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Holley Calmes
01-25-2012, 12:00 AM
Wah, no Michael Fassbender in the list :fragile:. Out of the nominees I've seen just Brad Pitt's Moneyball and I really can't see all the fuss about it and I <3 Brad Pitt usually.

I agree totally. I was put to sleep with this movie. Brad is a fine actor, and I do appreciate him. But that character was so bland I couldn't get one emotion going in his favor. Boring.

However-GO GARY!!!!!

Vash01
01-25-2012, 12:02 AM
Could a rationale be that the voting body doesn't really know the language so they don't really know the performance? They know the translation of the words but not like they know English straight off?


The first logical post I have read on this topic. I have been accused of not liking foreign films, just because a few posters did not understand what I was driving at. It's true that the voting body would have a tough time picking just 5 best performances from what is released world wide (it's different in an international film festival because it's a smaller pool). I think a closer rationale may be that they just don't have the time to watch that many films. I think (not sure) for best foreign picture, the countries submit their entries and then the academy decides on the 5 nominations. Naturally if other awards are given (e.g. screenplay) it is likely to be from only the very small pool, while many others are ignored.

Vash01
01-25-2012, 12:05 AM
I don't think 'Iron lady' is a horrible film, but I don't think this is Streep's best performance in recent years. I will be extremely surprised if she wins the Oscar this year; there are too many really strong lead actress roles & performances this year. Most other years this may have been good enough for her to win. I would have liked to see Swinton on the nominated list, but who can be dropped? I have not seen her movie, so I can't say.

genevieve
01-25-2012, 12:14 AM
Vash, it sounds like your stance on foreign films in Best Film category is similar to why you would like a separate category for Best Child Actor.

MR-FAN
01-25-2012, 12:19 AM
I would have liked to see Swinton on the nominated list, but who can be dropped? I have not seen her movie, so I can't say.

Glenn Close :shuffle:

It feels like michelle's Oscar to lose, but I'm really hoping for a roony upset. She was freakin brilliant in TGWTDT

BigB08822
01-25-2012, 12:29 AM
I am still expecting Davis to win then Streep/Williams in a virtual tie for 2nd followed by Close and then Mara.

orbitz
01-25-2012, 12:52 AM
What Jenny said. It's going to be on her [Madonna] upcoming album MDNA so it wasn't eligible.



But "Sooner Or Later" from Dick Tracy appeared in a Madonna album separated from the film, and it won the Oscar for best song that year. Unless the rules changed after that. I think it's a silly rule though.

Ziggy
01-25-2012, 01:06 AM
I guess the rule exists to prevent having songs picked from albums which already exist?

If that's the case, why can't they amend it to say that it's fine as long as the album is released after the film and the soundtrack are?

I mean from the organisers' perspective having Madonna perform at the Oscars ceremony would be incredible. And it would make great promotion for her upcoming album too. Everybody wins.

emason
01-25-2012, 01:12 AM
Again, you are missing my point. I am not talking about the film; I am talking about awards other than the foreign film award- like best actor, best screenplay, as examples. I already explained the rationale in my original post- there are just too many foreign language films to pick up the best actor/actress/screenplay/anything else from. Only a few get the visibility to be nominated for those awards, so it is unfair to all the others that had great performances but they did not get the visibility just because the film was not among the top. That is the rationale- pick from a smaller pool (English language only) when they give a few token awards to non-English speaking movie actors/writers, etc. They are essentially ignoring other great performances by doing that. How do you know a great performance in a foreign language film only occurs once in 3-4 years? How do you know that only one film in 10 years has a good enough screenplay to compete with an English language screenplay? It's a matter of being fair to the whole world that makes movies in other languages.

I have no problem with foreign language films; I actually like them better than the cheap stuff Hollywood puts out. They do get their awards- for best foreign film, and I have no problem with it. I try to see all those that got the nominations, because I know there is a good chance of them being good.

I'm sorry; I was not clear in my original post. I was talking about denying a foreign film a nod in other categories just because it's a foreign film. I see no rationale for this whatsoever. If the film has great editing, for example, why should it be shut out of the noms just because it's a foreign film. Where in the AMPAS criteria for nominations does it say all nominated films must be in English except for the foreign film. As for being fair, there are plenty of excellent films in English that get overlooked also; not all the deserving films in English get the recognition they should. No matter what films get nominated something will get overlooked, but that's life and not justification for shutting out non-English films.

