the high level of everything else they have done they picked up points everywhere else.

I keep thinking back to Sasha Cohen's silver medal win in Torino. All people focused on was that Sasha fell twice. Yes, she did fall but again once she got past those two falls, she probably picked up points for everything else she did.

Programs skated under CoP are (or were) supposed to be broken down into segments with the required elements having a starting value based on the difficulty of the footwork sequences or lifts, spins or what have you. Then points are added or subtracted depending on how well those things are executed. Or has that changed or it never was marked that way?

Every few years, the judges seem to change what it is they look for, what they reward in icedance. It seems many of the new generation of dance fans are the same way. They don't appreciate the subtleties in icedance, everything has to be laid out in front of them. As long as a program is exciting and the music is a huge booming piece then nothing else matters.

All season people were saying that no one (particularly V&M fans) should get upset because D&W and V&M were a great rivalry and very close. It could go either way. When V&M were coming up second that was the mantra; all of a sudden when V&M get a (deserved IMHO) win, we get people suggesting that they were gifted and coming up with articles where people are speaking out against them.

It's a shame because being as old as I am, I remember a time when the qualities V&M possess were prized and considered a requirement in icedancing.

Scott's admission of his mistake doesn't mean that V&M did not deserve to win.

Also, I also liked Funny Face from the first time I saw it and by the end of the season I loved it. IMO it may not be "artistic" or "creative" in the way FD's of past competitiors such as DelShoes, D&L and DenStavs were but I feel it's a step in the right direction. I suppose I'm one of the few who is tired of connect the elements programs. I'd like V&M to continue with trying something that's not completely generic; to move back in the direction of Pink Floyd.

I hope the fact that V&M won with Funny Face and P&B (who have the most interesting choreography in the field) finally win their bronze with the Mummy program means that more creative (and I'm not talking about OTT, overly voidy programs) FD's will be encouraged.

Golightly
04-05-2012, 05:07 AM
Again, am I missing the part where Zueva said that V-M were terrible and were given the title? Unless of course, you guys speak Russian, in which case I would ask you to tell me what is it that Zueva said? I do not trust Google Translate and never will.

I was thinking of music choices. I'd also like to see something contemporary, like this: http://youtu.be/5h-hvebnsZU maybe with this thrown in: http://youtu.be/o4I2BKXSbUA.

ETA: Tessa and Scott brought this on themselves for being such perfectionists and always admitting their bobbles to the press LOL. Seriously, if they hadn't mentioned it, we wouldn't be making such fuss about it. That is why they are bobbles, because it is not something too noticeable. If D-W stopped saying "this is the best we have skated this program" every time they skate that program (or any program) and actually admitted to having their own "bobbles" (which were there), we wouldn't be here either. Alas!

m_chenning
04-05-2012, 05:47 AM
Again, am I missing the part where Zueva said that V-M were terrible and were given the title?

No, she did not say that.


"Мерил Дэвис и Чарли Уайт исполнили сегодня свою программу исходя из 100% своего потенциала, другими словами — сделали все абсолютно чисто",— сказал Игорь Шпильбанд. "А Тесса все-таки допустила пару маленьких помарочек при переходе от одного элемента к другому,— добавила Марина Зуева.— Но надо иметь в виду, что она четыре сезона лечила ноги, причем обе сразу, и представить, насколько ей было трудно все это время выступать. И хорошо, что ребята вновь ощутили сейчас чуть подзабытый ими вкус победы".
Подробнее: http://www.kommersant.ru/doc-y/1905245


Meryl Davis and Charlie White were perfect in their programme tonight and did everything as best as they could on 100%. Another words, they had clean skating .- said Igor Shpilband. But Tessa had some minor mistakes in transitions from one element to another .- added Marina Zueva. But we should bear in mind that she had 4 seasons with ill legs, both legs, so, you can't even imagine how difficult for her to skate all this time. And it's good that now they could feel the taste of the victory, something slightly forgotten for them.
--
Sorry for my english.

martyross
04-05-2012, 06:00 AM
Standing ovation for Carmen! (the poster, not the opera :-D ) that was flawless!
We're probably reading too much in those quotes but nontheless shpilband is clearly biased and that is not fair since he's listed as T&S coach.it Should be 50-50 in bias for both teams,so to speak.