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PrincessLeppard
02-19-2012, 02:18 AM
I agree that breeding has become ridiculous. For example, a German Shepherd in Germany looks NOTHING like the German Shepherds one sees on these shows. And how much more mushed in can a pug's face get? They've already got breathing problems; how much more squished do you want them to get?

My mutt lived 18 years and only health problems at the end of her life.

IceAlisa
02-19-2012, 03:32 AM
What are the differences between a US-bred and German-bred German shepherd?

Jimena
02-19-2012, 04:04 AM
What are the differences between a US-bred and German-bred German shepherd?

I'm no expert, but I think it's more of a difference between dogs that are bred for show, and those that are bred for work. The main difference is the slope on the back. Show quality dogs have a very pronounced slope on their backs (http://southyorkshire.olx.co.uk/show-quality-german-shepherd-puppies-iid-2176305). Their hips are much lower than their shoulders and the slope is becoming more and more pronounced. It looks awful, IMO. Those that are bred for work, don't have that.

We had German Shepherds growing up and they were of German stock. Hips and shoulders were aligned perfectly. Beautiful dogs.

PrincessLeppard
02-19-2012, 04:06 AM
The German ones are also fluffier. :)

oleada
02-19-2012, 04:21 AM
A Clumber won best in show a few years back (1996). He was absolutely gorgeous (http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/past-winners-of-the-westminster-dog-show/2012/02/10/gIQAjVHe4Q_gallery.html#photo=16). I believe he won Crufts as well. I love that breed. Though I'm very committed to mixed breed rescues, a Clumber would be my dream dog. Well, one of many.

That said, I'm down on dog shows since I saw that British documentary on what show breeding has done to dogs. :( I'm still not over it.

I don't think I'll ever get that documentary out of my mind. :(

Japanfan
02-19-2012, 10:20 AM
I Their hips are much lower than their shoulders and the slope is becoming more and more pronounced. It looks awful, IMO. Those that are bred for work, don't have that.


Come to think of I did notice that on the shepherd in the final. And I didn't like how it looked either.

And it must really exacerbate hip displasia, which sheperds are already prone to.



I don't think I'll ever get that documentary out of my mind.


Does anyone have a link to the documentary? It was posted her a while back and I meant to watch it, but forgot.

Thanks.

Clarice
02-19-2012, 11:32 AM
If it's the one I'm thinking of (sorry, I don't have a link), the stuff on Cavalier King Charles spaniels was just heartbreaking. And I'm also upset about things I recently learned about English bulldogs - really, if a breed can only reproduce with human intervention, shouldn't that be a clue that things have gone too far?

Our Golden is the working type; my husband runs agility with him. I really prefer that look. I also have a little Maltese, but I keep him in a puppy cut so he can "be a dog". A full show-type coat would just get in his way.

Jimena
02-19-2012, 01:37 PM
Does anyone have a link to the documentary? It was posted her a while back and I meant to watch it, but forgot.

Here you go. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhXHFOrBbEc) Beware, it's heartbreaking and it might make you want to throttle someone.

sk8er1964
02-20-2012, 05:57 PM
Our beagle, April (Rossut Queen, parents were Crufts winner Graadtrees Hot Pursuit of Rossut and Rossut Elegance - her sister Rossut Quietly is in quite a few breedlines in Poland, Germany and Israel), was not a healthy dog. She had a deviated septum, and heart problems, and she died at a pretty young age (she was around 10, I think). Although I will say she was one heck of a good dog with lots and lots of personality!

Our other assorted mutts and field beagles, with the exception of Humphrey who is unfortunate enough to have Cushings, have been much healthier dogs.

Rob
02-20-2012, 07:15 PM
We had one pedigreed dog - a collie puppy. He soon went blind. I was 5 when we got him, and by the time we figured out he was blind, I was so attached to him that my parents couldn't take him back. After that, we got a mutt -- a white husky something or other mix. She was totally healthy.

