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aliceanne
11-09-2011, 05:26 PM
Lovely!

Now I'm wondering why skaters don't include delayed axels at least in their exhibitions nowadays :cool:

Especially the one where they fully extend their free leg (not in a tuck position) at the height of the jump.

I remember seeing Fadeev doing twizzles in a sit spin position - it was in one of the Ice Wars - his Mephistopheles program. I tried to get my then-coach to teach it to me, but we couldn't figure out how he did it!

smarts1
11-09-2011, 08:04 PM
Do you mean her layover back sit? I thought the goal of any sit spin was to hit a shoot the duck position. I may be misunderstanding your post though...
I've always liked the triple flip after the half loop (triple lutz half loop triple flip). Anyone on ice doing a double loop that lands on the inside back edge of the other foot yet? (half loop with an extra rotation in it). How would it be judged? It's obviously harder than a half loop but what would happen in a three jump combo?

Yeah, I kind of had a brain fart when I wrote that, lol. I meant that one she does in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MYJm-snH0Q The very last sit spin variation.

gkelly
11-09-2011, 08:10 PM
Anyone on ice doing a double loop that lands on the inside back edge of the other foot yet? (half loop with an extra rotation in it). How would it be judged? It's obviously harder than a half loop but what would happen in a three jump combo?

I've never seen it done. It would count as a double loop (and would have before last year's rule changes as well), although I think it would be more difficult.

Coco
11-10-2011, 04:11 AM
gkelly!!! that made my day! you are the fount of all knowledge ;)

Seerek - you're right that there's no incentive to do 2-3 combinations, but I think if a skater is working towards a 3-3, the 2-3 makes a lot of sense to try in competition.

Kristi Y. used to do a 2f3t combo towards the end of her program. I think it helped her learn her 3-3.

gkelly
11-10-2011, 04:27 AM
Seerek - you're right that there's no incentive to do 2-3 combinations, but I think if a skater is working towards a 3-3, the 2-3 makes a lot of sense to try in competition.

Back in the 1990s I noticed that a number of Richard Callaghan's students used to do 2T+3T on occasion. I figured that was the reasoning (working up to 3-3).

briancoogaert
11-10-2011, 11:31 AM
Back in the 1990s I noticed that a number of Richard Callaghan's students used to do 2T+3T on occasion. I figured that was the reasoning (working up to 3-3).
Many others did it. Or at least Surya Bonaly used to do 2Toe/3Toe in the SP instead of 3Lutz/2Toe.

antmanb
11-11-2011, 10:56 AM
Lovely!

Now I'm wondering why skaters don't include delayed axels at least in their exhibitions nowadays :cool:

It's not a delayed axel but I remember Carolina Kostner doing a single axel in an exhibition where she kept her arms out instead of bringing them in.

Here it is at around 2min33 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGV5nV_h1ho

kukkura
11-11-2011, 07:16 PM
I think there were several women in the 6.0 era who had 2a-half loop-3s in their LP after Midori Ito did it in 1988. I know Alisa Drei did it a few times.

aftershocks
11-11-2011, 08:01 PM
It's not a delayed axel but I remember Carolina Kostner doing a single axel in an exhibition where she kept her arms out instead of bringing them in.

Here it is at around 2min33 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGV5nV_h1ho

Yes, that's a very pretty move by Carolina, right toward the end of the performance. Boy, she had so much talent (and the politics behind her, coming from Italy) and she was being set up for 2006 Olympics. Somehow, the pressure placed on her shoulders was too great, unsurprisingly, because what she lacked was the experience of excelling under pressure, plus she was still developing as a skater and needed more time to find her unique on-ice identity. Maybe she can pull it altogether this season. Maybe Alissa can as well. It will be interesting to see.

Coco
11-11-2011, 08:10 PM
I hope Carolina hangs on through Sochi and puts down two skates she can be proud of. Never been a huge fan of hers, but loved her programs last year. And I would so much rather see almost clean, well developed PROGRAMS, than 4:10 of telegraphed lutzes, flutzes, flips and lips.

Oops - thread drift!

OK...in Michelle's Taj Mahal program, she did a single salchow at some point as part of her choreography. If she were to skate this exact same program under COP, would that count as a jumping pass? Would it matter whether or not she'd included it in her planned program turned in prior to skating? I always loved, well, the whole program, but that little move was one of the things that made it special.

Bronxfan
11-11-2011, 10:56 PM
Katarina Witt used to do a double lutz - triple toe loop. She did that at the 1984 Olympics in her Long Program.

I also remember Witt doing a triple salchow - half loop - double flip. She did this at the 1987 Worlds and the 1988 Olympics (but it was better in 1987).

I haven't seen anyone do either of these combos lately.

briancoogaert
11-12-2011, 10:31 AM
It's not a delayed axel but I remember Carolina Kostner doing a single axel in an exhibition where she kept her arms out instead of bringing them in.

Here it is at around 2min33 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGV5nV_h1ho
Yeah ! It was really beautiful :)

floskate
11-12-2011, 11:58 AM
Katarina Witt used to do a double lutz - triple toe loop. She did that at the 1984 Olympics in her Long Program.

I also remember Witt doing a triple salchow - half loop - double flip. She did this at the 1987 Worlds and the 1988 Olympics (but it was better in 1987).

I haven't seen anyone do either of these combos lately.

Witt did 3sal -half loop-tap into 3 turn then double flip. That wouldn't count as a combo under CoP I don't think.

antmanb
11-14-2011, 12:00 PM
OK...in Michelle's Taj Mahal program, she did a single salchow at some point as part of her choreography. If she were to skate this exact same program under COP, would that count as a jumping pass? Would it matter whether or not she'd included it in her planned program turned in prior to skating?

I'm not sure it was technically intended to be a single salchow though because it was more a choreographic jump - from memory didn't have both arms up in the air and she landed back intentionally on both feet and went straight into more choreography. I doubt a technical specialist would call it as a salchow, and if they did it would get -GOE for the double footed landing.

briancoogaert
11-14-2011, 12:09 PM
OK...in Michelle's Taj Mahal program, she did a single salchow at some point as part of her choreography. If she were to skate this exact same program under COP, would that count as a jumping pass? Would it matter whether or not she'd included it in her planned program turned in prior to skating? I always loved, well, the whole program, but that little move was one of the things that made it special.
This ? (http://youtu.be/tE0Blj2A0x4?t=4m29s)
When you are a young skater, it's the kind of jump you do at the practices before attempting real jumps. ;)