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Marco
11-09-2011, 01:56 AM
The Chinese federation bosses were quoted saying to the media that they'll definitely send Nan Song to a top choreographer for next season, and that so far they haven't done so because the skaters hadn't achieved notable results, and that top choreographers don't put much energy/effort into no-name skaters even if you pay the $$$. No mention of whether Yan Han will get a non-Chinese choreographer though. Probably not...

Zijun Li, Kexin Zhang, and Bingwa Geng all had Karen Kwan as choreographer last year, and David Wilson this year. Maybe it was part of the deal in hiring Mingzhu Li -- luckily they didn't have to get a GP medal before getting foreign choreographers. But they only get to spend a few days in NA a year, not long enough to really work on their transitions or basics. I think Li just has a lot of natural talent with skating skills, as Chen Lu did with jumps back in the days.

The big boss may have a point there if he means David Wilson or Lori Nichol. They are just too busy and have their priority for the elites. But then again not event the best choreographer can work his magic if they only spend a couple of days on the programs with him.

Someone like Tom Dickson or even Philip Mills might work. Just fly them in for like 2 or 3 weeks. Can benefit so many girls (and guys) in one go.

Ziggy
11-09-2011, 02:18 AM
Yes, definitely get somebody who isn't a top name but creates good work. And fly them in to work with a number of skaters.

Cheaper and you get more out of it.

I mean if skaters get flown to US to work with David or Lori (most of whose work is shit anyway :P) for 2 or 3 days, it's a waste of money and a waste of time. Nowhere near enough time to work on a program.

Marco
11-09-2011, 02:59 AM
Exactly. Fly the choreographer in. Just for the top 3 guys and gals.

The return plane fare plus accomodation for one or two weeks in China for 2 weeks is probably still cheaper than the plane fare plus accomodation plus ice time in NA. Plus they wouldn't have to fight for ice time in China and can make the most out of the trip.

rouge
11-09-2011, 05:13 AM
According to Chinese fan forums, Bo Luan, the coach of S/H and Y/J, apparently emphasizes only throws and twists in her training. Fans who went to see them at their training base saw that nobody out of the 10.5 (!) pairs there, all taught by Luan, were working on stroking or single jumps. She also punishes disobedient students by forbidding them to get ice time! Wenjing Sui was off ice for over 2 months over the summer for this reason. And another girl hasn't been allowed back on ice since 2009. Given how much Sui needs to work on her skating skills and all the rest, being forced off the ice for months at a time seems like the worst possible method! Especially now that she's hitting puberty...

:eek: It sounds terrible.
It seems while the younger coaches focus more on basics and choreography and show more respect to their skaters, the older generation unfortunately has not changed their mind.
As for choreography, I think the state-sponsored sports system is still dominating in China. As the federation pays most of the money, it surely wants some remarkable results in return. So the coaches who have achieved a lot in the past, like Bin Yao or Mingzhu Li, may get much more resources for his/her camp. It's kind of "safe investment". Maybe to hire a foreign choreographer (+flights, accomodations, etc.) means a big expense for younger coaches and their students. And among chinese choreographers, Zhang Wei is really outstanding, but others seem not wiser than their predecessors. For young skaters, they don't have too many options.

letsskate
11-09-2011, 05:30 AM
They are Senior age-eligible from:

Han Yan - 2011/2012
Zijun Li - 2012/2013
He Zhang - 2012/2013

Boyang Jin - we don't know what his "official" ;) birthday is

So we'll see Han Yan at Nice worlds next year? or he'll just wait one more year?

Marco
11-09-2011, 06:47 AM
So we'll see Han Yan at Nice worlds next year? or he'll just wait one more year?

I think they will send Nan Song to Worlds instead and try to fight for a 2nd spot. Han Yan wil likely return to Jr Worlds.

Eislauffan
11-09-2011, 07:43 AM
Sorry, I don't believe this story of punishing Wenjing Sui by not letting her on the ice for two months during the summer. No coach would be so unprofessional and Federation officials wouldn't allow this to happen either. Maybe Wenjing Sui was not allowed on the ice for two days if there is something to this story.
They started doing the quad twist again and this time it was working for them, they must have trained it over the summer.

xy3026rosa
11-09-2011, 08:31 AM
Sorry, I don't believe this story of punishing Wenjing Sui by not letting her on the ice for two months during the summer. No coach would be so unprofessional and Federation officials wouldn't allow this to happen either. Maybe Wenjing Sui was not allowed on the ice for two days if there is something to this story.
They started doing the quad twist again and this time it was working for them, they must have trained it over the summer.
This is true,some Chinese ice fan said LuanBo in order to punish Sui so she didn't let her on the ice ,go home and write checks add up for 5 months.:(

Eislauffan
11-09-2011, 11:39 AM
This is true,some Chinese ice fan said LuanBo in order to punish Sui so she didn't let her on the ice ,go home and write checks add up for 5 months.:(

You report what "some Chinese fan" said, but this is not a reliable source to me. Is there any proof for these claims other than hearsay?

