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bartek
08-12-2011, 02:00 AM
Tara Lipinski had a flutz. Is she not "technically competent?"

Hehe, now, that's a difficult question. Even though she had a terrible flutz I'd say she was "technically competent". I made video with her combos as well and learnt that MAJORITY of her super difficult 3Lo+3Lo combos were fully rotated what's in my opinion really amazing, also taking into consideration her poor height. But in case of Kimmie, she really had serious technical problems, most of these combos underrotated and they weren't as difficult as Tara's ones. Apart from that she had her toe-axel and lip. She had great technique on her axel and salchow though. I'm going to post videos with her triple axels attempts soon by the way :).

paskatefan
08-12-2011, 12:00 PM
Uh, you don't have to like the skater in the video, but why don't you show some respect to the person who took the time to compile all of these clips? :rolleyes:


You know, I do those videos with triple-triples or quads because I like to have them all in one place, one after another, just to watch them, admire and compare. When I did the first one (Irina Slutskaya) I thought that maybe some people would like to watch it as well, just because it's nice to see all the times Miki Ando went for quad or Shizuka threw efortlessly her triple-triple-triples. If you have any problem with me posting these videos here I don't have to do it, I can very well keep them for myself, no problem. But many peaople thank for those videos, request next skaters and are happy to watch them. I'll go for majority (you're the first one with such a comment) and will keep posting them here until more users will express their disapproval.


Oh, okay. ;)

You're welcome. I appreciate all of the hard work you put into those 3-3 videos!


I like the videos- please keep posting them! Even if someone isn't the most artistic skater to grace the ice, technical competency is always appreciated in my camp. I prefer the whole package, but I'm as much of an artistic fan (I'm a total Sasha whore" as I am an athletic fan (Kimmie fan girl). :) Don't listen to the haters- if they don't like it, then they don't have to read the thread, now, do they? :)

:encore:

Vash01
08-14-2011, 04:31 AM
This was the ONE time I thought Cohen really, legitimately had a shot at the world championship if she just skated normally. (2004 was Arakawa's year and 2005 was Slutskaya's.) Even with her usual FS performance w/fall I think that would have been enough. However, her heart clearly wasn't in it and she should have skipped it. People say Rochette should have given this year's Worlds a shot but who's to say she wouldn't have struggled as well? Look at Yuna Kim...even the "Queen" isn't immune to the common struggles of returning to competition after extended time away.

Meissner took advantage of probably the weakest ladies field at Worlds in a long time and couldn't have chosen a better time to peak. She was clean but imo that was about it. Good enough since no one else brought it.

I'd have that win as the biggest shocker in the time I've been watching skating. Even bigger than Hughes' win at Olys imo.

I think Cohen was in a great position to win in both 2004 and 2006 at worlds, particularly 2006. I thought there was no way she could lose in 2006, but she did. That itself was a shock to me. I don't know which win was more shocking- Hughes in 2002 or Kimmie's in 2006. I would have to go with Hughes as more shocking, as the field included Kwan and Slutskaya. Kimmie's competition was Cohen and Suguri.

Talking of 2004, Arakawa had not done that well that season, but a switch to Tarasova toward the end of the season seemed to boost her confidence. Still, I never thought she would win, before the competition began. I thought it would be Kwan or Cohen. Slutskaya totally dominated 2005 though, so her win was not a shock.

RD
08-14-2011, 04:36 AM
I figured Cohen would find a way to mess up '06 (check archives)...given that she has lost to Suguri in the past, I'd figure she'd lose to her again...but I didn't factor KM into the equation at all.

But she should have followed the other Oly medalists and sat out that Worlds. Clearly she didn't want to be there/didn't want it enough.

Vash01
08-14-2011, 04:38 AM
I figured Cohen would find a way to mess up '06 (check archives)...given that she has lost to Suguri in the past, I'd figure she'd lose to her again...but I didn't factor KM into the equation at all.

But she should have followed the other Oly medalists and sat out that Worlds. Clearly she didn't want to be there/didn't want it enough.

Either she thought it would be easy to win, or she underestimated how fatigued she was from the Olympics.

RD
08-14-2011, 04:41 AM
^ or maybe all of the above.

