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geod2
03-13-2012, 07:44 PM
I take everything I read in these threads with a "boatload of salt"!

Too much salt is not good for you... :D

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b-man
03-13-2012, 08:05 PM
Thanks for the link, Ziggy. Helgesson second? Who'd have thunk it?

Helgesson always scores high in these rankings. She always enters what I guess are senior B's that most top skaters don't enter. She faces weaker competition, places high, and racks up ISU points. For instance, she placed first in an ISU competition in Dortmund.

skatesindreams
03-13-2012, 08:14 PM
Too much salt is not good for you... :D

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Don't worry...I don't ingest!

Cheylana
03-13-2012, 10:38 PM
Helgesson always scores high in these rankings. She always enters what I guess are senior B's that most top skaters don't enter. She faces weaker competition, places high, and racks up ISU points. For instance, she placed first in an ISU competition in Dortmund.
That is totally ridiculous. They really need to change those rules to prevent such grossly inflated ISU rankings.

leafygreens
03-13-2012, 10:57 PM
I would wager that Alissa eats as much ice cream as Sasha ate all those cookies she used to bake.

Don't forget Sasha loved ice cream just as much too - she had a whole section on her website devoted to it! :lol:

smarts1
03-14-2012, 12:41 AM
was anybody complaining when virtue & moir skated to valse triste? or rakkamo and kokko? someone else mentioned johnny weir. it's beautiful music when other skaters skate to it.

and the choreo is not any more empty than last season's, IMO.

why couldn't they have been going for that soft, hushed, solemnity and quietude--perhaps somebody on her team thought no other skater could do create that mood quite like czisny.

did anyone complain about the recent korngold short program? that to me was her absolute best program, not the grin-heavy la vie en rose or the stalk-stalk-stalk winston piece so many loved.

the korngold program now-- was that any more lively than valse triste? one could argue it was even more monotonous. the difference was it was a short program and there were not as many jumps to be stalked. and expectations weren't as high as they are now.

really reaching here, blaming USFS, choreo, music, vegan diet...

Even if you don't think Alissa's LP this year is as bad as everyone thinks it is, to the very least, the music for last year's LP was very pleasing to the ear. Even then, I still think last year's LP has more transitions than this year's.

For a soft piece like Valse Triste to work, you need to fill it out completely with transitions, otherwise you will be bored to death. On top of that, I'm not really a huge fan of her music cuts either for this season's LP.

AndyWarhol
03-14-2012, 02:31 AM
Don't forget Sasha loved ice cream just as much too - she had a whole section on her website devoted to it! :lol:

Thats right.. And a fluff piece which featured having a small bite!

Susan M
03-14-2012, 03:11 AM
I've seen theirs multiple times over the years, but I never understood how they ranked. Does anyone know how the IN process works?
An even better question is why did the IceNetwork feel a need to invent their own, totally meaningless rankings when there is an official ISU ranking that is actually used for things like seeding start orders and determining who needs to skate in qualifying. They just thought it would be fun to see how much they could confuse people?

Marco
03-14-2012, 03:48 AM
That is totally ridiculous. They really need to change those rules to prevent such grossly inflated ISU rankings.

Everyone has the same right to enter into those competitions. It's really more of a cost thing for other skaters who live far from Europe, where most of those senior Bs are held.

I think the more correct thing to do is to hold more senior Bs in NA and Asia.

Marco
03-14-2012, 03:50 AM
Even if you don't think Alissa's LP this year is as bad as everyone thinks it is, to the very least, the music for last year's LP was very pleasing to the ear. Even then, I still think last year's LP has more transitions than this year's.

For a soft piece like Valse Triste to work, you need to fill it out completely with transitions, otherwise you will be bored to death. On top of that, I'm not really a huge fan of her music cuts either for this season's LP.

I agree. It isn't so much the music as it is the edit that is dull.

For a subtle / dull piece to work, you really have to skate like Jeff Buttle. But Czisny is no Buttle both interpretation and choreography wise.

Iceman
03-14-2012, 04:37 AM
I agree, Marco, more senior b's need to be held in places other than Europe.

allezfred
03-14-2012, 11:08 AM
Nothing stopping the non-European federations from organising them.

antmanb
03-14-2012, 11:14 AM
While I do agree that more Senior Bs need to held around the globe, it also doesn't help that a lot of nations send a second tier team to 4CCs which means that while there is a greater spread of points across a nations team, they don't stand a chance of catching up with the total rankings of Europeans who only field their strongest skaters for the European Championships.

arakwafan2006
03-14-2012, 01:25 PM
Even if you don't think Alissa's LP this year is as bad as everyone thinks it is, to the very least, the music for last year's LP was very pleasing to the ear. Even then, I still think last year's LP has more transitions than this year's.

For a soft piece like Valse Triste to work, you need to fill it out completely with transitions, otherwise you will be bored to death. On top of that, I'm not really a huge fan of her music cuts either for this season's LP.

Also, I think that Alissa has trouble getting into a groove as it were with this music. Last years program had changes of tempo, a melody, a mood and a demension that worked for her. BUT, she chose it. Take the Red Violin by Michelle. That music was tough to skate to. You have to commit and make it work. At the start of the season, Czisny was attempting 3/3 combos. The jump content has consistently been watered down. There's nothing left to take away. I wish her the best but she did pick music that was a slight bit out of her range if you ask me:shuffle:

fan5
03-14-2012, 01:57 PM
Also, I think that Alissa has trouble getting into a groove as it were with this music. Last years program had changes of tempo, a melody, a mood and a demension that worked for her. BUT, she chose it. Take the Red Violin by Michelle. That music was tough to skate to. You have to commit and make it work. At the start of the season, Czisny was attempting 3/3 combos. The jump content has consistently been watered down. There's nothing left to take away. I wish her the best but she did pick music that was a slight bit out of her range if you ask me:shuffle:

I think for Alissa Valse Triste is associated with a scene in the play Kuolema for which the music was originally commissioned. Just looking at the sheer white dress, the way the skate begins motionless with eyes closed, the knit brow at the end. It fits with this scene in the play where the dying young mother was sleeping and is awoken to find people dancing in her room, and then joins them.