Hedwig
11-09-2011, 11:54 AM
You report what "some Chinese fan" said, but this is not a reliable source to me. Is there any proof for these claims other than hearsay?

It would be really interesting to get reliable information about this.
Now that China is so much on the rise, do you think that there will be any travel journeys done across the trainings centers like you do for the US and Russia?

johndockley92
11-09-2011, 12:58 PM
Sorry, I don't believe this story of punishing Wenjing Sui by not letting her on the ice for two months during the summer. No coach would be so unprofessional and Federation officials wouldn't allow this to happen either. Maybe Wenjing Sui was not allowed on the ice for two days if there is something to this story.
They started doing the quad twist again and this time it was working for them, they must have trained it over the summer.

Twist is one of the easiest elements to train off the ice :P

Ziggy
11-09-2011, 01:52 PM
And among chinese choreographers, Zhang Wei is really outstanding, but others seem not wiser than their predecessors.

Elvin Wong's work for He Zhang is very good. Hopefully he'll get more work now.


So we'll see Han Yan at Nice worlds next year? or he'll just wait one more year?

He can compete at 2012 Worlds. But there is only one spot and I am pretty sure that Nan Song will get it, while Han Yan gets one of the Junior Worlds spots, as Marco said.


Sorry, I don't believe this story of punishing Wenjing Sui by not letting her on the ice for two months during the summer. No coach would be so unprofessional and Federation officials wouldn't allow this to happen either. Maybe Wenjing Sui was not allowed on the ice for two days if there is something to this story.

I know of a :rolleyes: Polish coach that often punishes their skaters by keeping them off the ice but even they wouldn't be that stupid to keep their best skaters off ice for two months. It does sound rather unbelievable.

Seerek
11-09-2011, 02:13 PM
It is interesting 30 years later having Bin Yao and Luan Bo having "rival" training centres.

sharonz
11-09-2011, 05:22 PM
It's really nice to see someone bring this topic up again :lol: Thanks to Song's brilliant performance.

However, I'm still more impressive with the juniors. Most excited news to me is that Jin Boyang attemped 4T at gala:eek:. Even he failed, it is still unbelievable for a young boy at his age to give a try. He actually landed one at the practice. It's a pity that he was not sent to JGP this season, but I kind of understand it. China have 1 spot per competation, totally 7 spots. And they skip 3 competations due to NC. They also failed to get the visa for Estonia. That left no spot for Jin, since Yan and Zhang get 2 spots and Liu for 1. Jin is unbelievably talented for jumps but still a lot to work on SS. Next season's JGP will be very exciting;)

As for Sui's punishment, it was posted by a fan who knows them in person. She also posted some inside information before. Whatever the cause, Sui has been off-ice for about 2 months. SH re-started the training right before ArOI this summer.

There are always some interesting news/information of skaters on Chinese board. Yan seems to be quite different off-ice, having a strong personality. There is no athletes in his family. His parents didn't want to him do FS, the only supported member was his grandfather. Zijun is coming from a comparatively wealthy family, and her parents have spent a great number on her skating before she entered the national team. Her mother also quit job and move to Beijing to take care of her.

some interesting pics from weibo.
Yan and Yuzuru (http://ww2.sinaimg.cn/large/40c5c55djw1dmuad7qem3j.jpg)
Yan and Zhang (http://ww3.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/64e75ccdgw1dmv774eu42j.jpg)
quite cool pic of Yan at COC gala (http://ww1.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/742a5fe8jw1dmvha9dkxaj.jpg)
Jin Boyang surrongded by Russian ladies (http://imgsrc.baidu.com/forum/pic/item/d788d43f8794a4c2b314d16d0ef41bd5ad6e3944.jpg)
Zijun's dog (http://ww1.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/71eb2af7jw1dhu2vlme35j.jpg) Is this the same kinds as mao's?
Zijun in Canada (http://ww4.sinaimg.cn/bmiddle/71eb2af7jw1dhozmttp3pj.jpg)

Ziggy
11-09-2011, 06:20 PM
And they skip 3 competations due to NC.

NC?


They also failed to get the visa for Estonia.

How could that happen? Sounds like a big mess up on the Chinese federation's part.


As for Sui's punishment, it was posted by a fan who knows them in person. She also posted some inside information before. Whatever the cause, Sui has been off-ice for about 2 months. SH re-started the training right before ArOI this summer.

If true, that's absolutely shocking.


There are always some interesting news/information of skaters on Chinese board.

Thank you very much for the information you've shared so far. We'd really appreciate more inside info in the future. :)