VIETgrlTerifa
08-14-2011, 08:18 AM
I agree with Vash01 that 2004 was not "Arakawa's year." Cohen won her QR and led in the SP against other clean performances, and Arakawa had an inconsistent season with Suguri winning the GPF, Kwan winning Nationals with 6.0s and Miki Ando was coming out of the Junior ranks blazing. So, it was far from being anyone's year really. I do think had Cohen not fallen out of her last jump and performed her routine with more security and confidence, she might've pulled off an LP win despite Arakawa having the skate of her career (at the time and arguably her whole career) with two 3/3 considering that Cohen took some ordinals from Arakawa and Kwan nearly beat Arakawa in the LP with 5 triples and one of the simplest routines of her career (yes, I know she got a presentation mark boost with the streaker and it being the last major competition using the 6.0 system).

LilJen
08-14-2011, 06:26 PM
Aw, Kimmie. I really appreciated her warmth and good attitude. Her last couple of seasons were incredibly difficult as she went through physical changes and injuries, but her artistry (airplane arms in particular) improved a great deal before she retired. Wishing her all the best for her future!

RD
08-14-2011, 06:36 PM
I agree with Vash01 that 2004 was not "Arakawa's year." Cohen won her QR and led in the SP against other clean performances, and Arakawa had an inconsistent season with Suguri winning the GPF, Kwan winning Nationals with 6.0s and Miki Ando was coming out of the Junior ranks blazing. So, it was far from being anyone's year really. I do think had Cohen not fallen out of her last jump and performed her routine with more security and confidence, she might've pulled off an LP win despite Arakawa having the skate of her career (at the time and arguably her whole career) with two 3/3 considering that Cohen took some ordinals from Arakawa and Kwan nearly beat Arakawa in the LP with 5 triples and one of the simplest routines of her career (yes, I know she got a presentation mark boost with the streaker and it being the last major competition using the 6.0 system).

I don't remember Cohen falling in that routine- I do remember a couple of stumbles and perhaps one of the flattest performances I've seen from her. There was no attack, no will. A complete contrast to her SP. Even if it was clean I'm not completely convinced she would have won.

However, at 2006 worlds- even if Cohen had a repeat of Torino in the FS it might have been enough to eek out the win. Suguri was (also) underwhelming and Meissner was all jumps.

Triple Butz
08-14-2011, 10:48 PM
I don't remember Cohen falling in that routine- I do remember a couple of stumbles and perhaps one of the flattest performances I've seen from her. There was no attack, no will. A complete contrast to her SP. Even if it was clean I'm not completely convinced she would have won.

However, at 2006 worlds- even if Cohen had a repeat of Torino in the FS it might have been enough to eek out the win. Suguri was (also) underwhelming and Meissner was all jumps.

TVG said "falling out"

leafygreens
08-15-2011, 10:28 PM
It was Cohen's to lose and as per usual, she lost it. I was actually more shocked with Cohen's meltdown than I was with Kimmie winning.

This particular meltdown was blamed on exhaustion after the Olympics... :rolleyes:

leafygreens
08-15-2011, 10:41 PM
I don't know which win was more shocking- Hughes in 2002 or Kimmie's in 2006. I would have to go with Hughes as more shocking, as the field included Kwan and Slutskaya. Kimmie's competition was Cohen and Suguri.

Yes but that's assuming that Kimmie and Sarah were equal skaters. I don't think so... Sarah was much stronger. The most surprising thing was that Kwan melted, not that Sarah did well. It is definitely shocking that Kimmie won that worlds, *however* the two competitions with Kimmie and Sarah cannot really be compared (other than the underdog won.) Because 02 had a strong field and 06 had a very weak field.

VIETgrlTerifa
08-15-2011, 10:43 PM
I agree that the most surprising thing about the 2002 Olympics was that Kwan and Slutskaya skated well below their standard. I remember thinking that Sarah Hughes gave a great bronze medal performance right after she had skated in SLC thinking that Kwan and Slutskaya were going to duke it out a la 2001 Worlds.

Maximillian
08-16-2011, 12:09 AM
Thanks so much for posting those, but I must say that about halfway through all those toe axels started to make me itchy. So much bad technique over and over again makes me uncomfortable.

Seerek
08-16-2011, 04:25 AM
I'd have to go back to the protocols, but compared to the mistakes in Torino, Sasha Cohen's mistakes in the Calgary Worlds LP were more costly (in points) than at the Olympics.

I think 3F+COMBO might have not even existed back then if you didn't even attempt a combination for the repeated triple attempt (so perhaps invalid element?). There was also an omission of the 3 salchow at the back end of the 3-3 sequence. Considering there were two other errors in the program, I'm thinking that Sasha could have gotten away with 1-2 errors and still won Worlds that year....but she didn't.