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View Full Version : The irrepressible, exasperating Mirai Nagasu, part II



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orbitz
01-30-2012, 02:05 AM
She can not pull off choreo like "Spartacus". And the music is all wrong for her.

There wasn't much to that Spartacus program to begin with. Lori misfired with this one.

maharbabackward
01-30-2012, 02:07 AM
I think Mirai definitely needs a sports psychologist. Remember when she beat Caroline Zhang who was hailed as the next big thing? She was a non-entity before that nationals and she goes and wins it. At Junior Worlds, when she has a bit more expectation she doesn't do as well as places second. She competes in the JGP while Zhang competes in Senior. At nationals, she is forgotten and completely destroys the competition in the SP landing a triple-triple. In the free, she falls on a double axel but still skates a seven triple program but definitely more tentative and cautious than the great SP. She has pressure again, and lands in third at the JW. Next year was when she had a big growth spurt and injuries, sso I won't discuss that. But the next year, she comes to nationals with less pressure (Flatt and Cohen were the ones people had their eye on) and makes the team. At the Olympics, there is no expectation and she skates two clean programs and lands in fourth. At worlds, she skates another inspired SP and is first. Feeling the pressure, she buckles and doesn't even medal. And since then, there has been an expectation for her to deliver because she has EVERYTHING aside from perhaps a true outside edge on her lutz.. she skates with speed, she has wonderful posture, great extension, difficult and beautiful spins, great musicality (when she wants to perform and not skating tentatively) and she can do triple-triples and is practicing triple axles (albeit not landing it fully turned as of yet). She needs a shrink badly.. or she needs to skate as if there is no pressure. If she is skating cleanly in practices, I don't think she's not not practicing. And she would be fired by FC is she didn't have at least a bit of discipline methinks. It is totally in the head, she expects a lot for her because she'd be an idiot not to realize how bloody talented she is. Everyone sees that. Now she needs to be able to calm her nerves and do it when it counts..

Sasha'sSpins
01-30-2012, 02:24 AM
There wasn't much to that Spartacus program to begin with. Lori misfired with this one.

This is true. That program is just awful, the worst Mirai has ever done.


To be fair, practice reports at Nationals said that Mirai was amazing in practice, so she had definitely trained. I think the problem (besides her coaching situation) is her head. She needs to see a sports psychologist. They have wonderful things to other headcases, and they can do the same to Mirai.

This, in a nutshell, is what I keep saying over and over again.


Sometimes you need to hit rock bottom(skating-wise) to put things into perspective. It allows you to take a step back and look at things in a different light. Ashley, Caroline, Carolina and Alissa have all been there and have obviously grown from their experiences. Maybe Mirai can do the same.

Maybe. I hope so. If people want to write Nagasu off, are 'over her' whatever. I'll still be there rooting for her until she figures out what it is she wants to do. If Mirai re-dedicates herself to her sport and really turns it around I'll be the happiest fan in the world. If she decides to retire I'll be sad but I'll still wish her all the best life can offer her.


Jeez how many times does mirai need to hit rock bottom and rebound only to bottom out all over again before she learns these lessons? After she imploded at 2009 nats not even coming close to defending her title or making the world team, she made major changes, new coach etc.. And rebound to finish an impressive 4th in Vancouver. If she didn't learn anything from that, she's a lost cause.

Sorry but I find it difficult to write off an 18 year old with loads of talen and many young years ahead of her as a 'lost cause'. :rolleyes:


How many times did Alissa turn in one bombed skate after another before finding some semblance of consistency(sketchy at that)? Ditto Carolina Kostner. Sorry but life isn't always simple. Sometimes growth takes time.

Well put. Some seem to think one only gets to hit rock-bottom once in their lives and then they don't deserve any more chances. Sorry-not me. I think this is the lowest point of Mirai's career and I hope she re-groups. I'm going to keep on believing.


So it pretty much comes down to this... Mirai needs to fix something in her mind (although there is no consensus), so she should go work with sports psychologist.

Yep. And I hope Mirai considers seeing one (if she isn't already).


I think Mirai definitely needs a sports psychologist. Remember when she beat Caroline Zhang who was hailed as the next big thing? She was a non-entity before that nationals and she goes and wins it. At Junior Worlds, when she has a bit more expectation she doesn't do as well as places second. She competes in the JGP while Zhang competes in Senior. At nationals, she is forgotten and completely destroys the competition in the SP landing a triple-triple. In the free, she falls on a double axel but still skates a seven triple program but definitely more tentative and cautious than the great SP. She has pressure again, and lands in third at the JW. Next year was when she had a big growth spurt and injuries, sso I won't discuss that. But the next year, she comes to nationals with less pressure (Flatt and Cohen were the ones people had their eye on) and makes the team. At the Olympics, there is no expectation and she skates two clean programs and lands in fourth. At worlds, she skates another inspired SP and is first. Feeling the pressure, she buckles and doesn't even medal. And since then, there has been an expectation for her to deliver because she has EVERYTHING aside from perhaps a true outside edge on her lutz.. she skates with speed, she has wonderful posture, great extension, difficult and beautiful spins, great musicality (when she wants to perform and not skating tentatively) and she can do triple-triples and is practicing triple axles (albeit not landing it fully turned as of yet). She needs a shrink badly.. or she needs to skate as if there is no pressure. If she is skating cleanly in practices, I don't think she's not not practicing. And she would be fired by FC is she didn't have at least a bit of discipline methinks. It is totally in the head, she expects a lot for her because she'd be an idiot not to realize how bloody talented she is. Everyone sees that. Now she needs to be able to calm her nerves and do it when it counts..

So the majority seem to agree-she needs to really WANT it, if not she should quit, if she does want it, she needs to seek out a sports psychologist.

