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Todd
03-10-2012, 11:21 PM
Hello Everyone,
I am a huge fan; but I dont know what is going on with her this season. Is she injured, lack confidence, undertrained, overtrainied. WHAT IS THE DEAL?:(

Sylvia
03-10-2012, 11:36 PM
You can join the ongoing hand-wringing, I mean, discussion (starting with post #776) in the "US Ladies [#3]: 2011-12 news, musings & everything else" thread in the Trash Can forum.

ETA: I've been watching Alissa compete since 2001 U.S. Nationals and she's been written off by fans many, many times before. I say: Keep your expectations low and just hope for the best! :)

fenway2
03-11-2012, 12:59 AM
But there's no specific Czisny thread so I don't see the harm in this one. :) to answer the OP, I think she's just a wildly inconsistent skater and despite her ongoing declarations of being a "brand new" skater, has never conquered that problem!

Iceman
03-11-2012, 01:06 AM
As time passes, the new Alissa looks more and more like the old one. Forty points behind Kostner and 20 points behind a skater who is rarely seen. Unbelievable. This combined with all this travel before Worlds does not bode well that she---or abbott for that matter--- will be in top form at Worlds

fenway2
03-11-2012, 01:37 AM
Was she ever a new skater though? I know Alissa loved to repeat it over and over and over again and the more she repeated it, the more the fans were trained into repeating it but I didn't buy it. 3 or 4 good competitions last year did not erase 9 years of inconsistency IMO. She got the benefit of the doubt at nationals this year (AGAIN), if she doesn't deliver at worlds , I doubt she will get the benefit next year.

RD
03-11-2012, 02:53 AM
Was she ever a new skater though? I know Alissa loved to repeat it over and over and over again and the more she repeated it, the more the fans were trained into repeating it but I didn't buy it. 3 or 4 good competitions last year did not erase 9 years of inconsistency IMO.

Bingo. MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY.

I said it in the US ladies thread- I think Czisny's been in a funk all season. She has not been able to keep up the mental toughness/consistency of last season. In short, she's reverting back to old Alyssa. NOT GOOD.

That said, can't really think of a suitable replacement for her on the world team. Zawadzki, no way...Zhang, maybe but she would have to be solid- currently she does not have much to fall back on if the jumps disappear. At least Czisny is not toast if she misses one or two jumps...

reese
03-11-2012, 03:34 AM
Japanese and Russian Feds would yank Czisny from their Worlds lineup for that performance today.

martyross
03-11-2012, 04:12 AM
all this patronizing over a skater is giving me an head ache.

smileyskate
03-11-2012, 05:10 AM
I didn't see this last skate you are talking about, but when she skated last time (white dress) and also was interviewed on TV with Adam Rippon, to me she just looked too thin or something for her age. She talked about how Adam had to deal with her empty cupboards or something like that....which seems a but unusual for an adult athlete. Maybe it was just the angle or something but I thought she seemed just a tiny bit frail or weak. Sayin' this out of care as I am fan. I know she wants to be a model but I don't know if that is what is best for the athlete mind and body. I think it would be nice to see her with some more strength in her muscles.........wait, didn't we say the same things about Johnny when he talked about needing to be hungry? Sigh.
I will hope for her to be able to do her best next time out!

triple_toe
03-11-2012, 09:35 AM
I get that impression too. She was never a powerful skater to begin with but she seems to be even weaker now. I'm surprised she was even trying a double axel-3toe because you need some serious muscle to get that done. She's noticeably smaller than she was a couple of years ago, even from last year. Didn't she talk about how she became a vegan a couple of years ago? It's hard enough to get adequate nutrients when you're a vegan, let alone when you're an athlete that needs lots of protein and energy. You also need to worry about injury prevention, since you're much less likely to be injured if you're in good shape, i.e. not too frail.

I'm not trying to insinuate anything here; it's less a question of weight and more a question of fitness IMO. I think Ashley Wagner is a perfect example, she's obviously thin but the girl is quite muscular. She's in incredible shape and appears to have the perfect balance. Alissa to me is definitely thinner but not fitter. There's no way she could have the strength to skate Ashley's program with the same attack and power, let alone the jumps. There have been discussions before about skaters looking out of shape and I think it should be noted that too far under ideal weight is as much "out of shape" as too far over. You don't want to go too far in either direction because it won't give you peak performance.

reese
03-11-2012, 11:04 AM
Alissa is vegetarian, not vegan.