Jimena
01-25-2012, 01:22 AM
It can't be fair unless they are considering all the films made worldwide, and all the performances in them, and that pool is just too big to make that determination, with just 5 spots available. Are you willing to give all the best actor nominations (for example) to 4 foreign language movies and just one in English? That won't happen, ever.

Yes, I would be willing to do that, even if it won't ever happen.

The pool of great performances in English is already huge. Only 5 are chosen. So the process is, by your own estimation, unfair to English language films because many of them are never released widely, are considered art house films and are not backed by big studios.

This whole discussion started because Demian Bichir was nominated and Michael Fassbender wasn't. You thought Bichir's movie was in a foreign language and that he shouldn't have been nominated because of that and now Fassbender was robbed. Since Bichir's movie is actually in English, does that make the Fassbender snub more "fair"? I don't understand why.

Do I think that some foreign films are better than English language films and haven't been recognized by the Oscars? Yes. Do I think there are probably better foreign language films than those foreign films recognized by the Oscars? Yes. But I don't think it's bad when any good (maybe not the best) foreign language film gets recognition in categories other than Best Foreign Language Film. I think it's fantastic.


I never said anything against foreign films; I have already said I like them better than most Hollywood films, so you don't need to tell me how good they are.

I believe you misread my post, Vash. I'm not patronizingly telling you how good they are. I'm merely saying that I like them and anything that puts them on the map is good in my eyes.


The first logical post I have read on this topic.
:confused: Was this necessary?


I have been accused of not liking foreign films, just because a few posters did not understand what I was driving at.

I think I missed when someone accused you of this (unless it happened in another thread I haven't read). Some of us are just disagreeing with you.

Eden
01-25-2012, 02:18 AM
Speaking of Best Film in Foreign Language category:
I'm glad Israel's Hearat Shulayim/Footnote (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRDBbGsiyPY&feature=related) is nominated.
I saw it few days ago, and loved it!
It's the 10th Israeli movie to be nominated and the 4th one in the past 5 years.
Joseph Cedar, Footnote's director, was nominated in 2008 as well for Beaufort (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzvowTA0DvY).
Israel has never won an Oscar, though. :(
Who knows, maybe this year it will change.

Ziggy
01-25-2012, 02:42 AM
It's the 10th Israeli movie to be nominated and the 4th one in the past 5 years.

This is proof that EVILLE Jews don't only make matzo from the blood of unborn children, they also control Hollywood (and everything else). :mitchell: ;) :D

VIETgrlTerifa
01-25-2012, 03:57 AM
I think people are confusing the Best Song rule. Madonna's song wasn't ineligible because it was going to appear on her upcoming album but because it wasn't the first song cue during the ending credits. Her song starts 40 seconds into he ending credits. A song is ineligible if it had already appeared on an album prior to the film and if the song wasn't written specifically for the film. Also, Bruce Springsteen's son for the Wrestler was eligible, it just didn't get nominated.

About foreign performances, I think like ANY film (American or not), a nomination depends on awareness and publicity. There are many performances and films that get looked over due to lack of attention. Also, when the Academy nominates a foreign performance, those actors are from a pool of films that were released in the U.S., not every film released world-wide, so it's a bit more tangible.

BigB08822
01-25-2012, 06:11 AM
I do think Bridesmaids should have gotten a Best Picture nomination. Now that there are more than 5 possible nominations, I see no reason to not give one nomination to the best comedy of the year. I don't feel it had any competition in the comedy category, so why not throw one nomination its way? Why is the best movie always a serious drama? That never bothered me before but Best Picture really is just a Best Drama award and rarely goes to anything else.

VIETgrlTerifa
01-25-2012, 06:31 AM
It's like the old ordinal system. Movies have to have enough no. 1 and no. 2 votes from voting members to have a chance at a nomination. It could be possible that Bridesmaids had a lot of votes for the 5th slot or above but just not enough 1 or 2 votes from the 5000+ member Academy.