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bardtoob
11-01-2011, 04:56 AM
. . . So not the same thing. Plus it was worlds, not a small grand prix event . . .

Then dude, why are freaking out so much about paraphrases from an article written during a small grand prix that a 14 year old WON in an October a couple of years away from the next Olympics. It's not like this is the GPF Winner and she is too young to go to the Olympics.

You're just too much right. IL for a while. TTYL.

shine
11-01-2011, 06:57 AM
I actually don't think thats where Tukt's good points end. A lot of people who have seen her live have said good things about her ability to perform and hit her music. I don't think she'll necessarily be a Cohen/Mao. But I think she could easily be developed into a Kim. artistically.

As if those were the only things that female skaters can ever hope to become.
No, I'd rather she developed into Elizaveta Tukhtamisheva.

Vash01
11-01-2011, 07:25 AM
I, for one, found FC's remarks refreshing and candid. I enjoy it when someone says it like they see it. And judging from the over 5000 views and 7 pages of posts, I don't think I'm alone.

There is a difference between being candid and bitter/biased. However, I think Caroll is none of these things. He is just being political, trying to put down a young skater who might be a threat to those he is coaching.

museksk8r
11-01-2011, 03:04 PM
As if those were the only things that female skaters can ever hope to become.
No, I'd rather she developed into Elizaveta Tukhtamisheva.

Totally agree! I swear we share a brain. :):P

Marco
11-01-2011, 03:35 PM
My take on Tuktamisheva: great jumps, too much arms, too little feet

kwanatic
11-01-2011, 05:04 PM
I echo everyone's sentiments who felt that Frank was being honest. I agreed with everything he said and comparing Liza T to Michelle?...has he ever compared Mirai to Michelle? I think that's (obviously) a very big compliment. And FYI, that "bat out of hell" comment was the same comment he used to describe Michelle back when he first acquired her as a student...definitely a compliment. ;)

Liza has several good points but that doesn't mean she is without weaknesses. At 14 years old, she's right where she needs to be. My hope is, like Frank said, is that she develops that maturity and artistry that is needed to really make her stand out. I like her for her solid technique and ability to perform to the crowd. That's about it right now.

Maybe in another year or so I'll be able to comment on her improved spins, better posture and lines, and her artistic abilities...right now, those things all need work.;)

os168
11-01-2011, 05:13 PM
Gosh reading this thread seems like Frank have committed some cardinal sin! Seriously...

Yeah he is a seasoned professional who have live and breathe this sport most of his life. likely more than a few decades more than most of us have been a fan of the sport. As such, of course he can be political, can be biased. He know the media game, and gave a measured complimentary remark to a rival, but at the same time there's no question which team he plays for.

But is this all new?

He was asked for a Frank Carroll opinion, he gave it good. Surely he is entitled to have an opinion - even you might disagree with it. He sure earned it!

risto1803
11-01-2011, 05:19 PM
There is a difference between being candid and bitter/biased. However, I think Caroll is none of these things. He is just being political, trying to put down a young skater who might be a threat to those he is coaching.

I totally agree. Instead of putting down a 14 old skater, maybe Caroll should learn how to teach his students to do a proper 3 axel, or a prober 3 lutz.

bardtoob
11-01-2011, 05:20 PM
He is just being political, trying to put down a young skater who might be a threat to those he is coaching.

That's it! The ultimate backhanded compliment and political maneuver. Frank wants Tuktamisheva to become the next Michelle Kwan! . . . so that the next 3 OGMs will be available for his students since, you know, Michelle Kwan didn't win the OGM :rofl:

query5
11-01-2011, 05:42 PM
frank wasn't being honest- or maybe he wants mirai to skate her best at nationals, not gp series. who knows. but since he didn't stick up for michelle and she didn't win when many people thought she should of, maybe he had to say something like that for elizaveta to maybe push mirai who know.
he stuck up for mirai with her juniorish skating.

ears younger skaters medaled -why , i can think of several reasons why.
i can also think of one major one why michelle didn't medal in 1995, win.

elizaveta skated young, not juniorish, mirai skated like a junior/thinking like a junior i don't which.

i do believe we have to wait to see how she(elizavetha) gets through puberty. but other young skaters won without pc/artistry;
did frank say anything about them-no . so who knows.

in fact when mirai won 2008 nationals she skated just like elizaveta did but with a few more mistakes. did frank say anything no-he stated she was senior like, when in fact juniorish-without maturity
i just think frank is frustrated that mirai isn't skating the way she is capable of.
she has been with him 3 years, 4 years on the senior gp circuit and she is still skating and or thinking like a junior-sorry my take.

mirai is capable of so much more, she doesn't showand or skate like it.

elizaveta shows what is capable of, and might become if she handles puberty and the following season in calm manner ignores alot of hype.

Cheylana
11-01-2011, 05:45 PM
in fact when mirai won 2008 nationals she skated just like elizaveta did but with a few more mistakes. did frank say anything no-he stated she was senior like, when in fact juniorish-without maturity

When did he say this? Frank wasn't coaching Mirai when she won 2008 Nationals.

query5
11-01-2011, 06:01 PM
no but from what i understand -he partially went to mirai based on the 2008 nationals -. how well she did--she won.
he doesn't have elizaveta either , but that didn't stop him from saying something either.
he didn't state who skated with maturity either at the 2008 nationals. i don't think he had a women skater in that event who was in the running, so i think that is why he didn't say anything at the 2008 nationals.-correct me if i am wrong-which i probably am.

when he saw mirai skate he looked at the possibilities , like elizaveta
i think he can't understand why mirai ( who has endless possiblites) is at wheredoes what she does, elizaveta did what she did . at the age where she is

he did have mirai at 15 in gp series. but as some stated.
he is entitled to his opinion, i should lighten up.

but this is my opinion, can see how people assume things differently.

PDilemma
11-01-2011, 07:08 PM
no but from what i understand -he partially went to mirai based on the 2008 nationals -. how well she did--she won.
he doesn't have elizaveta either , but that didn't stop him from saying something either.
he didn't state who skated with maturity either at the 2008 nationals. i don't think he had a women skater in that event who was in the running, so i think that is why he didn't say anything at the 2008 nationals.-correct me if i am wrong-which i probably am.

when he saw mirai skate he looked at the possibilities , like elizaveta
i think he can't understand why mirai ( who has endless possiblites) is at wheredoes what she does, elizaveta did what she did . at the age where she is

he did have mirai at 15 in gp series. but as some stated.
he is entitled to his opinion, i should lighten up.

but this is my opinion, can see how people assume things differently.

Your opinion is full of inaccuracies. Mirai went to Frank in May, 2009, having turned 16 the month before. There is also no evidence that Frank recruited her in any way, as you imply. And exactly how do you know what he was thinking when he agreed to coach her? :rolleyes:

skatesindreams
11-01-2011, 07:22 PM
It amazes me that so many people at FSU are able to know, without doubt, the thoughts and motivations of others.

OliviaPug
11-01-2011, 07:43 PM
:rofl: Sandra Bezic. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMpLejOZkm4#t=4m43s) :wuzrobbed wuzrobbed

Wow! She was a rock star even then ... loved the facial expressions :)

I thought Frank sounded like Frank, frankly. He's always been pretty gruff. Perhaps he shared more compliments than were printed, perhaps not. Either way, pretty much what I would expect from Frank Carroll.

Words are words.

Elizaveta will have plenty of them - good and bad - thrown her way if she continues to be a force in the world of figure skating. I'm sure she'd rather be talked about than not at this point. And comparisons to Kwan are pretty heady!

O-