Btw, on the lutz, it really bugs me that she hasn't seemed to work much on this. Someone with such good basics overall should have a clean outside edge on that lutz by now. Or perhaps it's easier said than done? Could a coach like Raphael help her improve on this?

agalisgv
01-30-2012, 03:08 AM
So it pretty much comes down to this... Mirai needs to fix something in her mind (although there is no consensus), so she should go work with sports psychologist. Um, no. I don't think there's anything wrong with her mind. If someone isn't into skating for whatever reason, there's nothing wrong with that and no need to see a psychologist.

I do have to say all this pathologizing of Mirai (eg. she has issues! she needs a psychologist! she's just pretending to want to do other things more than skating to set expectations low!) is more a projection of what some fans desperately hope than reflective of any reality.

And I should say, Mirai is by far my favorite US skater (and really fav skater next to Mao Asada). But to me it's pretty clear her heart isn't into skating anymore. Some things just are what they are.

:sigh:

euterpe
01-30-2012, 03:12 AM
ANY program is going to look terrible if the skater performs it with a blank look on her face from start to finish. Mirai had zero involvement with the music---her movements were robotic, and never reflected the ebb and flow of what is a highly dramatic and emotional piece.

judgejudy27
01-30-2012, 03:16 AM
I disagree here. Of course Nagasu wants to win, but a will to win is shown by actions. Its shown by giving everything to a program/performance/not giving up. Its also shown digging in and putting the hard work in training. She may want it, but does she want it as much as Michelle did-No.

What a contrast to how each responded by their breakthrough of coming 4th in a major event. Kwan used it to light a fire under her ass and make sure there was no way she was ever going to land 7 triples and be placed off the podium at a major event again. Then next year as a completely transformed skater she rips the World title away from the defending Champion in a historic duel despite the defending Champion skating her very best. Nagasu seemed to coast and rest on her laurels at that point, and is now dropping into the pack in the U.S.

berthesghost
01-30-2012, 03:18 AM
Sounds like Frankie might "fire" another pupil.

Wyliefan
01-30-2012, 03:33 AM
I think Mirai definitely needs a sports psychologist. Remember when she beat Caroline Zhang who was hailed as the next big thing?

I remember someone here (I forget who) had a sig line that went: "Suck it, Zhang. I rule. And I WEAR PINK RAINCOAT MATERIAL."

Still one of the best sig lines ever. :rofl:

The Fly On The Wall
01-30-2012, 03:36 AM
She didn't have this expression several years ago. What brought this on?? It's not like everyone around her is telling her her skating sucks and she's got crap technique and her win four years ago was a fluke.

Gee, I dunno....maybe she's been reading here???

bek
01-30-2012, 03:57 AM
Gee, I dunno....maybe she's been reading here???

If people are hard on here its in someways because they do believe in the girl's talent. I actually don't want Mirai to retire; I think she's incredibly talented and would love to see her get it together. But I'm also a bit tired of the excuses. A good example would be when she got off the ice she told Frank; I think I was concentrating to much on my facial expressions. Well the thing is I watched that skate; and that was pretty expressionless.

The thing is though I'd like to see her be happy. If skating isn't what she wants to do right now-its okay. I guess I'm not holding my breath.

The Fly On The Wall
01-30-2012, 04:01 AM
Far be it from me to even pretend to read her mind, but....I agree with whoever posted that she has such a fear of failure, she downplays her expectations. I compete in another sport and practice wonderfully....but the second it's showtime, I freeze, hold back, make stupid mistakes, etc., etc. It's not that I don't want it or that I'm not motivated. I work harder and longer than anyone on my team. But with several years' history of this pattern, it's always at the back of my mind that it's going to happen again. If this is what Mirai is experiencing, I wouldn't be surprised. I bet we'll never know though.

Coco
01-30-2012, 04:16 AM
The more I think about it, I think she's afraid to go back to worlds because of what happened last time she was there (1st to 7th). The more time that passes, the worse it gets.

judgejudy27
01-30-2012, 04:24 AM
She looked so bored skating at Nationals, like she was doing a practice runthrough. She didnt fight for anything. What the heck was her comment she was concentrating too much on facial expressions. She had the expression of a zombie her whole program.


The more I think about it, I think she's afraid to go back to worlds because of what happened last time she was there (1st to 7th). The more time that passes, the worse it gets.

It is hard to believe she was a good long program away from becoming World Champion only 2 years ago. That seems like an enternity ago when you look at her now.

bek
01-30-2012, 04:32 AM
Far be it from me to even pretend to read her mind, but....I agree with whoever posted that she has such a failure, she downplays her expectations. I compete in another sport and practice wonderfully....but the second it's showtime, I freeze, hold back, make stupid mistakes, etc., etc. It's not that I don't want it or that I'm not motivated. I work harder and longer than anyone on my team. But with several years' history of this pattern, it's always at the back of my mind that it's going to happen again. If this is what Mirai is experiencing, I wouldn't be surprised. I bet we'll never know though.

Yes but Mirai herself and her coaches have said she has motivation issues. Its not like people are pulling it from air. Maybe she was well trained here, but thats not every case.

IceAlisa
01-30-2012, 04:38 AM
I don't get the sense that motivation was the issue for Mirai this season. Frank hasn't indicated that this is the case this season. Additionally, Mirai looked fit and practice reports indicated that she was fit and focused during practice. Additionally, Mirai did summer competitions to get her programs out early. So I don't motivation is the issue.


As mentioned, I've watched her in practices and thought she looked very well trained and secure in everything. So you are probably right--the motivation and the work ethic are not the issue. Something else is, not sure what. She was looking very fit and ready in practice although there was no joy in her skating at any point.