Japanfan
02-20-2012, 09:49 PM
We had one pedigreed dog - a collie puppy. He soon went blind. I was 5 when we got him, and by the time we figured out he was blind, I was so attached to him that my parents couldn't take him back.

And why would you consider 'taking him back'? Because he was pedigree and therefore shouldn't be blind?

Your statement just troubles me because a dog isn't the same as a toy or an appliance or a car that you return to the manufacturer because it's defective. And I've just watched the documentary that was posted - just heartbreaking, and it completely outraged me.

We lived four years with a blind dog - she was also elderly and diabetic. When she first went blind I didn't think she'd ever be able to walk off leash again, but she adjusted very well and her blindness didn't stop her from enjoying her life. We taught her some new commands and she was still able to hike up mountains with us off leash and go for swims (albeit around in circles)

Blindness really isn't a handicap. I don't see any reason to get rid of a dog because of it.

Lorac
03-09-2012, 08:56 PM
The premier UK dog show Crufts is on at the moment - 8th -11th March to be exact - and I am currently sitting watching it. However I was wondering what the dog lovers on here thought of the new policy brought in by the Kennel Club this year regarding what they refer to as High Profile Breeds:


The Kennel Club has introduced veterinary checks for the Best of Breed winners at all Kennel Club licensed General and Group Championship Dog Shows from Crufts 2012 onwards, in 15 designated high profile breeds. This measure was introduced to ensure that Best of Breed awards are not given to any dogs that show visible signs of problems due to conditions that affect their health or welfare.

The fifteen high profile breeds are as follows: Basset Hound, Bloodhound, Bulldog, Chow Chow, Clumber Spaniel, Dogue De Bordeaux, German Shepherd Dog, Mastiff, Neapolitan Mastiff, Pekingese, Shar Pei, St Bernard, French Bulldog, Pug and Chinese Crested.

So far 3 dogs that 'won' their best of breed but have subsequently had their best of breed awards taken away after being checked by an independent vet and no so dog from that breed has gone though to their respective group final. These are the Pekingese, Bulldog and the Clumber Spaniel.

See attached for more details:

http://www.crufts.org.uk/news/bulldog-and-pekingese-fail-crufts-vet-checks

http://www.crufts.org.uk/news/clumber-spaniel-fails-crufts-vet-check

According to the chairman of the Kennel Club who spoke on the TV show last night after the show is over they will look at the vets reports and then ask the respective judges why they made the decision to award the dogs the best of breed when they seem to have some issues that should have excluded them from the win. It will be interesting to see how this unfolds going forwards and if other dogs get added to the high profile list. It can only benefit the dogs in the long run as sometimes the dogs a 'bred' to much to meet an absurd requirment.

skipaway
03-10-2012, 03:43 AM
Wow, I know the rules are not a suprise to the breeders, but as Krufts has set these rules do other Kennel clubs then have to have the same rule? If the dog is judged in other shows to be a good specimen of the breed and don't have the stipulation that the dog is then looked at and judged by a vet...It will be difficult to ever know if your dog will be ok until you get to Krufts.
Why do you need a judge then for these specific "high profile breeds"? Shouldn't a vet be the judge so that a poor specimen doesn't make it into best of group?

Will be interesting to see if this type of thing crosses the Pond.

Lorac
03-10-2012, 08:16 AM
Wow, I know the rules are not a suprise to the breeders, but as Krufts has set these rules do other Kennel clubs then have to have the same rule? If the dog is judged in other shows to be a good specimen of the breed and don't have the stipulation that the dog is then looked at and judged by a vet...It will be difficult to ever know if your dog will be ok until you get to Krufts.
Why do you need a judge then for these specific "high profile breeds"? Shouldn't a vet be the judge so that a poor specimen doesn't make it into best of group?

Will be interesting to see if this type of thing crosses the Pond.

It is a new regulation brought in by the Kennel Club for all Kennel Club licensed General and Group Championship Dog Shows from Crufts 2012 onwards. Maybe once it is applied to other shows it will become clearer as to what is/isn't acceptable.