Mayra
03-11-2012, 12:07 PM
Alissa is inconsistent and will always be inconsistent IMO. Even when she is on, she looks hesitant and downright scared on the ice.

She seems like a sweet girl and has wonderful spins and presentation on the ice, but the jumps just aren't there for her on a consistent basis.

Here's hoping she has a great outing at Worlds. :)

geod2
03-11-2012, 12:30 PM
I get that impression too. She was never a powerful skater to begin with but she seems to be even weaker now. I'm surprised she was even trying a double axel-3toe because you need some serious muscle to get that done. She's noticeably smaller than she was a couple of years ago, even from last year. Didn't she talk about how she became a vegan a couple of years ago? It's hard enough to get adequate nutrients when you're a vegan, let alone when you're an athlete that needs lots of protein and energy. You also need to worry about injury prevention, since you're much less likely to be injured if you're in good shape, i.e. not too frail.

I'm not trying to insinuate anything here; it's less a question of weight and more a question of fitness IMO. I think Ashley Wagner is a perfect example, she's obviously thin but the girl is quite muscular. She's in incredible shape and appears to have the perfect balance. Alissa to me is definitely thinner but not fitter. There's no way she could have the strength to skate Ashley's program with the same attack and power, let alone the jumps. There have been discussions before about skaters looking out of shape and I think it should be noted that too far under ideal weight is as much "out of shape" as too far over. You don't want to go too far in either direction because it won't give you peak performance.


triple-toe,
You have given a thoughtful analysis to an ongoing potential controversy in FS (and other sports). This first came up when Alissa switched coaches after her "big meltdown" at 2010 Nationals. I believe she is vegetarian, not vegan. But, either way, at the time there was discussion on a thread or two about her physical changes as a result of a major overhaul in coaches, attitude, diet, etc. etc. ...the "new Alissa."

She was definitely a bit lighter, but it also coincided with her sudden explosive improvement under Yuka and Jason.
...And, yes, there was concern (I was one of the folks concerned for the reasons you outline...protein, nutrients, etc.).

OTOH, the fact is she currently looks EXACTLY the same as he did when she won U.S. and GPF.
No difference at all. She is NOT suddenly thinner and more frail compared to June-Aug 2010.

What IS different is the accumulative effect of years of repetititive pounding and stress......what this sport can do do to a human body. I don't think this is underappreciated within the ranks of FS, except among those who refuse to read and understand the legitimate available research.

What IS underappreciated is what can be done about it and the cost. If you get far enough down the research road to appreciate that this can be addressed through nutritional supplementation, you quickly realize how expensive it is ($300-700 per month) to provide the legal supplements (available in any health food store) required to mitigate the effects of protein cross-linking, free radical, and inflammatory response DAMAGE. We're talking about vitamin E (alpha and gamma versions), vitamin C, Docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), Gamma-linolenic acid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamma-linolenic_acid)(in small amounts),
and a dozen other inhibitors of inflammatory responses to repetitive injuries and their effect on the profile and cascade of eicosenoids, prostaglandins, thromboxanes, prostacyclins, and leukotreines.

Alissa avoided serious injury for years, I believe, through the use of the Jackson flex boots. Once she went back to traditional boots, her risk of eventual injury went up tremendously. Combined with the passage of years, lack of nutritional supplements to combat and mitigate inflammatory, cross-linking, and free radical damage from repetitive pounding, Alissa was vulnerable to having a significant injury for the first time in her career.
GPF 3 months ago was that significant injury.

As a fan, I remember sort of bragging how Alissa's training routine protected her and allowed her to compete without the career-ending injuries that so many before her had to endure. Without serious attention to the preventative aspects of her diet (as it pertains to inflammation and cross-linking, aka stiffening of joints, tendons, etc.) ...in other words, at age 23-34 without nutritional supplementation to mitigate the training damage to a 23-24 year-old body, Alissa will be challenged to continue competing at the elite international level, IMHO......regardless of how "frail" or not that she looks at the moment.



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Johnny_Fever
03-11-2012, 01:26 PM
Czisny is the last of the 'glamorous' champions, but like most of the pretty ones, not very consistent. Think of Nicole Bobek.

geod2
03-11-2012, 01:41 PM
Czisny is the last of the 'glamorous' champions, but like most of the pretty ones, not very consistent. Think of Nicole Bobek.

Well, yeah, but for reasons that couldn't possibly be more different.

Each inspired FS fans with their story of "redemption"....but otherwise, they are worlds apart...

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