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Nomad
01-07-2012, 06:52 PM
The arch in her back isn't bad, but I find the leg and arm positions ugly.

David21
01-07-2012, 07:58 PM
The arch in her back isn't bad, but I find the leg and arm positions ugly.


The arch is the most important thing in a layback. If you find the leg and arm position ugly, then this is an aesthetical thing and personal preference but that doesn't make it a bad layback.

Nomad
01-07-2012, 08:03 PM
The arch is the most important thing in a layback. If you find the leg and arm position ugly, then this is an aesthetical thing and personal preference but that doesn't make it a bad layback.

We'll have to agree to disagree, then. I look at the whole picture. To my eye, 2/3rds of that position are ugly, so it's a bad layback.

David21
01-07-2012, 08:13 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree, then. I look at the whole picture. To my eye, 2/3rds of that position are ugly, so it's a bad layback.


Sorry to say but you don't. You only look at the arm and leg position, find them ugly and then you decide that it must be a bad layback.

Arch in the back, centering, speed, entry into and exit out of the layback are, at least technically, at least as or even more important than the aesthetical poisition of arm and leg.

:)

Nomad
01-07-2012, 08:21 PM
Sorry to say but you don't. You only look at the arm and leg position, find them ugly and then you decide that it must be a bad layback.

Arch in the back, centering, speed, entry into and exit out of the layback are, at least technically, at least as or even more important than the aesthetical poisition of arm and leg.

:)

Entschuldigung, but you seem to have missed the part of my post where I gave her credit for the arch. Whatever. You seem to like it, I don't, end of, who cares?

all_empty
01-07-2012, 08:29 PM
A very nice layback position from Mao Asada, one with a great arch in her back and great lean in her sideways position:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbPbbUeQ3Kw&feature=related

or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nasdzwx_Ns&feature=related (3:36)

Also unusual because she looks down (Kimmie Meissner did this as well).

This is also a good example of an age-appropriate program for a young teen; much better than the "Baby Carmen" and twinkly "Nutcracker" she did the follow year.

David21
01-07-2012, 09:44 PM
Entschuldigung, but you seem to have missed the part of my post where I gave her credit for the arch. Whatever. You seem to like it, I don't, end of, who cares?


I didn't miss that part but it seems that you didn't get my point. And I do care about things like that.

IceAlisa
01-07-2012, 10:09 PM
Many critics complained about Sylvie Guillem (probably the best ballet dancer the world has ever seen) that she was too flexible and was just showing off. I never understood those comments (likewise I don't understand yours about arching less and not turning out so much. Not a dig, I just don't understand . To me it's like saying Patrick Chan's quad is too high or too clean). Every dancer I know would kill to have Sylvie Guillems technique/flexibility/body. I can pretty much guarantee that 99% of girl skaters would kill for Sasha's flexibility/body/layback.

La mariée est trop belle. :shuffle:


Yukina's back is out of this world-ly flexible, which also makes her for a wonderful ina bauer. Shame about her injury and jumping issues. She was so beautiful to watch and oh so promising back in 2003-4 ish. She is probably the most musical Japanese lady skater.
ITA. Ota remains my absolute favorite Japanese skater, short career non-withstanding.

sarakimm
01-08-2012, 02:40 AM
I agree.

Sasha Cohen of course has one of the best laybacks in the business:
Sasha Cohen 2004 Worlds - SP (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sI-cbt1u1uc)

This clip illustrates the point of another thread regarding camera work. Here we have one of the most beautiful spins in skating and what do we see -- a fleeting glimpse of her beautiful back and leg positions, and then a close up where we see virtually nothing of the spin. :mad::wall:

Scintillation
01-08-2012, 03:39 AM
I have to thank this thread for a) reminding me just how damn good Angela Nikidinov was overall and b) causing me to go on yet another youtube Sylvie Guillem marathon. I worship that woman. She is AMAZING. :swoon:
I think of all the layback videos I watched, my personal favorite has to be Naomi Nari Nam's. She had everything-speed, high leg position, and a beautiful back. Dorothy Hamill is a close second for me--hers is the most ethereal to watch. Sasha's was great but I always was disappointed when she didn't hold the first beautiful classic position, and went in to another position that wasn't nearly as aesthetically pleasing.

Macassar88
01-08-2012, 04:02 AM
http://www3.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Zijun+Li+ISU+Grand+Prix+Figure+Skating+Final+AtJ3C _DKyLIl.jpg
This is a really good example of the arch

Marco
01-08-2012, 06:44 AM
A very nice layback position from Mao Asada, one with a great arch in her back and great lean in her sideways position:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbPbbUeQ3Kw&feature=related

or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nasdzwx_Ns&feature=related (3:36)

Also unusual because she looks down (Kimmie Meissner did this as well).

This is also a good example of an age-appropriate program for a young teen; much better than the "Baby Carmen" and twinkly "Nutcracker" she did the follow year.

I love it when she would arch her back like that. She also had a similar but prettier position circa 2009, but decided to scrap it for one that is easier for her to obtain level 4. Boo.

Marco
01-08-2012, 11:01 PM
A little bit of trivia: Caroline Zhang was the first lady to get full score for the layback: level 4 and +3 across the board (http://www.isuresults.com/results/gpusa07/sa07_Ladies_FS_Scores.pdf).

Here is her 30 rev layback at 2 min: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7QSZbv7vVA and her most difficult and complicated layback spin ever: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQhf7WSUsGE&feature=youtu.be&t=13s

Macassar88
01-09-2012, 03:22 AM
A little bit of trivia: Caroline Zhang was the first lady to get full score for the layback: level 4 and +3 across the board (http://www.isuresults.com/results/gpusa07/sa07_Ladies_FS_Scores.pdf).

Here is her 30 rev layback: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7QSZ...outu.be&t=2m0s and her most difficult and complicated layback spin ever: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQhf7...youtu.be&t=12s


Neither of those links work

monty
01-09-2012, 11:40 AM
I always get a little teary-eyed when I watch baby NCubed skate. What could have been. We were all cheated but most especially Nam. Big sigh and back to cleaning the attic.