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peibeck
10-14-2011, 09:56 PM
Yes, I think most judges could afford to spread their marks further for individual skaters. But I don't think the reasons they fail to do so are because they are officially advised not to.

Check out the protocols for Japan Open: http://www.skatingjapan.jp/

Judge #9 is using the components the way we want to see, right?

Yeah for judge #9. :cheer: Even if I don't necessarily agree with some of those marks, I get what I feel is an actual, more honest, perspective of that judge's opinion.

And I agree, I don't believe the judge are advised not to spread out their marks, but there must be some pattern of fear (from the ISU or their own federation) which prevent most of them from marking competitions like this judge did. :confused: Otherwise it just looks like after this long with CoP they don't know what they are doing, which makes the judging look even more suspect.

overedge
10-14-2011, 10:05 PM
Regarding home country bias there are academic studies (eg http://www.dartmouth.edu/~ericz/transparency.pdf) based on economic theories.

Just because a study is academic, or based on theories, doesn't make it a valid study. This study has methodogical problems in that, as far as I can tell, it is not comparing evaluations of the same skater in all three periods that are sampled. The judge could be giving the skaters from the same country as them different marks because they are different skaters, who are performing better or worse than the other skaters from the same country. I get what this study is trying to do, but I don't think it makes a very convincing case that home country bias exists, or that the effect of any home country bias has changed under different judging systems.

Beefcake
10-14-2011, 10:52 PM
Not even Kwan herself could have overcome "No" in this poll.

Maofan7
10-14-2011, 11:10 PM
90% - not bad

Ziggy
10-14-2011, 11:47 PM
What a silly question.

Politics can never be eradicated and it will always be present. Regardless of the system employed.

I also don't understand why 2002 Olympics are mentioned as an example, given you could very convincigly argue that B/S were better.
http://www.frogsonice.com/skateweb/articles/slc-pairs.shtml

Vash01
10-15-2011, 12:51 AM
What a silly question.

Politics can never be eradicated and it will always be present. Regardless of the system employed.

I also don't understand why 2002 Olympics are mentioned as an example, given you could very convincigly argue that B/S were better.
http://www.frogsonice.com/skateweb/articles/slc-pairs.shtml

ITA. There were politics before and after 2002 Olympics. There will always be politics in FS, and in other sports that are judged, and not measured with a clock.

Ziggy
10-15-2011, 12:55 AM
ITA. There were politics before and after 2002 Olympics. There will always be politics in FS, and in other sports that are judged, and not measured with a clock.

I have this fantasy of figure skating performances being measured by a super complex computer program measuring everything.

But even then there'd be some politics involved in how certain things are weighed and why and then there's this very important update being uploaded just before Worlds, etc. ;)

PeterG
10-15-2011, 06:09 AM
I'd love to know who voted "Yes" :slinkaway

Well, there is one poster on this board with the username OctCinq, but I'm not sure if that means anything...


I also don't understand why 2002 Olympics are mentioned as an example, given you could very convincigly argue that B/S were better.
http://www.frogsonice.com/skateweb/articles/slc-pairs.shtml

Well thanks for bringing that up. Were Bereshnaya & Sikharulidze or Sale & Pelletier better? Have we had the opportunity on this board to ponder this question yet?

Aussie Willy
10-15-2011, 09:30 AM
Actually after today I discovered bribery and corruption are alive in skating. Before I was about to judge a competition one of the skaters offered to give me chocolate if I gave her good marks.

Maofan7
10-15-2011, 09:40 AM
Actually after today I discovered bribery and corruption are alive in skating. Before I was about to judge a competition one of the skaters offered to give me chocolate if I gave her good marks.

:kickass:

Good one!:)

bardtoob
10-15-2011, 09:55 AM
Actually after today I discovered bribery and corruption are alive in skating. Before I was about to judge a competition one of the skaters offered to give me chocolate if I gave her good marks.

:lol: Did you make her the Kostner of the competition? ;)

Aussie Willy
10-15-2011, 10:33 AM
:lol: Did you make her the Kostner of the competition? ;)
:lol: Well I wasn't needed to judge that division. We had more than enough judges so I got to have a break. So her efforts of bribery were in vain.

Actually the skaters know me quite well and joke with me quite often about giving me chocolate. However as I said to a girl's mum today I would never say to a skater "well if you give me something..." even as a joke because you never know who is listening.

escaflowne9282
10-15-2011, 10:58 AM
Well, there is one poster on this board with the username OctCinq, but I'm not sure if that means anything...



Well thanks for bringing that up. Were Bereshnaya & Sikharulidze or Sale & Pelletier better? Have we had the opportunity on this board to ponder this question yet?

:rofl:

Hmmm, why couldn't that Olympics be like 1994 where there was no controversey at all and the results are never debated?

briancoogaert
10-15-2011, 12:18 PM
Not even Kwan herself could have overcome "No" in this poll.
This is because she wasn't an option :P

Beefcake
10-15-2011, 07:43 PM
I stand firmly :cold: behind by my pronouncement!



I mean, :shuffle: we'll never know, now will we?