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bartek
12-29-2011, 10:41 PM
I consider Sasha's classic layback position to be absolutely the best. I know that Dorothy and Lucinda had a little bit better arch in the back but neither of them could achieve the perfect leg posistion. Sasha had brilliant arch in her back, one of the best, and her leg was absolutely spot on. Just perfect, very close to her back with beautiful turned out foot.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFtGt_s0JSY&t=3m48s

orbitz
12-29-2011, 11:28 PM
There's a heaviness to Sasha's layback that I don't like. It doesn't look easy for her to get into that position.

ks1227
12-30-2011, 02:58 AM
Oh how I love any excuse possible to post this vid! ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGsMDXLyXxs

Ladies, study this position. :swoon:
:swoon: :swoon:


Thank you !
And what about this one (http://youtu.be/K5p3zrEI7N0?t=2m24s) ?
Angela has a perfect layback. :swoon:
:swoon: :swoon:

I know that Cohen is supposed to be the standard, but in my book Nikodinov at her best is the ultimate layback spinner!

Karpenko
12-30-2011, 03:18 AM
Sasha's layback always irked me a bit.

The leg position is beautiful.

The back position is beautiful.

But those two beautiful positions, didn't look beautiful together. I always wanted Sasha to either arch less, or turn her back leg inward just a bit more. She had a great layback, but her basic position was over-done IMO. I still liked Angela's, she had just the right amount of arch and turnout.

Ozzisk8tr
12-30-2011, 04:19 AM
Sasha's layback always irked me a bit.

The leg position is beautiful.

The back position is beautiful.

But those two beautiful positions, didn't look beautiful together. I always wanted Sasha to either arch less, or turn her back leg inward just a bit more. She had a great layback, but her basic position was over-done IMO. I still liked Angela's, she had just the right amount of arch and turnout.

Many critics complained about Sylvie Guillem (probably the best ballet dancer the world has ever seen) that she was too flexible and was just showing off. I never understood those comments (likewise I don't understand yours about arching less and not turning out so much. Not a dig, I just don't understand . To me it's like saying Patrick Chan's quad is too high or too clean). Every dancer I know would kill to have Sylvie Guillems technique/flexibility/body. I can pretty much guarantee that 99% of girl skaters would kill for Sasha's flexibility/body/layback.
Near the beginning of this video Sylvie dances. My jaw dropped the first time I saw her dance. I was a professional dancer and you know how you see some people and they inspire you? She made me want to give up. :shuffle:
http://www.ina.fr/art-et-culture/arts-du-spectacle/video/CAB94097915/sylvie-guillem-bejart.fr.html

RockTheTassel
12-30-2011, 04:26 AM
I consider Sasha's classic layback position to be absolutely the best. I know that Dorothy and Lucinda had a little bit better arch in the back but neither of them could achieve the perfect leg posistion. Sasha had brilliant arch in her back, one of the best, and her leg was absolutely spot on. Just perfect, very close to her back with beautiful turned out foot.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFtGt_s0JSY&t=3m48s

I agree. Sasha's layback is my favorite. I love how she manages to have an impressive leg position and arch in her back. Absolutely beautiful.

Coco
12-30-2011, 04:29 AM
I feel silly for saying this, but I always liked Katarina Witt's layback and the way she got into the position with her arms. It as was though she was opening up like a flower or something.

skateboy
12-30-2011, 07:34 AM
I feel silly for saying this, but I always liked Katarina Witt's layback and the way she got into the position with her arms. It as was though she was opening up like a flower or something.

No reason to feel silly. Katarina had some great qualities to her skating.

Marco
12-30-2011, 07:52 AM
Funny someone brought up Yuna.

I know many people care a lot about the leg and foot positions (and Yuna's sucked), but to me the essence of a layback spin is the arch, and Yuna did have great arch to her layback spin. That, combined with the speed and centering, makes it a good layback spin for me. It's not pretty, but it's technically good because of the arch.

Similarly, Kwan's crescent moon position allows her to have better arch (and speed), and was a better position (for me anyways) than her 2000 position with the nice leg position but with no arch.

The same (although to a much bigger extent) extends to Lucinda Ruh and Yukina Ota.

Karpenko
12-30-2011, 08:50 AM
Many critics complained about Sylvie Guillem (probably the best ballet dancer the world has ever seen) that she was too flexible and was just showing off. I never understood those comments (likewise I don't understand yours about arching less and not turning out so much. Not a dig, I just don't understand . To me it's like saying Patrick Chan's quad is too high or too clean). Every dancer I know would kill to have Sylvie Guillems technique/flexibility/body. I can pretty much guarantee that 99% of girl skaters would kill for Sasha's flexibility/body/layback.
Near the beginning of this video Sylvie dances. My jaw dropped the first time I saw her dance. I was a professional dancer and you know how you see some people and they inspire you? She made me want to give up. :shuffle:
http://www.ina.fr/art-et-culture/arts-du-spectacle/video/CAB94097915/sylvie-guillem-bejart.fr.html

It's because you can't appreciate the full position right away, it's not a dig at Sasha at all. It's a beautiful layback spin!!

But she arches so much and the leg is turned out but somewhat to the side (instead of inward right behind her back), instead of more inward like Angela's, so you can't appreciate the full position right away. Your eye dances because you are trying to find her leg and she has it turned out instead of in (which is fine).

With Angela's layback I see the leg and the arch right away, there's a center-ness to the position of the spin that Sasha's doesn't have because she arches so much and doesn't put her leg in more. This is why I slightly prefer Angela's, even though Sasha's in more flexible. Her bodyline between the leg and back doesn't have that perfect C arch that Angela's has.

Although to be fair to Sasha, we are comparing just the basic layback position here, if it were a full-on layback spin with all of the features and level 4 criteria, she'd probably beat Angela hands down. But then of course I would bring Caroline Zhang into the discussion. ;)

floskate
12-30-2011, 09:55 AM
Sasha's is beautiful but Dorothy's is still better. Far more difficult to maintain such a great position and spin so quickly :) For all that preparation, I always expected Sasha's layback to have a bit more power to enhance the position even more.

gkelly
12-30-2011, 12:54 PM
So has the discussion moved on from the half-ass layback position and is now focused on who had the best full-ass layback position? :D

Technically I suppose a half-ass one would probably qualify as a sideways-leaning spin

Macassar88
12-30-2011, 04:26 PM
So has the discussion moved on from the half-ass layback position and is now focused on who had the best full-ass layback position? :D

Technically I suppose a half-ass one would probably qualify as a sideways-leaning spin
Tuktamisheva...

DarrellH
12-30-2011, 04:35 PM
There are also those that get so little arch to the back that it becomes more of a "Lay-neck" spin.

briancoogaert
12-30-2011, 04:48 PM
There are also those that get so little arch to the back that it becomes more of a "Lay-neck" spin.
Do you mean Laetitia Hubert in her latest years ? :cold:
(I love her)